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Know Face Man

The Last Hero- Azor Ahai- The Prince that was Promised

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I follow the theory that AA, TPTWP, The Stallion who mounts the World and The Last Hero are all one and the same. Each legend comes from a different culture and each culture tells the story in their own way - The followers of R'hollr with the firey AA, the dragon-centric Valyrians with their dragon that was promised, the horsey Dorthraki with their militant Stallion and the cold northern Westerosi with their lonely ice-demon vanquishing warrior.

I recently read a novel that I enjoyed very much. It is called The Night Circus by Erin Morgenstern. There was a passage in that book that reminded me of this:

"Old stories have a habit of being told and retold and changed. Each subsequent storyteller puts his or her mark upon it. Whatever truth the story once had is buried in bias and embellishment."

AA, The Stallion, TPTWP, The Last Hero - essentially they are all stories about a great hero who comes to save the world at a time when the world is in great peril - they have just been "buried in bias and embellishment" according to who is telling the story.

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I think that all of the messiah figures — Azor Ahai, the Prince That Was Promised, the Last Hero and the Stallion That Mounts the World — are the same figure, interpreted through the lenses of the various cultures.

Azor Ahai comes from the far east, where priests are obsessed with and even to some extent worship fire. So it makes sense that this guy has a flaming sword and is associated with light and heat.

The Prince That Was Promised seems rooted in Valyrian prophecy with an emphasis on dragons and/or royalty. So it makes sense that the Targaryens would assume that this person was a member of their own family.

The Stallion That Mounts the World is the creation of a nomadic pillaging society where your strength is measured by the number of people and horses in your horde. So it makes sense that, to them, the messiah is the person with the largest horde who manages to conquer or unite the world.

The Last Hero isn't really a prophecy so much as a historical legend, but it specifically ties into the Battle for the Dawn, the fight against the Others and (I presume) the Night's Watch. It is uniquely Westerosi.

One interpretation might "be more correct" than the others (the Last Hero is an Old Nan story; hasn't Martin said something that her oral history is the only truly "right" one?), or bits of each might be fulfilled in their own way. But I think that at the end of the day, it comes down to one person.

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The Last Hero is Bran

Old Nan story goes a little something like this. " Determine to seek out the Children, in hopes that their ancient magics could win back what the armies of men had lost. He set out into the dead lands with a SWORD, HORSE, DOG and a DOZEN COMPANIONS.

LAST HERO = BRAN. SWORD = SWORD from the Crypts of Winterfell

HORSE = HONDOR ( Bran rides Hondor) DOG = SUMMER.

DOZEN COMPANIONS (MEERA REED and JOJEN REED)

12 companions i think not... more like 1st companion and 2nd companion

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I see where you come up with that conclusion but I agree with the others I think that TPTWP, AA, The Last Hero, The Stallion that mounts the world are all the same thing, the same person, And I just don't think that Bran is that person, I think that there are similarities between him and the Last Hero from Old Nan's story but I don't think that he is the Last Hero or any of the other variations.

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I like the idea that both Jon and Dany are the PwwP and Azor Ahai together. It makes sense, and if Jon isn't already a Targ-Stark (which he probably is), then he is the Ice to Dany's Fire.

Stannis is just a bad-ass who happens to have a glowing sword.

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I am kind of hoping that all this prophecy stuff doesn't go anywhere. I like R+L=J and and all, but i would like to see the AA and PwwP thing fizzle out. I enjoy magic and other fantasy elements of the book, but it is always fun to see people believing completely in something that doesn't exist. This is probably the aethiest in me

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Cant remember who said it but i like to think the red herring argument has merit (smoke and salt is how you cure herrings)

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I would like to think the prophecy is false. People should fend for themselves instead of hoping for a savior. Just look at all of those Wildlings dying at Hardhome, they went there in hope of someone who would rescue them, with nothing to rely on but a story. I think the only prophetic events that have any bearing in Martin's world are the direwolf pups, greenseeing, and fire seeing. Before you argue that AA or TPTWP or TSTMTW is different because so many people hold to the same tale, it may just be that they are completely different stories, their theme being common. I mean look at all of the ancient cultures with stories about snakes (Albeit with a negative attitude in most of them.), did they originate individually or was there once a single story that was changed? I hope Martin let's the prophecy down unfulfilled.

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I would like to think the prophecy is false. People should fend for themselves instead of hoping for a savior. Just look at all of those Wildlings dying at Hardhome, they went there in hope of someone who would rescue them, with nothing to rely on but a story. I think the only prophetic events that have any bearing in Martin's world are the direwolf pups, greenseeing, and fire seeing. Before you argue that AA or TPTWP or TSTMTW is different because so many people hold to the same tale, it may just be that they are completely different stories, their theme being common. I mean look at all of the ancient cultures with stories about snakes (Albeit with a negative attitude in most of them.), did they originate individually or was there once a single story that was changed? I hope Martin let's the prophecy down unfulfilled.

What's funny about Hardhome is that Mother Mole's vision did come true: Ships came to take them south, it's just that they were slave ships. Eek.

I get your broad point though. People can get too caught up in prophecy and fate and the idea that stuff just happens in a predetermined way without human agency and choice. That's why I'm keen on the idea that these prophecies, if they unfold, will happen in a more mundane, coincidental, everyday sense and not unfold in a "grand gesture" sense. They happen when someone isn't actively trying to make them happen, if that makes sense.

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What's funny about Hardhome is that Mother Mole's vision did come true: Ships came to take them south, it's just that they were slave ships. Eek.

I get your broad point though. People can get too caught up in prophecy and fate and the idea that stuff just happens in a predetermined way without human agency and choice. That's why I'm keen on the idea that these prophecies, if they unfold, will happen in a more mundane, coincidental, everyday sense and not unfold in a "grand gesture" sense. They happen when someone isn't actively trying to make them happen, if that makes sense.

Well this happened with self fulfillment, and I think that the prophecies are too broad in most cases, and in the case of the Red Priests such as Melisandre, they can almost always be right by using the two following examples: Inescapability. "Daggers in the dark." is nothing special, and Melisandre says this for half the book before Jon is attacked. If it didn't, no doubt she would say it will, and she wouldn't be wrong. 2. 'Misunderstood' visions. Melisandre admits that the visions in the flames are far from perfect, so she would place all fault on herself if it didn't come true instead of the flames actually being incorrect. I don't rely on any prophecies in the slightest if it originates from humans. The prophecies of import are the ones that are symbolic, such as the dead direwolf (Ned) being killed by a broken antler (Robert's death and Baratheon succession) with 5 pups (Bran, Sansa, Arya, Rickon, and Robb) lost and wandering, each going their separate ways while one pup sets out first, alienated from the rest whose eyes opened first. (Jon not being a technical Stark, going to serve the Night's Watch upon realizing what the real threat is.)

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I love the idea of AA/PTWP/Last Hero, but I think the Stallion is different.

The Stallion That Will Mount The World sounds like it has nothing to do with saving the world, only conquring it.

If Dany had a baby who was the greatest warrior who ever lived, (and duel wielded a v. steel sword and an arakh) it would be so much cooler than dragons.

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I would like to think the prophecy is false. People should fend for themselves instead of hoping for a savior. Just look at all of those Wildlings dying at Hardhome, they went there in hope of someone who would rescue them, with nothing to rely on but a story. I think the only prophetic events that have any bearing in Martin's world are the direwolf pups, greenseeing, and fire seeing. Before you argue that AA or TPTWP or TSTMTW is different because so many people hold to the same tale, it may just be that they are completely different stories, their theme being common. I mean look at all of the ancient cultures with stories about snakes (Albeit with a negative attitude in most of them.), did they originate individually or was there once a single story that was changed? I hope Martin let's the prophecy down unfulfilled.

I agree. Particularly with TPTWP's prophecy... Egg's attempts to fulfill it got his whole family killed, Rhaegar's attempts to fulfill it got his whole family killed too; I really hope this is a pattern, rather than "Oh, don't worry, it's for real this time". Prophecies are not something you should bet your money on... on the other hand, the idea of someone actually forcing a prophecy that was meant for someone else and succeeding is oddly appealing.

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I think that the Stallion Who Mounts the World, Azor Ahai reborn, and the Prince Who Was Promised are all one and the same. The Last Hero actually seems to have been a real person, so I don't think Old Nan's story was a prophecy. If any of the characters are the Last Hero, then it's clearly Bran.

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I think that the Stallion Who Mounts the World, Azor Ahai reborn, and the Prince Who Was Promised are all one and the same. The Last Hero actually seems to have been a real person, so I don't think Old Nan's story was a prophecy. If any of the characters are the Last Hero, then it's clearly Bran.

I said that it wasn't a prophecy, but rather a historical legend (and Nan's always right). I still think they're all the same people. The Last Hero and Azor Ahai especially seem like two cultural versions of the same basic story — hero rises up to defeat evil/darkness during the Long Night. It's just that the Last Hero is more straightforward (the likely result of staying put and not going through too many linguistic adaptations) while the Azor Ahai myth seems to have obviously been affected by Asshai's fire obsession.

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A glowing sword with no heat, All these theories are interesting, the only thing I know for sure is that it is not Stannis. Im not sure if it is Bran either.

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How can you say its not BRAN he is the only person looking for the children of the forest. He has a DOG, HORSE and regular steel sword that will break if he fight an Other. Hasn't happened yet i know but just wait

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The last Hero fought the other with a sword of DragongSteel/Valyrian Steel

Azor Ahia fought them with LIGHTBRINGER/DAWN not Valyrian Steel

We don't know if dragonsteel = Valyrien steel.

It could be that dragon refers to fire/comet/meteorite. And then, it could be Dawn. Or a real dragon, actually.

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