Lannister or Tyrell?

[Fat Mac]

Lannisters... at least they're honest when it comes to who they are.

[King Aemon I]

Lannisters... at least they're honest when it comes to who they are.

Hah..

[Fat Mac]

Hah..

Well look at it this way

-Tywin is hated amongst the people of King's Landing: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Jaime is hated amongst practically everybody: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Cersei is hated amongst most of King's Landing and probably everywhere else too: She knows this and doesn't try to deny it

Meanwhile you have Margaery and the Queen of Thorns, who at first seem all smiles and flowers, and in the end they're just as bad as the Lannisters. Dontos said as much, and he was right. But everyone knows the Lannisters are bad, and they don't try to play it otherwise.

[Lady Lea]

Well look at it this way

-Tywin is hated amongst the people of King's Landing: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Jaime is hated amongst practically everybody: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Cersei is hated amongst most of King's Landing and probably everywhere else too: She knows this and doesn't try to deny it

Meanwhile you have Margaery and the Queen of Thorns, who at first seem all smiles and flowers, and in the end they're just as bad as the Lannisters. Dontos said as much, and he was right. But everyone knows the Lannisters are bad, and they don't try to play it otherwise.

They really aren't as bad as the Lannisters. We have no word of any Tyrells sending people off to be tortured, letting serial rapists loose among the common folk, hiring depraved mercenaries, destroying entire Houses and having little children killed, orchestrating gang rapes, forcing children to be married against their will, etc etc etc. The Tyrells are schemers, but that is a far cry from all those crimes.

[King Aemon I]

Well look at it this way

-Tywin is hated amongst the people of King's Landing: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Jaime is hated amongst practically everybody: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Cersei is hated amongst most of King's Landing and probably everywhere else too: She knows this and doesn't try to deny it

Meanwhile you have Margaery and the Queen of Thorns, who at first seem all smiles and flowers, and in the end they're just as bad as the Lannisters. Dontos said as much, and he was right. But everyone knows the Lannisters are bad, and they don't try to play it otherwise.

They all have reasons for that, and they don't deny the reasons, but some even embrace it.. Cersei loves that fear commonfolk had for her, Tywin said they need that for ruling them, as if Rhaegar ever needed that... And I hate Lannisters for their incest as well.(No, I'm not one of the people who says that every idea is to be

Tyrells are at least more honest, by not taking the throne because they know they don't have a claim by blood, even though they're sure that Joffrey and Tommen doesn't as well... I think they care for the lives that could suffer if they want to take Lannisters by force...

[Axrendale]

To all the people who say that they prefer the Tyrells because they are somehow 'nicer' than the Lannisters... are you joking?!

This is a family that keeps Randyll Tarly on a leash to do their dirty work for them, and thinks nothing of strategic murder to get their way. They may not have compiled a list of misdeeds to match the Lannisters thus far, but I'd say that is far more owing to lack of opportunity than lack of willingness.

Back to the question at hand, the family that can produce Tywin, Kevan, Tyrion, and Jaime easily gets my vote. The Tyrells may have more soldiers and almost as much money, but the Lannisters easily make up for it by having the better leaders (I'll overlook Cersei and her rotten eldest son in favor of their more formidable relatives).

I rather think that Genna Lannister would be a good match for the Queen of Thorns if they ever met.

[Winter's Ghost]

Tyrells

[Axrendale]

Not to mention, they are much more sophisticated and have way better taste than the tacky Lannisters.

A family whose patriarch likes to flaunt a giant chair shaped like a hand after he becomes HotK and builds giant towers just for the sake of making them bigger than anyone else's, whose matriarch goes around with a pair of giants named 'Left' and 'Right' for bodyguards, and whose youngest son dresses up in jewel-encrusted armor with a cape of flowers, is in no position to accuse anyone of being tacky or lacking sophistication.

[Lady Lea]

To all the people who say that they prefer the Tyrells because they are somehow 'nicer' than the Lannisters... are you joking?!

This is a family that keeps Randyll Tarly on a leash to do their dirty work for them, and thinks nothing of strategic murder to get their way. They may not have compiled a list of misdeeds to match the Lannisters thus far, but I'd say that is far more owing to lack of opportunity than lack of willingness.

Back to the question at hand, the family that can produce Tywin, Kevan, Tyrion, and Jaime easily gets my vote. The Tyrells may have more soldiers and almost as much money, but the Lannisters easily make up for it by having the better leaders (I'll overlook Cersei and her rotten eldest son in favor of their more formidable relatives).

I rather think that Genna Lannister would be a good match for the Queen of Thorns if they ever met.

What "dirty work" does Tarly do other than command armies and ride into battle (you know, like a bannerman is supposed to do)?

The Tyrells "strategically murdered" the worst tyrant Westeros had known since the Mad King; the Lannisters "strategically murdered" Robb and Cat, plus hundreds of Stark bannermen and soldiers, and then they defiled their corpses... ok.

I doubt Genna Frey would be a match for the Queen of Thorns. Genna was a Lannister who married a Frey, and she couldn't even sway Tytos Lannister (the most notoriously pliant Lannister lord ever) to get a better match. The QoT was a Redwyne, certainly a less powerful house than Lannister, and she was supposed to marry into the royal family, but in the end ended up deciding to marry the High Lord of the Reach. She's got game.

A family whose patriarch likes to flaunt a giant chair shaped like a hand after he becomes HotK and builds giant towers just for the sake of making them bigger than anyone else's, whose matriarch goes around with a pair of giants named 'Left' and 'Right' for bodyguards, and whose youngest son dresses up in jewel-encrusted armor with a cape of flowers, is in no position to accuse anyone of being tacky or lacking sophistication.

I was not aware that having bodyguards was tacky. Wait, didn't Tyrion have unwashed savages as bodyguards?

[Axrendale]

What "dirty work" does Tarly do other than command armies and ride into battle (you know, like a bannerman is supposed to do)?

You're kidding, right? Don't you remember what he did to his eldest son? Or the mass executions he carried out at Bitterbridge?

Tarly would have had no problem doing most of the things that the Lannisters do and then some. He just hasn't been required to... yet.

I doubt Genna Frey would be a match for the Queen of Thorns. Genna was a Lannister who married a Frey, and she couldn't even sway Tytos Lannister (the most notoriously pliant Lannister lord ever) to get a better match. The QoT was a Redwyne, certainly a less powerful house than Lannister, and she was supposed to marry into the royal family, but in the end ended up deciding to marry the High Lord of the Reach. She's got game.

Genna throughout her appearances in AFFC shows herself to be a shrewd judge of character and a formidable personality, who commands sufficient respect that people are fine with her taking part in a council of war. The fact that her father was less tolerant of her preferences for a husband than Olenna's was is certainly no reason to dismiss her.

I was not aware that having bodyguards was tacky. Wait, didn't Tyrion have unwashed savages as bodyguards?

Having bodyguards is fine. Having scary-looking men who are fearsome fighters is also fine. Having giant identical twins named Left and Right follow you around just for the heck of it... it may not be 'tacky' per se, but does not strike me as an example of sophistication either.

[Silent Sparrow]

That's a tough one... I think I'd have to say Lannister because Genna and Jaime make me laugh more than the Queen of Thorns.

[Lady Sansa Stark]

The Lannisters, because I know what they are and what they want. The Tyrells are all feigned kindness and stuff.

I'd support the Lannisters, kill them afterwards and proclaim Stannis Baratheon king.

[Sweet-N-SourRobin]

I'd support the Lannisters, kill them afterwards and proclaim Stannis Baratheon king.

This is pretty much exactly what the Tyrells are doing (albeit with a different king in mind).

[Lady Lea]

You're kidding, right? Don't you remember what he did to his eldest son? Or the mass executions he carried out at Bitterbridge?

And the Tyrells had nothing to do with that. Or do you think they sent him a raven a week, just to make sure Randyll was treating Sam extra-badly?

The Tyrells aren't babysitters for their bannermen.

When were there mass executions at Bitterbridge? Can you provide some quotes?

[Sand Snake No. 9]

Ah, the Lannisters: their men are pigs, their women are faithless, and their children are bastards. What a team!

I'll take Tyrell, thank you. I love a good garden.

[Axrendale]

When were there mass executions at Bitterbridge? Can you provide some quotes?

See ACOK, chapter 44. After Renly's death, Tarly seized control of the camp at Bitterbridge, and had a great many of those who showed signs of favoring Stannis put to the sword (including many of the Florents).

[Pod The Impaler]

The Tyrells are definitely the better choice, by far. Mace is a dolt, but overall the family (for all their ambition) is not as nakedly treacherous, nor as inwardly weird and creepy.

Mind you, if you're the brand new king Robert Baratheon, you probably can't imagine choosing the Tyrells, because they stayed under the dragon banner right to the end of your rebellion. You would not trust them, the wounds of the war would be too fresh. (Ironically, this points to the fact they are less likely to be turncloaks than the Lannisters.)

Of course, if you're really young king Robert, your first question is "Who has the most comely daughter?" and your second is "Who has the best wines ?" If you can find some hot chick from the Arbor to marry, that's the best choice - preferably someone who doesn't get resentful when you whisper "Lyanna" in her ear.

[Lady Lea]

See ACOK, chapter 44. After Renly's death, Tarly seized control of the camp at Bitterbridge, and had a great many of those who showed signs of favoring Stannis put to the sword (including many of the Florents).

oh, so traitors. For which the punishment is death.

At least he put them to the sword, rather than nail antlers to their heads and catapult them over walls...

[Sweet-N-SourRobin]

Tywin Lannister kept trying to make his kids be what he wanted them to be. Jaime's in the Kingsguard? Well he's still my heir, somehow. Tyrion's a dwarf? Fuck him.

Mace (and Olenna) pretty much lets the kids be who they are, and work from there. Willas is crippled? Give him a desk job. Loras is gay? Put him in the kingsguard.

To put it in sports terms, The Lannisters are trying to adjust the players to fit the game plan they have, and The Tyrells are adjusting the game plan to fit the players they have.

If Mace and Tywin switched places, Mace would be fostering Tyrion with grandma and telling him to absorb her knowledge like a sponge. Meanwhile Tywin would be screaming at Willas to suck it up, put his armor on, and get back on the field.

That's why the Tyrells are winning. They, seemingly, like each other enough to all work together (look at the way Margaery's cousins follow her around like The Secret Service so she's never alone and there's always abetting witnesses). Tywin and his kids were never able to do that.

[Batman]

Well look at it this way

-Tywin is hated amongst the people of King's Landing: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Jaime is hated amongst practically everybody: He knows this and doesn't try to deny it

-Cersei is hated amongst most of King's Landing and probably everywhere else too: She knows this and doesn't try to deny it

Meanwhile you have Margaery and the Queen of Thorns, who at first seem all smiles and flowers, and in the end they're just as bad as the Lannisters. Dontos said as much, and he was right. But everyone knows the Lannisters are bad, and they don't try to play it otherwise.

A lot of being King is image. Renly was a clown, but the people couldnt see past his looks. Its probably a good thing that the Tyrells are able to hide their bad sides from the public. In private I am sure its a bad thing if the king is not able to see who they really are (Tommen is screwed) but a clever King would at least be able to limit them.