LifeRuiner Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Is Rhaego alive? No. It didn't happen then.I've always thought it could be her dragons. Specifically, Drogon as he seems to have chosen her as a rider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabronius Maximus Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Are the Shadowlands covered with snow?Unless there's some magical white grass that kills other grass, then yeah snow is a fair bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter's Knight Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I did it says "the prince""Prince" has been used for female rulers as well as male-Elizabeth I used to call herself a prince for instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabronius Maximus Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 TSWMTW is either Dany or Drogon, I think there's really no one else who'd fit. But it doesn't sound saviour-like or anything close to that. The vision in the HotU Dany had was of a silver-haired, copper skinned guy (likely Rhaego had he lived) standing in front of a burning city, no doubt of his doing. And 'mounting the world' with the world as a khalasar sounds more like a conquest than saving the world. So I don't know if this is one of those prophecies of a saviour like AA/TwwP and the Last Hero are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogarrr Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 "Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow."This prophecy leads me to believe that Stannis may indeed be the next night king. I think Stannis has already given his seed and soul to Melisandre...Yes, the man has no shadow because he created the shadow babies, he also has blue eyes because that is a family trait. Black of hair with blue eyes. You're looking too deep into prophecy. The house of the undying simply showed that he had no shadow and had blue eyes, it said nothing about the night king. Stannis is not a villain, he is not going to bring 3 uncontrollable warheads to Westeros, he is not going to bring an army of pillaging, raping, murderers to Westeros, he is not going to slaughter countless innocents. In fact Stannis is going to save countless innocents.Dany fits the quota of a classic villain, cast out as a young child, having wrong ideas cast into her head about the evilness of a certain family we all know and love and the greatness of a certain man we all know was an absolute nut job. She was then sold to a savage as little more than chattel, the same savages she then planned to bring to Westeros. She then went through an incredibly traumatic loss of the man she believed she loved, the only man she ever came into contact with. She's an incredibly damaged individual and she now has access to the only 3 nukes in the world. And you support her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Draper Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 But as far as we know she can't have children...Not true. If a woman bleeds down South she's either just had a miscarriage or a period .... I guess she could have been stabbed...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeRuiner Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 She's an incredibly damaged individual and she now has access to the only 3 nukes in the world. And you support her.I don't even agree with TWK's points, but hello judgement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogarrr Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I don't even agree with TWK's points, but hello judgement.I think she needs help more than anything, and she's not going to get that help by razing a continent to the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winterfellian Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I don't think she will end up as the main villain but there is enough evidence pointing out that Dany's character will take a darker turn. Most of Dany's actions in ADWD shows an internal conflict between her wanting to do good and her inability to do so. Is the mother vs the dragon conflict of her own person and at the end of the book it seems that after trying and failing to play the mother she chooses the dragon. Like she repeats herself-Dragons don't plant.About the stallion prophecy am on the camp that believes that the real prophecy was probably about Dany or Drogon and not Rhaegal. However I fail to see how is this is evidence of her becoming a white figure to the contrary. The very world defining the role of the stallion-mounts- speaks of subjugation, not salvation.Also, it is very clear in AGOT that the Dothraki, like dragons (2 very defining aspects of her identity) do not plant. They do not build; they take. In the whole of Dany's arch in ADWD we see Dany trying to build a new Mereen, and trying to conciliate different factions and failing in the end. She set out to become a liberator for the slaves and ended up married to a former slaver and acclaimed "mother" by the very people she considered her enemy (scene of the fighting pits). After this and her time off in the Dothraki sea looks like she will realize that negating her dragon side has brought her nothing and will be ready to embrace her fire and blood heritage. Again, this doesn't make me think of a white knight.She might be redeemed, but am willing to bet she will play a dark part before the books are over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Rayne Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 She's going to arrive the same way as Aegon the Conqueror did. :cheers:Let her come then, come in all her power and glory. For in the final hour, all must serve the One True King. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third World King Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Unless there's some magical white grass that kills other grass, then yeah snow is a fair bet.I disagree, but I digress.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeRuiner Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I think she needs help more than anything, and she's not going to get that help by razing a continent to the ground.I disagree with the premise that Dany is horribly damaged. Not more than most in these books, and she isn't written as someone unhinged or needing extensive therapy, in modern understanding. The writer passes no such judgment on her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogarrr Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I disagree with the premise that Dany is horribly damaged.She's a paranoid wreck who in her last scene truly shows madness imo, stumbling through a waste less muttering fire and blood to yourself. Anyone who has gone through what she's gone through would need extensive therapy and I would feel the same for any 13 year old girl (and she is a girl) who's has had to go through that. I would also not want that woman as my queen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danm_999 Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I disagree with the premise that Dany is horribly damaged. Not more than most in these books, and she isn't written as someone unhinged or needing extensive therapy, in modern understanding. The writer passes no such judgment on her.She does have some moments where her anger takes over and impedes her judgement in a manner similar to how Aerys' anger is described, or Viserys' "waking the dragon" incidents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogarrr Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 She does have some moments where her anger takes over and impedes her judgement in a manner similar to how Aerys' anger is described, or Viserys' "waking the dragon" incidents.More moments than you should possibly get from a prospective leader. She needs to find an outlet for said anger, like say... grinding her teeth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brony Stark Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Let her come then, come in all her power and glory. For in the final hour, all must serve the One True King.And his name is Stannis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third World King Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Yes, the man has no shadow because he created the shadow babies, he also has blue eyes because that is a family trait. Black of hair with blue eyes. You're looking too deep into prophecy. The house of the undying simply showed that he had no shadow and had blue eyes, it said nothing about the night king. I do not think you fully understand what the prophecy means, a man who is unable to cast any shadow is dead. To cast a shadow, you need to give up your seed and part of your life-force/soul, and since Stannis is described as having no shadow, it could only mean one thing: his soul has been taken by Melisandre. Stannis is not a villain, he is not going to bring 3 uncontrollable warheads to Westeros, he is not going to bring an army of pillaging, raping, murderers to Westeros, he is not going to slaughter countless innocents. In fact Stannis is going to save countless innocents.Dany fits the quota of a classic villain, cast out as a young child, having wrong ideas cast into her head about the evilness of a certain family we all know and love and the greatness of a certain man we all know was an absolute nut job. She was then sold to a savage as little more than chattel, the same savages she then planned to bring to Westeros. She then went through an incredibly traumatic loss of the man she believed she loved,the only man she ever came into contact with. She's an incredibly damaged individual and she now has access to the only 3 nukes in the world. And you support her.Of course, Stannis Baratheon is the darling of Westeros. By hiring 20 000 "rapists, murderers and plunderers" to Westeros, he's going to save countless lives. Did I miss anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogarrr Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I do not think you fully understand what the prophecy means, a man who is unable to cast any shadow is dead. To cast a shadow, you need to give up part of your life-force/soul, and since Stannis is described as having no shadow, it means all his life-force/soul has been taken by Melisandre.Of course, Stannis Baratheon is the darling of Westeros. By hiring 20 000 "rapists, murderers and plunderers" to Westeros, he's going to save countless lives. Did I miss anything?Yes, you missed the fact that those "murderers and plunderers" are not Dothraki. Dothraki are brutal to an extent that no mercenary company could ever be. Also note that he is going to hire these from Braavos, a city renowned for its hatred of Slavery so these mercenaries will not be slavers.And no Stannis is not the darling of Westeros, but yes he's going to save more lives by being in the north than anyone else will by being in the south... or did you forget about the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeRuiner Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 She's a paranoid wreck who in her last scene truly shows madness imo, stumbling through a waste less muttering fire and blood to yourself. Anyone who has gone through what she's gone through would need extensive therapy and I would feel the same for any 13 year old girl (and she is a girl) who's has had to go through that. I would also not want that woman as my queen.In the Dothraki sea, she was starved, sick from the unclean water, and possibly miscarrying. Exhastion =/= a case of mental illness. Also, not all difficulties and ordeals break you, both in real life and in Martin's books. I would be very surprised, judging by how he is writing her, if she turns out to be mad or a cardboard villain in the next books. That said, I hope that her character will remain complex and wouldn't turn into the straight-up hero.I'm not even being a Dany's apologist, but there is this board's dearest wish and there's reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogarrr Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 I don't take her for a cardboard cut out villain either, I just think that she takes after her father in more ways than she possibly should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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