The Crackpot Tyrion Conspiracy

[JonCon's Red Beard]

The plot thickens...

He named Lolly's son Tyrion. He's trying to make a cult. A Tyrion cult.

[MasterJack]

He named Lolly's son Tyrion. He's trying to make a cult. A Tyrion cult.

If Bronn was anyone pawn, this one indicate it wasnt a Lannister (Tywin or Cercei).

[Qhorin Fivehands]

He named Lolly's son Tyrion. He's trying to make a cult. A Tyrion cult.

To eventually overthrow the entire Essos and rule the Kingdom of Tyrion.

[Stannis Iron Baratheon]

If Bronn was anyone pawn, this one indicate it wasnt a Lannister (Tywin or Cercei).

Or could it be...I don't know, Varys? Did someone say that already, yup I did.

[Woman of War]

And why should Varys or any other mastermind take any interest in Tyrion from so early on, some random dwarf boy?

There are other intelligent young men, maybe even some of high nobility. There are other young Lannisters.

What would make Tyrion more useful than all those , where could he be special?

Extremely intelligent as most important reason? Too much countered by his psychological issues due to childhood traumata to make him a stable factor to count on

Extensive Dragon knowledge? Some maesters could master that, Varys (or someone else with longterm plans) could have found a learned man and set him on that task as scientific project.

Being a dwarf, a born cripple? So far Tyrion's handicap has only been seen as reason for superstitious dislike, him being a curse and a punishment by the gods, to all around him. But in many cultures certain inborn handicaps mark the person as being special, being chosen by some supernatural force like gods or magical beings, not being cursed but on the contrary being blessed, a saviour or messianic character (the idea that a saviour character has to be a "good guy" is a very christian one, in most other religions a character like that is "morally neutral")

So having this birthmark would make Tyrion a "chosen one", unknowingly meant for a greater foreshadowed purpose by destiny and Her Majesty The Destiny would need a secret agent to make things go smoothly and that would be e.g. Varys. Having a character like Tyrion, who is so worldy and agnostic, as being confronted with something as uncontrollable as being born into a "destiny", that makes an interesting read. "Thomas Covenant aka Tyrion Lannister The Unbeliever"

But then - why not e.g. Penny or Groat? Penny may not be the brightest candle in the attic though I like her character but Groat must have been a competent guy.

The only answer I have is that something is off with Tyrion's ancestry, the notorious T is a T theory comes to mind. I personally am not a big fan of that theory since it diminishes the Tywin-Tyrion father-son tragedy.

But this is the way to take all factors into account.

We do not have to establish how the secret agent of destiny dealt with getting Tyrion where he wants him to be but why at all.

1. Extremely intelligent

2. Dragon knowledge

3. His birthmark as sign of being blessed or chosen

4. His Targ heritage

All aspects alone are not worth anything but together they are good for a nice little crackpot. Dany, Jon or Aegon may be of Targaeryen blood but they do not have the "birthmark" (link to the children of the forest?).

Highly crackpot, I know. It could just as well be all coincidence and no big plan behind it. Instead it could be the very wordly and nonmagical view on Tyrion as character, precisely the one without destiny, and his intellectual nonmagical learning of Dragon and other lore that makes the difference, as nice contrast to all that headclouding magic, prophecies and religious superstition, brain fog that turns out to be the big red herring.

And a big omnipotent puppet dancemaster behind all that, may it be Varys or someone else? Too much conspiracy theory maybe.

Maybe it would be nice if Tyrion comes on top in the end as nothing but - himself, no AA, PtwP, secret Targ or whatever. The man who has overcome his past and now shapes his own life and makes his own decisions(umm, too much American dream?)

[Archmaester]

Love love love this theory! Yes there are some holes in it as people have pointed out, but I for one would love this to be true... For GRRMs favourite character to have simply been one long manipulation and game between Varys and LF, it would be delicious and genius!

The big question is - what's the next move?

[Woman of War]

I would for sure take LF out, he is deeply within the game of thrones but when it comes to bigger topics, mythical magical forces, the Others, dragons etc. he will be clearly out of his depth and fail, this is not his habitat. From the gameplayers we have already met only Varys could fill the role of linking the Game with the magical elements of the story.

But there are so many unresolved questions around the Citadel. The Master of Destiny might sit there.

[MasterJack]

I would for sure take LF out, he is deeply within the game of thrones but when it comes to bigger topics, mythical magical forces, the Others, dragons etc. he will be clearly out of his depth and fail, this is not his habitat. From the gameplayers we have already met only Varys could fill the role of linking the Game with the magical elements of the story.

But there are so many unresolved questions around the Citadel. The Master of Destiny might sit there.

I think the fight for the IT and the fight against the Others might be 2 differents war with differents players until the end.What I mean is that the one defeating the Other and/or Dragon will be Heros but not necessary Kings. And Varys seems to be a anti-magic loyalist i doubt he will ally himself with anything with Magic in it.

[Woman of War]

I think the fight for the IT and the fight against the Others might be 2 differents war with differents players until the end.What I mean is that the one defeating the Other and/or Dragon will be Heros but not necessary Kings.

I think it would make better writing if these two plots are led together in the end and merge.

And Varys seems to be a anti-magic loyalist i doubt he will ally himself with anything with Magic in it.

That's what we are meant to believe.

[Silverin]

I think it would make better writing if these two plots are led together in the end and merge.

I disagree. there is so many stories where the hero ends up as the king/queen at the end. That is why the main theories for the IT are Jon and Dany. I kinda hope neither will be, or there won't be an IT at the end.

That's what we are meant to believe.

I actually think it is the true. Not everyone is happy for magic. The bravoosi depite banning slavery and being compeletly anti-savery, are not happy for Dany because it was dragons in the first place who enslaved the people of Essos.

I actually think it is interesting that there are forces who are aware of magic, but work against it. If I remember correctly the CotF told Bran that both the CotF and direwolves will eventually disappear or something. makes me think the forces who are working for eliminating the magic might be quite succesful.

If you think Varys is not against magic what do you think his agenda is?

I think some of the theories are overcomplicate things. some things are what they appear. For example in the book when Robb went to south Osha said he should have gone to North, you could have said it was just said because it wanted us to think it is a mistake. but it was a mistake.

Btw:

I don't think tyrion was special at the beginning to Varys.

But as far as playing goes he was played by Varys to execute the Antler Men and further bankrupting the kingdom.

He was played by LF and Olenna as well, making him a scapegoat. Though with his "badass" Joffrey slaps and "witty oneliners" against him he sure painted a big nice target on his back.

I really like this duality that an action can be both seen as how he has guts lecturing the Crown Prince, and how that is the future king you idiot, you are digging your future grave there. Even Sandor remarked Joffrey will remember and by the end tyrion himself realised that he needs to get away from KL for his own safety because once Joff comes of age nothing will protect him.

[Woman of War]

I think the endgame concerning the IT will not be more than a relatively less important byproduct of the general story - although I am a big fan of courtly intrigue.

Varys' agenda and position concerning magic - frankly, I have no idea. He is so wonderfully enigmatic, one of the best characters, much better than LF.

Actually Tyrion was on his way to unveil the way the kingdom was bancrupted and to find out about Bernie Madoff Baelish.

I really like this duality that an action can be both seen as how he has guts lecturing the Crown Prince, and how that is the future king you idiot, you are digging your future grave there

yes, he could not win here. He doomed himself and he knew it.

No, but I do not really see a big Varys conspiracy, how should hae have convinced Tywin to make Tyrion hand? Did someone organize Cat meeting Tyrion on the road? Tyrion not getting killed by Lysa through his own idea of trial by combat? Blackwater? Oberyn fighting the mountain and losing by bad luck? Jaime back in time to save Tyrion? Telling about Tysha? No, all this is too much.

Martin may write a magical, mythical "destiny" for Tyrion into the story but I do not believe so. I think Tyrion is the typical character who will in the end finally manage to become the master of his fate and the captain of his soul, a "happy ending" by no means guarateed

[Stannis Iron Baratheon]

No, but I do not really see a big Varys conspiracy, how should hae have convinced Tywin to make Tyrion hand? Did someone organize Cat meeting Tyrion on the road? Tyrion not getting killed by Lysa through his own idea of trial by combat? Blackwater? Oberyn fighting the mountain and losing by bad luck? Jaime back in time to save Tyrion? Telling about Tysha? No, all this is too much.

Martin may write a magical, mythical "destiny" for Tyrion into the story but I do not believe so. I think Tyrion is the typical character who will in the end finally manage to become the master of his fate and the captain of his soul, a "happy ending" by no means guarateed

Im not saying Varys is the all controling puppetmaster, Im saying that Shae and Bron are his agents and Varys perhaps set up certain events like helping to find him guilty at the trial by himself and shae testifiing, having his fallback champion and on of his only firends refuse him, bringing him to the bottom of the tower of the hand where and placing shae in his fathers bed so he would have all of those motivations to kill tywin.