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Lord Varys

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About Lord Varys

  • Birthday 11/25/1982

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  • Most Devious 'Man' In The Seven Kingdoms
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    Male
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    Definitely somewhere in King's Landing

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  1. The foot fetish scene seems to have been cut. The source for the Laena-Vhagar scene was apparently also the guy who told Joffrey told Criston about the moon tea. Not sure if Alicent would put her feet on the table as 'dessert' for Larys, or if they were going with the camera zooming in on her naked feet and implying that something more was going on there, but stuff is missing there. Alicent also seemed to be worried about her servant bursting in when they were 'at it', not so much because, you know, the queen was enjoying a nice dinner. I really want to see that scene restored and/or this kind of relationship referenced, since it is quite odd for pious and dutiful Alicent to enter in such a thing.
  2. Yeah, he knows who he was ... but Alicent also seems to be pretty private with the things she does with Larys. And him being in her private chambers prior to her getting there could be a hint that he took a secret back door or at least circumvented the guards. It seems as if Criston only now realizes that Larys has the hots for the queen.
  3. We can imagine that Vaemond bites the dust in that episode, just as we can imagine that the betrothals between Baela & Rhaena and Jace & Luke are either arranged in that episode, or shown as established facts during the episode (Rhaenyra having Jace spend time with Baela and Rhaena basically set things up for that). The show handles the Driftmark succession issue much better than George, by the way. FaB has the ridiculous scenario of Corlys Velaryon not naming a new heir after both his children have died ... nor does it even mention the claims of Laena's daughters (who should come before Vaemond Velaryons and the other nephews and their children in both book and show). Instead, we have a Corlys and a Rhaenyra there who didn't think about installing Luke as the new heir of Driftmark for years and years (!) ... which may be good writing if the characters in question were supposed to be demented or otherwise confused, but not if either of them were wanting to secure their legacy and lordships for their younger descendants. The show has Corlys already viewing and grooming Luke as his eventual heir, meaning it is quite clear who the heir will be in his eyes after Laenor's alleged death. Rhaenys would prefer Baela, setting up the big reason why those betrothals are going to take place. One would imagine that Rhaenys is going to be pleased even more if Baela is chosen to be the queen at Jace's side. One imagines the show spins it so that Corlys' failing health will cause Vaemond to a make a move, pushing aside Corlys' chosen heir. We won't get a scenario where the succession of Driftmark is 'unclear' because no new heir has been named. The whole thing will just be trial run for the later Green coup. And one imagines that Otto and Alicent and Criston realized that Vaemond Velaryon was a potential ally of theirs. They were right there hearing the eulogy he gave at the funeral.
  4. It does make sense that Otto is among the candidates ... but it doesn't make sense that the show just has him back in the office again with there being no other people even being considered. I'd not say Viserys confused Alicent and Aemma - he seems to have been deep in thought, thinking about Aemma, and then he made a mistake. He is not senile or generally confused.
  5. That would be true. But in the book Daemon was also not pushing for the office, and as I said since Daemon's return should have been a clear thing before the decision was made and considering that Viserys clearly wanted his brother to return to court it is quite odd that he apparently was never considered for the job. Although I definitely would agree that he wasn't the ideal candidate for the job. But still one George has Viserys considering in the book, so they should have included that in the show, too. It does make a difference if Daemon marrying Laena Velaryon without royal permission leads to his exile ... or whether he just wanted to go away for his own reasons. The latter would make it much more likely that Viserys would want to favor him than the former. I know. I don't just react or reply to posts just because I want to argue. There I did it to reinforce your point.
  6. Viserys only meets Daemon again and learns about his state of mind after he has already named a new Hand, so Daemon's apparent lack of ambition wouldn't have been a reason not to consider him. In context, one would assume that the court would have learned about Laena's death before Otto came back to KL, so Daemon would have been definitely a potential candidate - even more so since Viserys himself clearly wants his brother back at his side. Don't fill the blanks with book stuff. So far nothing (!) in the show indicates that Daemon and Laena were exiled. Laena describes them as 'travellers' to the Prince of Pentos, so the conclusion for the show is that Daemon had had enough of Westeros and went to see the world after he married Laena. They may even have left after the birth of the girls since both were given dragon eggs (it is possible that they are from a clutch from Vhagar, of course, but it might just as well be that Daemon received eggs for his newborn girls from Viserys before he left). If they had been in exile then Laena would also not have urged Daemon to return but rather that he (or they) petition Viserys to allow them to come home. If they were exiled, then their return wouldn't have been their own decision. Larys assuming that Alicent writing a letter to Oldtown is all it would need to remake Otto the Hand is also quite odd. She is the other named candidate the book brings up besides Daemon, and the obvious choice in the show since there is literally no reason given why Viserys wouldn't consider her and also no reason why Rhaenyra wouldn't accept. She is the main candidate who should have been considered ... with there being a really good explanation why she didn't get the office.
  7. Seriously? Whiny Vader wannabe is actually a fan favorite?
  8. Yes, there should have been some inclination that Viserys was remembering Otto fondly, some reason why he may have considered recalling him. And also some reason why he would not want Rhaenyra in the office of the Hand. As his health is declining his top priority should have been to want to prepare his daughter to be queen, to shoulder more and more of his burdens so there would be a smooth succession. I mean, sure enough, this cannot be ... but they should have given reasons why not. One possible take could have been Viserys offering the Handship to Rhaenyra and Rhaenyra telling her father she would only accept if he was sending Alicent away from court. Rhaenyra could have overdone things, causing her to return to Dragonstone sulking. Also, of course, the Handship decision could have been made after Laenor's apparent death and the announcement of the Rhaenyra-Daemon marriage. Otto could have been there on Driftmark merely as Alicent's father and a funeral guest, without being Hand yet, and the Handship being a kind of price the Blacks, the Greens, and the Velaryons were vying for behind the scenes, knowing full well that this would be a most crucial appointment at that time. Hell, Otto could have ingratiated himself with Viserys to regain his position by publicly siding with Rhaenyra during the Aemond incident.
  9. It doesn't look like that, though. Otto tells us in this very episode that Alicent would have to bring Viserys around again and she fears that she lost his favor for good. The implication is that she can convince him of something if she works (hard) on him, not that she makes decisions for him. In the Helaena match case you see how it goes ... Viserys allows Alicent a word in the arrangement of the betrothal of their daughter, but she doesn't make the decision all by herself. But he is not going to make a decision in that case when it goes completely against her wishes. But in the case of the Handship the last talk with Lyonel reinforced it that he had been an impartial Hand, one who didn't give self-serving advice. Meaning that Viserys still very much recalls that and why he dismissed Otto. The show should have had Viserys trying to offer the Handship to Daemon only for him turning him down. And there should have been a reason why he wouldn't want Rhaenyra in that office. Bringing back Otto is what triggers the Dance. Not giving the office to Rhaenyra or Daemon was what ensured that there might be an (attempted) coup.
  10. What do we make of Otto just being back as Hand with no, you know, explanation? Just because Alicent writes letters Otto shouldn't be reappointed. George gives some explanation for this, and that kind of works. The show avoids the issue by not dealing with it at all. Which I think is a mistake. In the book Viserys considers both Rhaenyra and Daemon as Hands, while other advisors suggest a younger man (I'm sure Tyland and Jasper would have liked to take the job). It is Alicent's influence that ensures Otto is recalled to be the Hand. In the book this is because Viserys has already decreed that Rhaenyra should permanently reside on Dragonstone in the wake of the Aemond incident ... and because he remembered that Daemon wasn't exactly successful on the council. But in the show it is quite odd why he wouldn't first ask Rhaenyra or Daemon whether they want the job. We see at the funeral that he wanted Daemon to return to KL and he clearly very much favors Rhaenyra during the quarrel, so why doesn't he at least ask her whether she wants the job?
  11. The victory of Rook's Rest is measured by the objective - taking the castle, punishing the Stauntons and taking out a Black dragon and its rider. That was all accomplished. Ditto with Tumbleton. That they didn't continue their campaign is a different matter. And it may have gone this way even if Ormund had lived (Bryndon was no commander to our knowledge, just his cousin) since the Two Betrayers wouldn't have become his lackeys, either. The way they present Criston makes their decision to not make him Lord Commander this early very good. The guy could not possibly have been Alicent's pet to this degree AND commanding the Kingsguard. I never thought how this would play out in a more detailed setting ... but obviously not very well. If they had gone with Criston as Lord Commander they would have to tone down his Green partisanship to a considerable degree, have him only utter his true feelings in complete privacy. Not sure how much screentime he would get in such a setting.
  12. That didn't really happen back when Maegor usurped the throne, no? And a loyal dragonrider cannot really be forced to turn against his monarch. You cannot abduct him or try to stage a rebellion in his name when he could use his dragon to destroy your castle. The idea that this kind of thing is a given in other times also kind of undermined by the simple fact that Dorne came around to accepting equal primogeniture. Nymeria had daughters and sons both, yet nobody supplanted her eldest daughter with her son. Or think about how easily the hedge knights dismiss both the claims of Prince Rhaegel and his children. They think the throne will go to the ones they deem powerful, i.e. Maekar or Bloodraven. Aemond and Vhagar may have had a decent shot to convince lords to rise in his name against Rhaenyra ... but the Aegon as presented in the show is a wastrel and a loser. Very few people would want him to be their king if nobody powerful (i.e. the Hand and the dowager queen) were propping him up.
  13. That is why Vhagar should have been introduced earlier - say, when the Velaryons flew to KL for Laenor's wedding. Yes, they later have dialogue indicating Laena claimed her only afterwards ... but that could have been easily changed. In fact, it could have been Laena's monstrously huge dragon which made her suddenly seem attractive to Daemon at the wedding. Well, not particularly plot relevant, but then ... the dragons are not all that relevant at that time for any plot. Even less so considering people rarely bring them up when discussing politics. But it would have shown that dragonriders do use their dragons to, you know, travel. Which Rhaenyra apparently rarely does. No, that's hardly a Pyrrhic victory. It is a total victory for the Greens. A Pyrrhic victory is a victory that cost the victor almost as much as the loser ... and it cripples his ability to continue the war thereafter or build on the advantage he has gained. A dead general and his cousin shouldn't have crippled the ability of the Hightower army to continue their campaign. That it does is their own problem, something they could have overcome easily enough. They could have found a good commander or just decided to accept whoever was in charge now. In a Pyrrhic victory scenario you cannot just conjure up more men or money. The main villains of that part of the series wouldn't count as supporting characters to me. Again, I'd have liked to get more about Cole and Redwyne there, but they are not exactly my top priority in a Targaryen history book. How do you know neither was the soul of discretion? We know that there were Green agents and traitors among the Blacks at Tumbleton. Aside from Hugh and Ulf there were Roger Corne and Owain Bourney. Hugh and Ulf may have been approached by Green agents back at KL, on the march to Tumbleton, and there (by agents sent into the city by Lord Ormund) because it would have been known that they were not exactly happy with the rewards Queen Rhaenyra bestowed on them. They wanted more and those Green agents were willing to promise them more, one imagines. But it is the same with the Blacks - Rhaenyra wins the city but cannot capitalize on that advantage, the Mooton-led attack on Sunfyre is a complete disaster, all the victories in the Riverlands don't help the Black cause at all. In fact, viewing the Riverlands campaign as Blacks vs. Greens makes actually little sense. With the Westermen and Crownlanders it is the Riverlords and their men cleansing their homeland of 'foreign invaders' - and one assumes that's why they are so successful there. They fight to defend their own and they know the terrain much better than the enemy. I think that is part of the reason why I think they won't rush through the story. They must focus on introducing the Starks and Arryns and keep them on the screen afterwards, just as they have to make the war strategy make sense. There are ways to juggle around events. I still think Rook's Rest could be a great finale for the second season, if don't rush through the other events. But they could move the Honeywine to an earlier point in time so that this battle will be also a crucial climax at the end of the season. They also have to introduce lots of new core characters - the Hull boys, Hugh, Ulf, and Nettles, possibly Marilda as well, and, of course, Alys Rivers. They also have to build up and spend time with both Aegon the Younger and Viserys. The former will become a very crucial character and the latter, while pretty unimportant for the Dance, is still a major historical Targaryen figure and should be presented as such. Also, I think, they have to come up with stuff for Baela and Rhaena to do. They can't just stand there all the time. Then there is the Laenor business to be considered, assuming he is going to come back. And, of course, the personal relationships between the characters - Otto's fall from grace, Criston's rise from Lord Commander to Handship, the assassinations and assassination attempts, etc.
  14. Didn't talk about claiming scenes. But having another joy ride scene in episode 6 with Caraxes/Vhagar was pointless. Although I'd have forgiven it if Daemon had jumped dragons there, establishing that this was a thing he could do. Not said Helaena should have been seen claiming Dreamfyre, but rather it should have been established that she did. Either in dialogue or by including a scene of Alicent's children mounting their dragons when they left Driftmark (or perhaps only by enlarging the flying scene so we saw who was riding which dragon). The readers know, but the audience has literally no clue. That could have been done easily by not dragging out that Aemond-Vhagar scene for so long. Plot relevance means they establish what those dragons do and what they are for in this world. Meaning means to quick travel (which they botched for Rhaenyra both in episode 4 and 5), and a weapon of intimidation and war. That they did in in episodes 2 & 3 but kind of ignore when they actually discuss policy and dynastic marriages. Hell, now that we have our first and only sibling incest match from that era referenced, it may have also been kind of convenient to brush the subject of Targaryen incest and why they are doing it. Corlys and Viserys went on and on about Valyrian and Valyrian houses and the royal bloodline ... but that this boils down 'to keep the blood of the dragon pure' because they fear or know they might lose control of the dragons if they were to dilute it too much is something they have yet to mention. In fact, this should have been an issue somebody may have mentioned both with the Laena-Viserys match and the Rhaenyra-Laenor match ... and also as a counter argument against the Viserys-Alicent match. It could also have come up when they referenced the Viserys-Aemma match or Corlys-Rhaenys marrying. And, of course, Rhaenyra-Daemon could have also mentioned that when they were talking their marriage. Thinking about that Helaena-Dreamfyre - they could have had Aemond overseeing Helaena/Dreamfyre in the beach before he got to Vhagar. We didn't see her going to bed, so they could have had going out, too, talking to her dragon as well as her spiders and insects.
  15. I'd prefer to a reaction to what I've written, not how something I wrote 'sounds'. I cannot really react to opaque interpretations. But, yes, they should also talk more about the dragons if they are supposed to matter in any meaningful way. But the bigger issue is that they are basically just shown off in scenes that have little to no plot relevance. It is almost comical to see (or rather: infer) that Aegon and Helaena flew back to KL on those two dragons were saw there in addition to Vhagar when we earlier saw the dragonrider Rhaenyra travel around by ship. What's the difference now? Alicent and Viserys and Aemond would have travelled together to Driftmark by ship, like Viserys and Rhaenyra also did earlier. Why were Aegon and Helaena allowed to fly? Why did they want to fly?
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