Lord Warwyck Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 there were many events that had decisive tide turning impacts on the war of five kings or the dynastic politics like the battle of stalingrad changed the game in WW2. Which event had the single greatest impact? 1. Whispering woods: Ensured that tywin didn't get a easy victory and prevented him from going into war with renly and the tyrells. Ensured that there were no hostilities between lannister and tyrell. 2. Battle of the blackwater: destroyed stannis's army and fleet effectively turning him into an irrelevant variable for the time being. Ensured lannister victory in the first round of the war. Cemented the lannister-tyrell alliance. 3. The Red wedding: removed tywin's greatest enemy for good. Secured the crown for joffrey. Eliminated all military resistance of significance to tywin. But however whether this is indisputedly the most tide turning event is doubtful as robb was already outnumbered 3 to1 by the tyrell-lannister army with a treacherous bolton and karstark lords. 4. Tywin lannister's death: Crippled the power of house lannister. Kevan despite being able did not have the legal authority over cersei. Tywin was the only one who had the check on the queen regent. No other person would've been able to extract co operation and peace from the reach and western lords as tywin did. And following tywin's death the lannister grand political infrastructure fell apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roddy the Ruin Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Red Wedding- I don't look at the world in the same way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khal BlackfyreO Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Definitely when Arya met Hot Pie... Epic ramifications right there...epic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davos's Missing Fingers Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Robert dying is probably the most important event, as just about everything that's happened since is a direct result of that. There's a quote the TV show used that I loved during Season 1, when Cersei and Robert are having a tension filled dinner and Cersei asks him what holds the realm together and Robert unknowingly provides the right answer in the form of sarcasm with, "Our marriage." Maybe he was wiser than we all thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roddy the Ruin Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Definitely when Arya met Hot Pie... Epic ramifications right there...epic.NO GENDRYXARYA FOREVA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joluoto2 Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Ned's execution. The main reason a peace treaty between Starks and Lannisters became impossible, also probably influenced the Northern bannermen to crown Rob, instead of trying to ally with one of the Baratheon bros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Boar of Gore Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Birth of the dragons changed things quite a bit. And the reappearance (?) of the Others right in the first book's prologue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khal BlackfyreO Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Kidding aside, I think Tywin´s death is truly the biggest turning point, though all your points get an honorable mention. Tywin is the linchpin for so many of the Lannister schemes, not even as the schemer himself, but through his very presence. So much of what he did was based upon people's fear of him or hopes to get something from him, now that he is gone, the conductor has left the orchestra, and he has no replacement. Most of this is conjecture, of course, but outside of it serving their own interests (Boltons), I can´t see many of the alliances Tywin built lasting much longer. I think Varys orchestrated or encouraged most of the Lannister power moves anyway, because having a dysfunctional family at the helm served his interests of conquest by an outside power. I think Tywin as a leader was an easy target to take down when his dirty secrets and machinations were brought out into the light, and his long term legacy was never going to be that great anyway considering his methods. Kevan was the only Lannister that could have put things back together, and we know what happened to him. The point is, if the Lannisters fall from power, it will be because Tywin wasn´t there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Boar of Gore Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Renly's assassination turned things around for Stannis and saved the Lannisters' collective arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkaggCannibal Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Battle of Blackwater I think, it decided the Lannister victory way more than the red wedding (Northern loss seemed inevitable at that time), and the whispering woods was nice but at the end of the day just a delay for the Lannister victory in the end. Tywin dead is important but really it's the fall-out (Cersei getting power, Jaime and Kevan refusing it) that makes it so important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guess who's back Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 The birth of dany`s dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 The Others are coming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jairion Lannister Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 So far the Red Wedding in a way. It may be negated once the other Stark kids are found, but at the time it was a brutal massacre which essentially, to everyone else not in the know, wiped out a great house which had been in it's position for thousands of years. Other deaths were big, but great lords come and go and most houses survive. Only Tywin's death can be seen as big on a massive scale because it can lead to the downfall of the rest of his house, but even then the Lannisters could probably survive, whereas at the time to the RW basically wiped out the Starks bar one or two girls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khal BlackfyreO Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 The Others are coming And the Grumpkins are right on their coattails so.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeRhaegar Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Theon taking Winterfell Birth of the dragons Golden Company landing in Westeros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 And the Grumpkins are right on their coattails so.... wut? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avlonnic Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Excellent thought-provoking question - there are just so many game-changers in this series. GRRM seems to paint a Chaos Theory mural with every action or inaction producing myriad unforeseen results across the Westerosi universe. Eventually, I hope it will be the finding and keeping of the direpups in the snow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briantw Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 I'd have to say Renly's death. If he stays alive and isn't distracted and killed by Stannis, I think he takes King's Landing. Tyrion wouldn't have had the time to prepare for his assault had he focused on war rather than games, and much of Tyrion's ultimate plan assumed an attack by sea rather than by land, which meant Stannis played right into his hands. Renly's death also united the Tyrells with the Lannisters, primarily because they had nowhere else to go (although Robb, had he been smarter, could have taken advantage here). Theon taking Winterfell is an underrated one as well, as it essentially led to the series of events (Bran and Rickon "dying," Cat freeing Jaime, Robb marrying Jeyne Westerling, Roose turning on Robb, etc.) that ended in Robb's downfall. None of that happens if Theon doesn't take Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiasyd Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Ned's execution. The main reason a peace treaty between Starks and Lannisters became impossible, also probably influenced the Northern bannermen to crown Rob, instead of trying to ally with one of the Baratheon bros. I agree. We're still seeing rippling effects of Ned's death in book 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lyman Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 The Purple Wedding. Its the reason Tyrion was in the cells to begin with. It has led to not just Tywins death but also Oberyn's death. amongst other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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