So what is HBO's strategy on the Jon Snow question?

[kissdbyfire]

Thx! my list overlaps pretty much, but have not considered Brienne and Davos

Sharesie! :p

Who did you pick instead?

[Sword Swallower]

Are we really sure that in that formula of R+L=J, that the R does not stand for Robert?

Was wondering the same.

[Xarkar]

Also I forgot Littelfinger and Varys.

[Hajk]

Just because the show isn't every book readers perfect vision of this story made flesh and come to life, doesn't mean it's broken. It's HBO's number one show.

I know this might sound silly, but the world of TV production (especially on shows like this) are very professional operations. HBO is a subscription TV channel that has gone into producing their own content. HBO is not a producing studio itself. It doesn't have a "backlot." It hires production companies. Professional ones. HBO is not one of the producers of GoT. It hired Big Head/Little Head to produce the show. And GRRM didn't just sell the rights to the story without him.

Why would HBO try to intervene in the most successful show they've ever had? D&D are obviously doing something right. Why would they fix something that's clearly not broken.

BH/LH & HBO all know waaay more about season 6 and Jon's fate than any of us here.

It would be silly for any suit at HBO to try to "intervene" and inject their own will over this storyline. If they did, they'd likely find it hard in future to have this level of awesome content if they get the reputation of randomly "intervening" in shows they didn't create themselves. It's why HBO would never step in and extend GoT past it's natural end, just because it's successful. (It's why HBO is in development with GRRM for two more shows.)

I'm also pretty sure that GRRM has several riders in his contract stipulating he has some say in what happens to his material, after all, he's still Co-Executive Producer. HBO can't just come in and change things even if they want to.

They're also well aware that the show is based on original material by GRRM. D&D have constant contact with GRRM, who has already given them a detailed outline (and probably lots more unreleased chapters) about where the story goes from here.

The sheer amount of contracts signed for one TV show the size of GoT would melt your face off. Plus, the DGA, WGA, and PGA all have rules in place that prohibit interference and random changes of scripts on this type of show. (Much different for non-union "reality" shows.)

But in that case, wouldn't D&D be free to kill Jon off if that was what they wanted to do even if it may hit HBO's bottom line?

The initial argument that started this line of discussion was that it would be financially ridiculous for HBO to allow D&D to kill off one of their major stars in this manner. One of the things I said in response was that this would depend on how much creative controls the D's had. You seem to have bolstered that point.

[Xarkar]

But in that case, wouldn't D&D be free to kill Jon off if that was what they wanted to do even if it may hit HBO's bottom line?

The initial argument that started this line of discussion was that it would be financially ridiculous for HBO to allow D&D to kill off one of their major stars in this manner. One of the things I said in response was that this would depend on how much creative controls the D's had. You seem to have bolstered that point.

As per GRRM, D&D seem to be free to do what they want with the series.

However, I would hope that even D&D realize straying to far from the books, would be bad.

Killing Jon, is no different than killing Dany.

Neither of their stories is over.

[adsf45ds]

Jon's whole story is his parentage, and it is this parentage that puts him at the center of ASOIAF's two major conflicts - the power struggles and wars between the kingdoms, and the struggle against the Others....nobody, even Dany is as central IMO. After all, we know what question GRRM asked D&D. It is possible then if they are going to really kill Jon in the show, then they may give his role over to Dany, while Jon may be resurrected in the books.

[Xarkar]

Jon's whole story is his parentage, and it is this parentage that puts him at the center of ASOIAF's two major conflicts - the power struggles and wars between the kingdoms, and the struggle against the Others....nobody, even Dany is as central IMO. After all, we know what question GRRM asked D&D. It is possible then if they are going to really kill Jon in the show, then they may give his role over to Dany, while Jon may be resurrected in the books.

Exactly

The one questions GRRM asks D&D was about Jon's Parentage.

Basically to see if they were reading the books, or REALLY reading the books.

If Jon is dead, then his parentage really doesnt matter as the only thing they would give him is a possible claim to the throne, ability to warg, or ride dragons etc. If he is dead who is parents are dont matter.

There is no way GRRM lays so many breadcrumbs, asks D&D about his parents, and it turns out that story finishes without conclusion.

[Ben H'gahr]

Sharesie! :P

Who did you pick instead?

Being quantitatively inclined, I'd say:

Tyrion - Jon - Arya - Daenerys - Sansa - Cate - Bran - Jaime - Edd - Theon - Davos - Cersei

since they have the most POV-chapters.

[kissdbyfire]

Being quantitatively inclined, I'd say:

Tyrion - Jon - Arya - Daenerys - Sansa - Cate - Bran - Jaime - Edd - Theon - Davos - Cersei

since they have the most POV-chapters.

Edd? Not Dolorous Edd, much as I love him... I assume you meant Ned? :)

[Ben H'gahr]

Yes of course - EDDARK STARK, that's the guy :)

[lakin1013]

According to Emilia Clarke, she judges Jon's return as 50/50. If HBO's strategy was to lie, then lie some more, perhaps there should have been a memo to the cast. Of course, on the other hand, cast members offering their opinions gives a certain unknown to the Snow death, as in Look, we're guessing, just like the viewers at home.

Game of Thrones star Emilia Clarke admits 50/50 chance....

[Many Faced Dude]

A woman named Clarke has no idea at all, just like the viewers at home, a dude knows that the contract of man named Kit is about 7 seasons long.

A dude wonders that all people still think tWoW would not be already finished. a dude knows about marketing strategy.

[Ben H'gahr]

A woman named Clarke has no idea at all, just like the viewers at home, a dude knows that the contract of man named Kit is about 7 seasons long.

A dude wonders that all people still think tWoW would not be already finished. a dude knows about marketing strategy.

supposedly this contract information is wrong

[aryahull]

I totally believed he was dead after seeing the EW interviews just after ep 10 but now I'm not so sure. If they wanted to put any doubts to rest then they should have made their cast all say the same thing. It makes little sense to keep the ambiguity going. They may have massive numbers watching that first episode but as soon as they burn him the same conversations start again. Surely at the start of a season you want the water cooler conversations to be about the new cast and the new plot lines. Instead they will have a load of news articles and Twitter chatter about Jon. Again.

But I could be wrong.

[Ben H'gahr]

I totally believed he was dead after seeing the EW interviews just after ep 10 but now I'm not so sure. If they wanted to put any doubts to rest then they should have made their cast all say the same thing. It makes little sense to keep the ambiguity going. They may have massive numbers watching that first episode but as soon as they burn him the same conversations start again. Surely at the start of a season you want the water cooler conversations to be about the new cast and the new plot lines. Instead they will have a load of news articles and Twitter chatter about Jon. Again.

But I could be wrong.

Also: why their absence from ComicCon? One could say "they have something better to do" but no, they don't. They didn't have in previous years and why should they this year. They marketing opportunity at CC is too big to be left out. They do not show up b/c they want to avoid being asked tricky questions.

[Hajk]

I totally believed he was dead after seeing the EW interviews just after ep 10 but now I'm not so sure. If they wanted to put any doubts to rest then they should have made their cast all say the same thing. It makes little sense to keep the ambiguity going. They may have massive numbers watching that first episode but as soon as they burn him the same conversations start again. Surely at the start of a season you want the water cooler conversations to be about the new cast and the new plot lines. Instead they will have a load of news articles and Twitter chatter about Jon. Again.

But I could be wrong.

I don't think that problem was avoidable in any way. If the whole cast had unanimously said that he was dead the fans would simply have argued that they had been instructed to do so and that this was just part of the well orchestrated cover-up/conspiracy. In fact some may have argued that the fact that such uniform instructions had been given to the cast was evidence that something big was in the works as this is rarely ever done.

If they had stabbed him multiply, beheaded him, burnt the body, and scattered the ashes all over the North, the fans would have argued that they had tried to make his death look so final and decisive because they wanted to bury the surprise resurrection really really deep and didn't want to ruin the surprise.

Frankly, at this point it seems to me like whatever the evidence the conclusion drawn from it is the same: Jon is coming back.

At this point I wouldn't be surprised if a spoiler leaked that Euron was sacking Oldtown in season 6 and fans concluded: This must be related to Samwell's storyline. He will rush back to the wall, but he will have no real story at the wall unless Jon is also there so Jon must be coming back.

Or if it leaked that Greyworm and Missendei were sleeping together and fans concluded: This must only be possible if some magical way has been found to regrow mutilated anatomy, probably some Valyrian magic. This may be used in some manner by Mel to resurrect Jon.

[Visceral Varys]

supposedly this contract information is wrong

I question the questioning of the contract.

Reason being, reportedly, the negotiation for season six and seven was done as a group with the top ( A tier) actors who are all represented by CSA, albeit deferent managers and attornies. This gave them leverage.

The only one out of that group to deny the report afaik is Kit. Where for art Lena, Peter, Emilia and Nickolaj?In fact Emilia was asked about her contract and general upgrade in pay and while saying the amount of 7 mil an eppisode was " not even close" she did not say the report was altogether false.

So, if the report is true that CSA renegotiated as a group and Kit is the only one to say that isn't correct...I tend to think that puts it into the need to deny for marketing and hype purposes rather than to correct an inacurracy.

Just my feeling :)

[Visceral Varys]

Or if it leaked that Greyworm and Missendei were sleeping together and fans concluded: This must only be possible if some magical way has been found to regrow mutilated anatomy, probably some Valyrian magic. This may be used in some manner by Mel to resurrect Jon.

Are you saying they raised his junk from the dead?

It's like Viagra of the magical world.

Get the memo out to Vary's and Theon with the quickness!

[Ben H'gahr]

I don't think that problem was avoidable in any way. If the whole cast had unanimously said that he was dead the fans would simply have argued that they had been instructed to do so and that this was just part of the well orchestrated cover-up/conspiracy. In fact some may have argued that the fact that such uniform instructions had been given to the cast was evidence that something big was in the works as this is rarely ever done.

If they had stabbed him multiply, beheaded him, burnt the body, and scattered the ashes all over the North, the fans would have argued that they had tried to make his death look so final and decisive because they wanted to bury the surprise resurrection really really deep and didn't want to ruin the surprise.

Frankly, at this point it seems to me like whatever the evidence the conclusion drawn from it is the same: Jon is coming back.

At this point I wouldn't be surprised if a spoiler leaked that Euron was sacking Oldtown in season 6 and fans concluded: This must be related to Samwell's storyline. He will rush back to the wall, but he will have no real story at the wall unless Jon is also there so Jon must be coming back.

Or if it leaked that Greyworm and Missendei were sleeping together and fans concluded: This must only be possible if some magical way has been found to regrow mutilated anatomy, probably some Valyrian magic. This may be used in some manner by Mel to resurrect Jon.

I must say that I appreciate your sarcasm.

But it's true: pretty much every piece of "evidence" in the Jon Snow-question can be interpreted either way, thus it's kinda futile to try to srsly discuss it.

[Ben H'gahr]

I question the questioning of the contract.

Well, I question the questioning of the questioning then^^.

I have no idea, that's just what he (Kit( said in the internet. As long as nobody has seen that piece of contract it's just speculation anyway. I refered to the infamous EW-interview with Mr Harrington released after S5E10 and afaik Ms Clarke said sth similar.