Coldhands

[Ida]

Even if Benjen Stark turned out not to be Coldhands, his story was never useless.

He is kind of like his brother Ned, an ideal. Ned is always remembered for his honor and for doing the right thing, Ben is like that in a sense. He was first Ranger, a sort of perfect example for the men of the Nights Watch.

Ned Stark died early so that the world of Westeros and the Starks would be turned up side down - and it could be the beginning of a time of wars and terror.

Benjen Starks dissapearing was one of the factors that lead to the Night Watch`s going in to the forbidden forrest, and that lead to the fight with the wildling and the others, LC Mormont being killed, Jon becoming new LC etc.

So if Benjen not is Coldhands, his story was never without meaning.

But I hope we haven`t seen the last of Benjen Stark - either as Coldhands or in an another sort, form or way.

[Weeping Sore]

Still think Coldhands is most likely Benjen Stark. Coldhands seems to have some kind of affection toward Bran, and some of his own volition/ personality. And as he seems to be an animated corpse (Ghost senses a "whiff of rot" about him).

I doubt even a magical corpse would physically hold up over the centuries (millenia?) if he were the Night King or Last Hero. As for son of the Night King- the offspring of a human and a White Walker would be some kind of living thing, the Others, whatever they are seem to be some form of life.

I think he is an ally of the CotF/ Bloodraven but not their puppet. He is barred from entering the CotF's cave and barred from passing through the Wall, both protections against Others/Wights.

The one argument against his being Benjen is that Leaf said the wights "killed him long ago". This is in the context of Bran protesting that the CotF won't let Coldhands into their cave and the wights will kill him. I think the word choice here is mainly stylistic: GRRM could have just as easily wrote "They killed him already" but that would clash with Leaf's archaic voice, and it's also a chapter-ending line. "They killed him long ago" just has more gravitas.

[White Ravens]

Bran asks 'Leaf' -who is cold hands?- reply he has been dead a very long time. A long time for the Children of the Forest is thousands of years. So, dead ranger ( wears black) but who he was when alive unknown and irrelevant IMO, just he s a servant of the 3 eyed crow.

Unlikely to be Benjen as he s freshly dead ( if dead).

I agree. Also, for the most part when GRRM sets us up for an assumed outcome the actual events come as an almost total surprise. The majority of readers are assuming that Coldhands is Benjen Stark so the likelyhood of that is slim.

[Lady Tippy Wolfsbane]

I still believe Coldhands is the Night's King, and he doesn't show his face, because he would reveal his Stark features to Bran.

[nenya~]

Coldhands could be one of the seventy-nine sentinels that deserted the NW.

"Old ghosts, from before the Old King, even before Aegon the Dragon, seventy-nine deserters who went south to be outlaws. One was Lord Ryswell’s youngest son, so when they reached the barrowlands they sought shelter at his castle, but Lord Ryswell took them captive and returned them to the Nightfort. The Lord Commander had holes hewn in the top of the Wall and he put the deserters in them and sealed them up alive in the ice. They have spears and horns and they all face north. The seventy-nine sentinels, they’re called. They left their posts in life, so in death their watch goes on forever. Years later, when Lord Ryswell was old and dying, he had himself carried to the Nightfort so he could take the black and stand beside his son. He’d sent him back to the Wall for honor’s sake, but he loved him still, so he came to share his watch.”

It fits with Coldhands being a member of the NW that died long ago.

[Lord Manwoody]

I agree with some others that the comment in ADWD about Coldhands being dead for a long time ("they killed him long ago") would seem to eliminate Benjen as a possibility.

It certainly seems he was a member of the NW though, so that at least narrows down the list.

[Lord Joker Of FunLand]

"They killed him long ago"....

Someone from the Dunk And Egg stories? I have no idea if it makes sense since i never read them...but it would be a cool twist.

[Cat of the Canal Girl]

I think there are a few things to note on the point of identifying Coldhands.

Is his consciousness the same entity as his physical body? His body may have been Benjen Stark's (or one of many dead rangers), but if that body is being warged then it wouldn't fully answer the question to just say "Coldhands is Benjen Stark".

If he was being warged at the time he first met Sam, why would he use the word 'brother'? Sam isn't a brother to a CotF or BR. One guess might be that the warg controlling him chose to use that word because he knows it would bring comfort to Sam.

Third, does the nature of his body make his hands be cold, or do they just end up being cold due to the environment and lack of blood flow? Do we know if un-Cat's hands would turn cold if she was dragged beyond the wall and left out in the cold for awhile? Perhaps Coldhands is the same thing un-Cat is, they just appear different to us because of the different environments they have lived in since their transformation.

[Tattered Prince Pumpkinn]

Coldhands is Jeor Mormont. (Just a hunch though)

[Silent Sparrow]

I think there are a few things to note on the point of identifying Coldhands.

Is his consciousness the same entity as his physical body? His body may have been Benjen Stark's (or one of many dead rangers), but if that body is being warged then it wouldn't fully answer the question to just say "Coldhands is Benjen Stark".

If he was being warged at the time he first met Sam, why would he use the word 'brother'? Sam isn't a brother to a CotF or BR. One guess might be that the warg controlling him chose to use that word because he knows it would bring comfort to Sam.

Third, does the nature of his body make his hands be cold, or do they just end up being cold due to the environment and lack of blood flow? Do we know if un-Cat's hands would turn cold if she was dragged beyond the wall and left out in the cold for awhile? Perhaps Coldhands is the same thing un-Cat is, they just appear different to us because of the different environments they have lived in since their transformation.

With the wargs, it seems to be that consciousness is separate from physical body which is how a warg (Varamyr) can live past the death of his physical body. If we want to defend the Coldhands is Benjen theory, it could be Benjen's consciousness inhabiting the body of a different ranger, thus he would not be recognized by Bran.

And when dealing with your third point, do we know that un-Cat is still warm? Does she have regular body heat to keep her warm, does she warm up in the sun like a lizard, or is she just cold and dead? Hopefully we can get some more information on unCat.

[lostinwesteros]

I still believe Coldhands is the Night's King, and he doesn't show his face, because he would reveal his Stark features to Bran.

I've never heard this theory before, and it's intriguing. I wonder, though (not that I know all the details of ASoIaF history, that's for sure), if it would be the possible, since my understanding was that the Night's King had betrayed the Night's Watch in breaking away and setting himself up as King. If that's the case, it seems strange to me that he would call Sam "Brother". ??? But then, I guess he could be a repentant brother now. :dunno:

Coldhands could be one of the seventy-nine sentinels that deserted the NW.

"Old ghosts, from before the Old King, even before Aegon the Dragon, seventy-nine deserters who went south to be outlaws. One was Lord Ryswell’s youngest son, so when they reached the barrowlands they sought shelter at his castle, but Lord Ryswell took them captive and returned them to the Nightfort. The Lord Commander had holes hewn in the top of the Wall and he put the deserters in them and sealed them up alive in the ice. They have spears and horns and they all face north. The seventy-nine sentinels, they’re called. They left their posts in life, so in death their watch goes on forever. Years later, when Lord Ryswell was old and dying, he had himself carried to the Nightfort so he could take the black and stand beside his son. He’d sent him back to the Wall for honor’s sake, but he loved him still, so he came to share his watch.”

It fits with Coldhands being a member of the NW that died long ago.

I love this theory, and it sounds so 'right'! I don't remember ever hearing of the 79 sentinels before, though, probably another thing I missed by racing through my first read. I'm on a reread now, slowly going through AGoT. Anyway, I love this story, and for me it makes perfect sense as to whom Coldhands might be.

It's the "died long ago" that, for me, takes Benjen, StoneSnake, Mormont out of the running, and I don't see Coldhands as being warged by anyone, either -- I see him as being much too wise and autonomous for that, as if he's been fighting this battle against evil north of the wall for a long, long time.

Great theory! :bowdown:

[Knight ofthe Laughing Tree]

Well there is no real textual evidence that I can bring to mind right now but it's just the fact that Ghost led Jon to the obsidian stash, which I find hard to explain otherwise, I mean I doubt very much that he just happened to smell it or something, also the fact that he disappeared when Jon went over the wall and then reappeared, quite conveniently, at the perfect time, and lastly, the fact that he was constantly 'hunting', he seems to 'hunt' a lot more than any of the other direwolves

I'm definitely going to have a re-read to try and back this arguement up, It's been too long since I've read the books to bring any credible evidence forward :D

Yes Ghost does seem to go hunting more doesn't he-- and I always wondered what it meant that he goes near Melisandre with nary a problem... Bloodraven sniffing her out you think? Interesting theory...

Against Benjen Stark as Coldhands:

-- No particular reason to single out Benjen since lot's rangers have disappeared recently (barring Houndini's intriguing theory about Stark blood and vow before the Old Gods...)

-- Bran, I believe, could well have recognized him. Only the lower half of his face was covered and the cowl only *shadowed* his features. But this is open to debate.

-- Nothing in the character's demeanour or choice of words points to him being Benjen. (Correct me?). Usually GRRM drops something subtle for congruence.

I've been really enthralled with the identity of Coldhands of late and while I can see the rationality pointing toward it being a character we've either heard of or met previously, it's difficult to say whether it's Benjen, Night's King, or the ranger (the other ranger that went with Qorin and Jon to the Frostfangs and went missing) Stonenake something or other..... ANYHOW

On a re-read of GoT today I came across an interesting bit when Rob speaks to Yoren about the tidings of Benjen... that he's been gone a long while and probably dead. Rob screams, "My uncle is not dead! Do you hear me? My uncle is not dead!" and Yoren says something like "Whatever you say" and then Bran interjects, "The children will help him.... the children of the forest!" When he's laughed at by Theon Greyjoy and Luwin disputes Bran's assumption that the CotF are dead and gone, Yoren says "down here, might be that's true, Maester. But up past the Wall, who's to say? Up there, a man can't always tell what's a live and what's dead." (pp 247-249)

This obviously isn't a huge piece of evidence, but I agree GRR usually drops something subtle for congruence.... Might be this bit is such, yes? :) I loved reading it. While I would love to see the Night's King, that being said I always felt like he was completely evil. Even if he wasn't vanguished, I don't see him as catspaw of anyone or anything, you know?

[wael]

Coldhands is most likely to be Benjen Stark.... And one of the others.

Benjen because : He wears the black of the Night's watch, he helped Sam(assuming that he's a black like him) and he's helping Bran.

One of the others : because he's obviously dead (he doesnt eat, drink or sleep... And doesnt breath.... Oh and he's literraly Cold ! Just like the others are).

[Brienne Of Bombay]

Considering his black garb I always assumed Coldhands to be a member of the NW (who has been resurrected maybe)..

I hope its not Benjen Stark.. I want ot see more of Ben..

[Naathi Prince]

Almost everyone in this thread has posted a quick sentence. "I think he's Benjen" but there is absolutely no evidence for him being Benjen. You also have the COTF saying "they killed him long ago". He's a crow, for sure, but one who has long been dead.

[Blackfyre the Bold]

Coldhands may be Benjen but he has been dead for a very long time and Benjen hasn't. So it's more likely that Coldhands is a notable individual who was in the Night's Watch years before the events of ASOIAF. Who could that be? Not? Brynden Rivers.

I think Benjen is still alive. And if he is, he will play a major role in saving the day.

[JungWheats]

Waymar Royce.

[Jon Snow eats wild beaver]

I don't think coldhands is ben stark. I think he is older. Leaf says he was killed long ago. To me, that means before ben stark's time as a ranger and before the books. Ben is killed within the scope of the books. I think he is a (former) member of the watch though.

Maybe the night's king?

[Bacon Dragon the Crispy]

I do not believe Benjen is CH either. IMO, it is far too convenient to fit into GRRM's elaborate story lines. I agree that CH is likely far older than Ben.

My theory for why Benjen is "missing" is that he has warged into something himself. Warging obviously follows bloodlines since many of us assume that both Ned and Lyanna's children have the ability to Warg. It only makes sense that Benjen could also have this ability. This would also explain his success at the wall as First Ranger. Or he is dead :)

[MIGR]

I think it could be Benjen, although I'm not sure in what extend all the brothers of the Night's Watch are up to speed with secret passages belower the wall, in a castle not used anymore.

So maybe it's someone older, as in, back when all the castles were still manned.