What's going on with the Glovers?

[Protagoras]

Since I think this discussion is a dead end - I will cut this a bit short, since I feel pretty much done. 

3 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

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Yeah, I have heard the ideas that Ned & Robb was not the real protagonists and by logic someone needs to survive to the end of the book - making the case of naming those survivors the "real protagonists" really easy. The problem is that I am talking about the setting, the deaths and the non-traditional fantasy and not necessary about individual characters (expect Jon). Sure, Bran, Sansa and Arya have great odds of seeing the next book, but that doesn´t mean the northern region will go safe or that it won´t be the disaster I have already written. Someone needs to tell the story, no matter if it is a more traditional fantasy or a more darker take. As Lord Varys said above: " Nobody doubts that the Stark POVs will play important and crucial roles in the remainder of the series. But this does not have to take the shape of the kind of restoration and revenge story you seem to want to read "

For me - the first draft is not evidence. It just shows GRRM had some ideas he played with and of course he did! I would be surprised if he hasn´t considered a lot of alternate endings and deaths. Same with the book title and the foreshadowings - its there  sure, and the wolves might be back, but why could it not be after a horrible war killing most of the northern popuation? - why expect the North to be in a good shape? You are simply assuming things and think Stark restoration means "Now, everything is fine". it wont. This will be Martins scourging of the Shire. 

3 hours ago, estermonty python said:

More Stuff

You think I misunderstand your view when you think mine involves Cthulhu? Lol

And yes, I am certain there are Jon fans on this forum which see something similiar to Jon riding on a white steed, ending war and suffering by pure awesomeness.

 

In general - my point is that this optimistic outlook and northern revenge story doesn´t seem to be likely and the discussion on GNC tries to push an agenda and a solution to all this I simply cant see. But, then again -. we are clearly reading different book series and I can survive being wrong. I think the two of you will take a serious wound if I am right however. 

[Eden-Mackenzie]

22 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

At least they are not in Beth Cassel's shoes. 

Why? Why put these horrible thoughts in our minds? I was perfectly content to think Beth was at the Dreadfort, imprisoned perhaps, otherwise but totally fine and definitely not subjected to Ramsay, who was far too busy with Theon to notice anyone else. After all, there isn't a Beth in Ramsay's pack, and Beth would have fought, based on how her father, cousin, and uncle all met their deaths. Beth is 100% a-okay.

23 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

(snip)

Something big is afoot. If I had to guess, I expect Maege, Gallbart and Howland Reed are conspiring to free the Northern hostages that were kept at the Twins. The Crannogmen are perfect for ambush attacks, and those hostages are about to be moved. Once the Greatjon and others are freed, we have a situation were the Umbers, Reeds, Mormonts, Glovers, Mountain Clans and Manderlys (who have the Lockes, Slates and Flints of Widow's Watch in tow according to Wyman) are united to take the North back for the Starks. Armed with Robb's will.

(snip)

I have thought at least a portion of the BWB would liberate the Red Wedding hostages, especially now that Jaime has ordered the Freys to send all hostages to King's Landing. I think Stoneheart's band is too focused on killing Freys, but there is the group that splintered after Beric's final death, and they haven't been seen since. Perhaps the missing Northmen and missing BWB will join forces? Blackfish could also be involved, although he is most likely going after Edmure and Jeyne.

[Lost Melnibonean]

52 minutes ago, Eden-Mackenzie said:

Why? Why put these horrible thoughts in our minds? I was perfectly content to think Beth was at the Dreadfort, imprisoned perhaps, otherwise but totally fine and definitely not subjected to Ramsay, who was far too busy with Theon to notice anyone else. After all, there isn't a Beth in Ramsay's pack, and Beth would have fought, based on how her father, cousin, and uncle all met their deaths. Beth is 100% a-okay.

Well, at least we haven't seen any puppies named Beth yet.