ACoK ReRead - Davos (+Prologue)

[SFDanny]

I think it is clear that Stannis does not consciously know that he played a role in his brother's death, although his dreams seem troubled by it, but it is also pretty clear that it is his shadow in Renly's tent. Catelyn tells us as much:

"I never held him but as he died," Brienne said quietly as they walked through the spreading chaos. Her voice sounded as if she might break at any instant. "He was laughing one moment, and suddenly the blood was everywhere ... my lady, I do not understand. Did you see, did you ...?"

"I saw a shadow. I thought it was Renly's shadow at the first, but it was his brother's."

"Lord Stannis?"

"I felt him. It makes no sense, I know ..."(ACoK 379 US Hardback)

emphasis added

[striding_huntsman]

So then I suppose we are to assume that Stannis also didn't tacitly participate in Penrose's killing either...he must have at least known Melisandre planned on using this spell though, surely? He must have participated somehow in the planning, perhaps Melisandre used some of his king's blood to cast the spell? Although I suppose he might still not know exactly what's going on when she casts these spells - maybe he's unaware that a shade version of himself is killing people. And even if he sent her to kill Penrose it doesn't seem as if he sent her to kill Renly, she seems to have taken that initiative. If we do get a Mel POV in aDwD I hope we learn more about this type of stuff. And I hope Davos kills her - she's evil!

[Lord Varys]

Melisandre probably used Stannis's semen, not his blood, to gave birth to her 'shadow-babes' (which looked like Stannis's shadow), considering the fact that they crept from her womb. If GRRM wanted to indicate some kind of blood ritual, I think, he would rather not include Melisandre's private parts ;-).

[RemitMan]

Starting on yet another reread of this book, something strange popped into my head. It seems that there are many 'behind the scenes' players in the Free Cities that have been trying to influence the Seven Kingdoms for some time now. (Varys, Mel, Illyrio, etc.) Lord Steffon had traveled to the Free Cities looking for a bride for Rhaegar. He picked up Patchface on that trip and died along with everyone else on board the ship except for the fool. Could Patchface have been a part of some conspiricy to stop this arrangement by sinking the ship that carried Rhaegar's bride. Rhaegar could then be free to discover his secret mating thing and make a play for Lyanna. Probably nothing, but what if Patchface is another of Varys's spiders?

[Darklich528]

I will add a comment.

The text says that the ruby "shimmers redly". Now this could be interpreted that the ruby is giving off light, with the implication that it is acting as a magic "neutralise poison" item, possibly similar to the jewel that Dany is given which supposedly gives immunity to poison.

OTOH, it could be that Cressen happens to focus on the jewel, which is obviously the focal point of Melisandre's costume, at this crucial moment. Melisandre may have gained immunity to poison in some other manner, perhaps in the same process that rendered her unnaturally warm and resistant to cold. It might be that the supposed magic properties of Dany's gem are superstition (similar superstitions about gem stones existed in RL).

This is another case of GRRM being ambiguous about magic, but my guess is that the latter of the two options above is true.

If I remember correctly, GRRM mentions the ruby shimmering pretty much every time that Mel is in danger or could possibly have died. When she drank the poison, when she steps into or near fire, etc. I had always assumed that the ruby itself was keeping her alive somehow. It makes sense when you think about it, although it has been done before in other tales. To me not revealing her age or even hinting at her age strengthens this theory, but as of now it's only pure speculation on my part.

Starting on yet another reread of this book, something strange popped into my head. It seems that there are many 'behind the scenes' players in the Free Cities that have been trying to influence the Seven Kingdoms for some time now. (Varys, Mel, Illyrio, etc.) Lord Steffon had traveled to the Free Cities looking for a bride for Rhaegar. He picked up Patchface on that trip and died along with everyone else on board the ship except for the fool. Could Patchface have been a part of some conspiricy to stop this arrangement by sinking the ship that carried Rhaegar's bride. Rhaegar could then be free to discover his secret mating thing and make a play for Lyanna. Probably nothing, but what if Patchface is another of Varys's spiders?

Patchface was the sole survivor, right? And he's insane now and can't remember anything? C'mon, he's obviously somebody important. =p

[Ororo727 Jon Snow Fangirl]

If I remember correctly, GRRM mentions the ruby shimmering pretty much every time that Mel is in danger or could possibly have died. When she drank the poison, when she steps into or near fire, etc. I had always assumed that the ruby itself was keeping her alive somehow. It makes sense when you think about it, although it has been done before in other tales. To me not revealing her age or even hinting at her age strengthens this theory, but as of now it's only pure speculation on my part.

Patchface was the sole survivor, right? And he's insane now and can't remember anything? C'mon, he's obviously somebody important. =p

He was purchased as a slave in Volantis by Lord Steffon and Cassana Baratheon the father of Robert and his brothers. They wrote a letter before their trip telling their family of a jester of amazing skill. When their ship sank just off the coast of Storms End, only Patchface survived, washing ashore several days later. Seemingly changed by the ordeal, Patchface shows little skill at jesting and frequently makes morose rhymes about life underwater. Some of his rhymes are prophetic, including one that predicted the RW, though none of his listeners understand them.

[Ser Arthyr Dracenstein]

Ah, but is Patchface the slave purchased in Volantis?

Or a substitute? There is nothing more suspicious than a sole survivor...