We have already seen the best of ASOIAF

[Darth Tywin]

Does anyone else think that we have already seen the best of this series? In large part because it has taken so long to finish? I mean argue all you want, but the series seems to be gearing up for a Danny and Jon alliance against the white walkers.

I have never been a big Danny fan and even though I like Jon I hope he stays with the NW. I do think Danny gets what she wanted in the end which basically leaves me hoping for redemption or happy endings for characters I like e.g. Davos, Tyrion, Barristan (maybe actually dieing defending his queen since he's failed to do that twice), and the Starks in general.

I just feel like it is going to be very anticlimactic for whoever wins the throne which will probaly be Danny, Aegon, or Jon.

[QuickReviveGuy]

Knowing GRRM it won't be so cut in dry. I think the best is to come. Dany WILL lose something Daario, Barristoan, a dragon. The last books will be good IMO

[The Drunkard]

Why would you on the one hand be pessimistic about GRRM producing a clichéd, boring ending, and on the other hope for redemptive, happy endings for all your favourite characters?

[Darth Tywin]

Why would you on the one hand be pessimistic about GRRM producing a clichéd, boring ending, and on the other hope for redemptive, happy endings for all your favourite characters?

Well I'm rooting for my favorites because I think the end is going to be anticlimactic. I wouldn't mind if my favorites died, I wouldn't say I don't like the books anymore. That's just what I'm rooting for at this point because I don't really care for any of the contenders. The one I do like Jon I hope he stays with the NW

[Satin fetch me a cock!]

I am afraid you are right. The series is obviously great, but it has gone down hill with the last two books. It's clear something is going on but I'm not sure what. I think the series should have been 2 or 3 independent trilogies vice one large series.

After the war of 5 kings would have been a perfect time to reset the series. Then he could have went forth with the 5 year gap and started fresh.

But he is the great writer and knows way better than I do and I have no doubt it will tie together at some point.

[Monctonvike]

I think it will be bittersweet as GRRM as mentioned some of the overall arc we will have know but, its how everything and everyone else gets there. I think there will be a number of suprises. They really seem to be building towards a climax. I imagine things will be very bleak by the end of TWOW should this really be the second last book

[The Wolves]

I hope not

[Northernmonkey]

I disagree.

For a starters there's far more to ASOIAF than who ends up on the Iron Throne. Personally I don't really care whether it's Jon, Dany or Aegon who ends up on the Iron Throne, it's the journey and the way it's written that's important. People shouldn't just look at the books in black and white terms.

And although AFFC and ADWD might be weaker than the other books, I actually enjoyed them more. I love the way GRRM widened the story and brought in the Ironborn, the Dornish and Aegon. I actually got more involved with series the further it went on.

If you're worried that we've seen the best of ASOIAF, just sit down and imagine how you'll feel on the day TWOW comes out. It's going to be amazing.

[Darth Tywin]

I am afraid you are right. The series is obviously great, but it has gone down hill with the last two books. It's clear something is going on but I'm not sure what. I think the series should have been 2 or 3 independent trilogies vice one large series.

After the war of 5 kings would have been a perfect time to reset the series. Then he could have went forth with the 5 year gap and started fresh.

But he is the great writer and knows way better than I do and I have no doubt it will tie together at some point.

Yeah I'm a fan obviously since I'm on here and I think he's a great writer and the series had got me to start leisurely reading again which is awesome, but I just feel like the endings going to leave a lot to be said. I know I will enjoy the next two books, but it can be said for most series that the end is tough to live up to the beginning or middle.

[Darth Tywin]

I disagree.

For a starters there's far more to ASOIAF than who ends up on the Iron Throne. Personally I don't really care whether it's Jon, Dany or Aegon who ends up on the Iron Throne, it's the journey and the way it's written that's important. People shouldn't just look at the books in black and white terms.

If you're worried that we've seen the best of ASOIAF, just sit down and imagine how you'll feel on the day TWOW comes out. It's going to be amazing.

Well I really do enjoy the journey and I like the chapters that people might consider boring like Davos, Brienne, Bran, and Theon because it's not all about my throne my throne kings landing my people my children. Feel like the iron throne is going to be a very anticlimactic finish and I get tired of just hearing them all bitch about it.

And I will be very excited the day TWOW comes out no doubt.

[Gallivant]

I disagree.

For a starters there's far more to ASOIAF than who ends up on the Iron Throne. Personally I don't really care whether it's Jon, Dany or Aegon who ends up on the Iron Throne, it's the journey and the way it's written that's important. People shouldn't just look at the books in black and white terms.

And although AFFC and ADWD might be weaker than the other books, I actually enjoyed them more. I love the way GRRM widened the story and brought in the Ironborn, the Dornish and Aegon. I actually got more involved with series the further it went on.

If you're worried that we've seen the best of ASOIAF, just sit down and imagine how you'll feel on the day TWOW comes out. It's going to be amazing.

I agree. I like that ASOIAF is more like a convoluted history taking in all parts of Westeros and some of Essos than a straightforward epic narrative with a trite beginning, middle and climactic end. I love the sense of walkabout some of the POVs offer in AFFC and ADWD and enjoy learning about new destinations almost as much as the story itself. The more travelogue the better! I'd love for a POV character to visit Mantarys and the Demon Road and for someone to wind up in Qohor or Norvos or Myr or Lorath - indeed any of the Essos destinations we haven't yet visited. Even better would be some adventurous soul winding up in Yi Ti or Asshai or Sothyros... I'm fascinated by it all. It's a wonderfully realised world and I'd be more than content to have over the (so far) prescribed 7 books.

[Sword of the Morgan]

That's a pretty pessimistic view.

[Darth Tywin]

That's a pretty pessimistic view.

Yeah it is I'm glad you were able to pick up on that. I'm not gonna be happy if Danny sits the throne and I don't know enough about Aegon yet to be happy with him. GRRM got me to like other characters though in a short amount of time before, but we all know how that normally ends.

[Rippounet]

Does anyone else think that we have already seen the best of this series? In large part because it has taken so long to finish? I mean argue all you want, but the series seems to be gearing up for a Danny and Jon alliance against the white walkers.

I don't think the Jon & Dany thing will be that smooth.

So there's still a lot to "see" imho.

[Darth Tywin]

I don't think the Jon & Dany thing will be that smooth.

So there's still a lot to "see" imho.

Yeah but do you think if Jon is still alive and white walkers are invading the realm. That Danny won't step in to help out if she's in westeros? Jon looks like he will take whatever help he can get and it looks like Danny has aspirations to be a great queen of Westeros.

[Rrachel]

I don't agree with you... the last book ended with amazing plots and things that are just starting to happen... the Dornish plan is starting with the SS on it's way in KL, Dany is on a difficult new situation, Jon is maybe death or injured and a rebelion may start on the Wall, there's war happening on Meeren, Kevan just was murdered and there will be caos around the IT, the trial of Maergery and Cersei need to happen, the faith of the seven is getting stronger, they might be a religious war soon and well... the white walkers, winter is comming, the fight to get the dragons by Victarion and Mayrween... Aegon starting his conquer... do I need to keep going?

I think things are just building up to the climax.

[Rippounet]

Yeah but do you think if Jon is still alive and white walkers are invading the realm. That Danny won't step in to help out if she's in westeros?

Certainly. But they both will have a lot to deal with before -possibly- reaching that point, and there is a lot more happening than the white walkers in Westeros.

I think the main thing to consider is that while by now we may have a decent idea of how it might end, this is no reason to dismiss all the obstacles remaining. In fact, I still hope for a few plot twists before the end, and I want to be very careful about the whole "Jon&Dany" thing before I read the next book. Things could go wrong. This is ASOAIF after all.

[Jojen Pasta]

I think anyone who says that Feast and Dance were weak, need to reread. There is SO much going on in those two books, but if you're just reading as fast as you can to get to the end, you're going to miss all of it.

Thinking the next books are going to be weak based on Feast and Dance is kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy. The pay off in Winds is going to be based on how well you followed Feast and Dance. When you read those two books carefully, there's no way you could think that what is coming is going to be somehow weaker than the first half of the series.

[DreamSongs]

I think anyone who says that Feast and Dance were weak, need to reread. There is SO much going on in those two books, but if you're just reading as fast as you can to get to the end, you're going to miss all of it.

Thinking the next books are going to be weak based on Feast and Dance is kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy. The pay off in Winds is going to be based on how well you followed Feast and Dance. When you read those two books carefully, there's no way you could think that what is coming is going to be somehow weaker than the first half of the series.

:agree: Exactly.

Congrats on 1000 posts Ser Jaime. :cheers:

[Darth Tywin]

I don't agree with you... the last book ended with amazing plots and things that are just starting to happen... the Dornish plan is starting with the SS on it's way in KL, Dany is on a difficult new situation, Jon is maybe death or injured and a rebelion may start on the Wall, there's war happening on Meeren, Kevan just was murdered and there will be caos around the IT, the trial of Maergery and Cersei need to happen, the faith of the seven is getting stronger, they might be a religious war soon and well... the white walkers, winter is comming, the fight to get the dragons by Victarion and Mayrween... Aegon starting his conquer... do I need to keep going?

I think things are just building up to the climax.

Yeah....

1. Dorn just sent a Martell to kings landing.

2. Danny always has a new difficult situation in Essos

3. There just was a mutiny with the Nights Watch at Craster's Keep.

4. There just was a Patriarch of the Lannister family murdered through a secret tunnel I'm kings landing.

5. There has been a ton of chaos around the IT the whole series.

6. There just was a Lannister trial.

7. Faith of the Seven have my interst.

8. The white walkers have my interest but you have to think humanity prevails.

9. We don't exactly know what Marwin is up too.

10. Victarion another scorned brother working with a red priest to get/find/summon a dragon. Kind of like Stannjs early on.

11. Aegon is another siege of storms end.