Mother Cocanuts Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Okay, the entire league's playbook is just wrong then I guess. I guess so. None of them are better than the Warriors.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Just now, Mother Cocanuts said: I guess so. None of them are better than the Warriors.. Yeah, none of them have 4 All-Stars in the starting 5 and another on the bench. That doesn't have much to do with the playbook, does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mother Cocanuts Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 15 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Yeah, none of them have 4 All-Stars in the starting 5 and another on the bench. That doesn't have much to do with the playbook, does it? I'm sure it just the 4 All-Stars: it has nothing to do with their offensive and defensive schemes. The rest of their bench must also be useless. They just tell Curry, Durant, Thompson, Green, and Iguodala to do whatever they want with the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 You're just arguing in circles now. Yes, they certainly have a great coaching staff (or at least had, with now both Alvin Gentry and Luke Walton moving on to less greener pastures) and they probably have the best front office in the league. That said, they are inarguably the most talented roster in the league, top to bottom. The bench is killer as well, that only adds to my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mother Cocanuts Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: You're just arguing in circles now. I'm not the one arguing in circles. You're attempting to argue that Curry is a defensive liability because other teams switch on him. You without any sort of basis infer that this must mean that he's a bad defender, rather than teams attempting to take advantage of size or matchups. The Warriors with Curry on the floor have the second highest defensive rating in the league. As a point guard, he is 18th in defensive real plus/minus (higher than John Wall's, Kyrie Irving's, and Russel Westbrook's.) And he has the highest plus minus in the game. Also, he's fourth in steals (in all positions), and seventh in deflections. But I suppose that my dispelling these ESPN canards about Curry's defense may seem circular to those who bought into their myths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, Mother Cocanuts said: I'm not the one arguing in circles. You're attempting to argue that Curry is a defensive liability because other teams switch on him. You without any sort of basis infer that this must mean that he's a bad defender, rather than teams attempting to take advantage of size or matchups. The Warriors with Curry on the floor have the second highest defensive rating in the league. As a point guard, he is 18th in defensive real plus/minus (higher than John Wall's, Kyrie Irving's, and Russel Westbrook's.) And he has the highest plus minus in the game. Also, he's fourth in steals (in all positions), and seventh in deflections. But I suppose that my dispelling these ESPN canards about Curry's defense may seem circular to those who bought into their myths. I give up, and I'm a Warrior's fan. I love Curry, but if you can't admit to his deficiencies, you're delusional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: I give up, and I'm a Warrior's fan. I love Curry, but if you can't admit to his deficiencies, you're delusional. i think that was obvious about 50 posts ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briantw Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 28 minutes ago, Mother Cocanuts said: I'm not the one arguing in circles. You're attempting to argue that Curry is a defensive liability because other teams switch on him. You without any sort of basis infer that this must mean that he's a bad defender, rather than teams attempting to take advantage of size or matchups. The Warriors with Curry on the floor have the second highest defensive rating in the league. As a point guard, he is 18th in defensive real plus/minus (higher than John Wall's, Kyrie Irving's, and Russel Westbrook's.) And he has the highest plus minus in the game. Also, he's fourth in steals (in all positions), and seventh in deflections. But I suppose that my dispelling these ESPN canards about Curry's defense may seem circular to those who bought into their myths. Despite your claims that Curry is a great defender, he has a negative DBPM. His plus-minus is buoyed by the fact that the Warriors have an amazing offense and often run up the score while the starters are on the floor. It has nothing to do with him as a defender. All anyone has to do is watch him play to know that he's not a good defender. He's a below league average defender. I'd rank him right around Kyrie Irving, personally, although I think Kyrie is capable of being a better defender if he actually put in the effort (which he never has). Both guys are generally crap-tier defenders. The steals argument doesn't hold water because of Curry's role in the defense. He's always assigned to the other team's worst offensive player, which allows him to constantly gamble for steals, knowing that his team will cover for him if he is unsuccessful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, Relic said: i think that was obvious about 50 posts ago. Yeah, I'm kind of stubborn and I like to argue, if you hadn't already figured that out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mother Cocanuts Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: I give up, and I'm a Warrior's fan. I love Curry, but if you can't admit to his deficiencies, you're delusional. I did mention a deficiency. You may have overlooked it. Just because I disagree with your assessment doesn't make me delusional. And the kicker is: my assessments can be confirmed by statistics and ratings. All your statements really amount to is this: "I see Curry get switched on during every Golden State Warriors game; therefore, he's a defensive liability." Or, "I listen to ESPN call him a defensive liability; therefore, it must be true." I do more than just watch them play. I pay attention to the details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Just now, Mother Cocanuts said: I did mention a deficiency. You may have overlooked it. Just because I disagree with your assessment doesn't make me delusional. And the kicker is: my assessments can be confirmed by statistics and ratings. All your statements really amount to is this: "I see Curry get switched on during every Golden State Warriors game; therefore, he's a defensive liability." Or, "I listen to ESPN call him a defensive liability; therefore, it must be true." I do more than just watch them play. I pay attention to the details. CLEARLY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Yeah, I'm kind of stubborn and I like to argue, if you hadn't already figured that out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mother Cocanuts Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 25 minutes ago, Relic said: i think that was obvious about 50 posts ago. I'm glad to see that you still have better things to do. 24 minutes ago, briantw said: Despite your claims that Curry is a great defender, he has a negative DBPM. I never said he was a "great defnder." I'm only refuting Manhole Eunuchsbane's claim that he's a "defensive liability." And do you have a reference for the -DBPM? 24 minutes ago, briantw said: His plus-minus is buoyed by the fact that the Warriors have an amazing offense and often run up the score while the starters are on the floor. It has nothing to do with him as a defender. All anyone has to do is watch him play to know that he's not a good defender. But I do watch him play, so how is it a sufficient argument to state that all one has to do is "watch him play"? 24 minutes ago, briantw said: The steals argument doesn't hold water because of Curry's role in the defense. He's always assigned to the other team's worst defender, which allows him to constantly gamble for steals, knowing that his team will cover for him if he is unsuccessful. Yes it does. And let's remember, when Curry is on a defensive assignment he's not assigned to a worse "defender." That makes no sense. He's a great stealer because he stays alert to the passing lanes and can recover easily on a defensive assignment. (I've seen him steal the ball from LeBron at least three times, one where it was just LeBron and a clear path to the rim: Curry's CRAZY STEAL from Lebron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briantw Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2736107-westbrooks-extension-lower-salary-cap-bad-news-for-lakers-2018-offseason Is there anything quite as sweet as the gradual acceptance by the Lakers that no one wants to play for their shit team? And that they don't have a draft pick this year no matter how bad their team is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mother Cocanuts Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 16 minutes ago, briantw said: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2736107-westbrooks-extension-lower-salary-cap-bad-news-for-lakers-2018-offseason Is there anything quite as sweet as the gradual acceptance by the Lakers that no one wants to play for their shit team? And that they don't have a draft pick this year no matter how bad their team is? I don't think this will hamper Johnson's plans. They want Lonzo Ball to be their star point-guard so Russell returning to L.A. would probably create some issues. I think the Lakers are going to pursue Paul George and Lebron James. It still wouldn't bring them over the hump, but they would definitely make the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briantw Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Just now, Mother Cocanuts said: I don't think this will hamper Johnson's plans. They want Lonzo Ball to be their star point-guard so Russell returning to L.A. would probably create some issues. I think the Lakers are going to pursue Paul George and Lebron James. It still wouldn't bring them over the hump, but they would definitely make the playoffs. Their top priority was LeBron and Westbrook. I think LeBron would have been a lot more likely to leave to go team with Westbrook than he would to leave and team with George. I also don't think LeBron, George, and that Lakers team would be better than the Cavs team he already has, and would likely be significantly worse. It's going to be at least a few years before Lonzo is ready to be a high level player, and that's assuming he gets there at all. Many thought Wiggins would be a star player a few years ago, but it's looking increasingly likely that he'll never be anything more than an inefficient volume scorer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mother Cocanuts Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 5 minutes ago, briantw said: Their top priority was LeBron and Westbrook. I think LeBron would have been a lot more likely to leave to go team with Westbrook than he would to leave and team with George. I also don't think LeBron, George, and that Lakers team would be better than the Cavs team he already has, and would likely be significantly worse. It's going to be at least a few years before Lonzo is ready to be a high level player, and that's assuming he gets there at all. Many thought Wiggins would be a star player a few years ago, but it's looking increasingly likely that he'll never be anything more than an inefficient volume scorer. I think Westbrook realized that the for the next few years, it'll be difficult to take down the Warriors, so he opted for the money instead. LeBron is nearing the end of his career so he may want to go L.A. for the financial opportunities. Maybe Dan Gilbert will convince Lebron to stay if he offers Lebron partial ownership of the team. I think their best chance is getting Paul George. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I think George will sign a 1 and 1 with OKC after this season unless things go terribly. No reason to jump to LA while they're still in rebuild mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briantw Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Sounds like the Cavs are going to start out the season with Kevin Love at center, Crowder as their PF, and LeBron, JR, and Rose as the other three. Wade will likely come off the bench and play backup PG and apparently is fine with that. Should be interesting. I think that lineup will run up the score on a lot of teams easily in the regular season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 9 minutes ago, briantw said: Sounds like the Cavs are going to start out the season with Kevin Love at center, Crowder as their PF, and LeBron, JR, and Rose as the other three. Wade will likely come off the bench and play backup PG and apparently is fine with that. Should be interesting. I think that lineup will run up the score on a lot of teams easily in the regular season. That looks like a step backwards on paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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