The Young_Lion Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 As Dany's dragons will still only be a few years old during any future wars that Dany fights in, how effective will they be as weapons? Given that Drogon, the largest of the three, had to eat a horse where he killed it in the dothraki sea, because it was too heavy to carry, he cannot be more than ten or fifteen metres long, much smaller than any of Aegon's dragons at the time of the conquest. (Balerion was so large that he could have swallowed a mammoth whole). So are they going to be large enough to destroy armies and burn castles to the ground, or will they be too small to be as unstoppable as Aegon's dragons were? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 From what we know Meraxes, trained, old and huge, couldn't fly during a normal storm, so I am not sure how Dany's untrained, small and young dragons can not only fight even survive during LN2.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Vance II Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 Too small to be nearly the force Aegon's were. Drogon could raise some hell but nothing like Balerion. Plus they'd be super vulnerable to arrows at that size. Even full grown dragons have been downed by ground fire (forget which one though, not Meraxes who died of a scorpion bolt through the eye). I think they'll be more for shock and awe and a symbol of Targaryan power than the tip of her spear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Young_Lion Posted July 27, 2016 Author Share Posted July 27, 2016 It does call into serious question whether Daenerys would be able to launch a successful conquest of Westeros - her 8000 unsullied are not nearly enough, so without the support of several kingdoms (possibly the north, the vale and the reach), it seems unlikely that she can win the iron throne. More generally, many posters seem to have too much faith in dragons, and assume that they will decisively win every war they fight in, which does seem unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Vance II Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 8 minutes ago, The Young_Lion said: It does call into question whether Daenerys would be able to launch a conquest so successful that it could unite the seven kingdoms - her 8000 unsullied are not nearly enough, so without the support of several kingdoms (possibly the north, the vale and the reach), it seems unlikely that she can win the iron throne. There are dozens of threads about this exact topic. But yes, it does. She will *most likely* have tens of thousands of Dothraki and the Iron Fleet, so its not just the unsullied. And people just want Dany's Dragons to be the end-all on the battlefield. GRRM made it very clear that dragons have limitations (Meraxes). Lord, I hope I didn't make this into another "can Dany succeed" thread (granted it wasn't far off.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogonthedread Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 6 minutes ago, The Young_Lion said: It does call into question whether Daenerys would be able to launch a conquest so successful that it could unite the seven kingdoms - her 8000 unsullied are not nearly enough, so without the support of several kingdoms (possibly the north, the vale and the reach), it seems unlikely that she can win the iron throne. More generally, many posters seem to have too much faith in dragons, and assume that they will decisively win every war they fight in, which does seem unlikely. Actually no...many don't think that.. She will have unsullied and dothraki and seme alliances ( despite what her detractors think )...thats lot more than aegon the conqueror had ..and then there is dragons.. North is already suffered most and there still winter to come .. Dany so far haven't used dragons until they are needed and it will be the same in future as well.. gRRm has said many times that the dragons will become larger than they are and he had given them time to grow bigger..iam sure they will be bigger as they need to be when it's time to face WW .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogonthedread Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 5 minutes ago, Lord Vance II said: There are dozens of threads about this exact topic. But yes, it does. She will *most likely* have tens of thousands of Dothraki and the Iron Fleet, so its not just the unsullied. And people just want Dany's Dragons to be the end-all on the battlefield. GRRM made it very clear that dragons have limitations (Meraxes). Lord, I hope I didn't make this into another "can Dany succeed" thread (granted it wasn't far off.) At least dragons are the much more stronger defense when compared to swords and bows when it comes to wights and ww.. Just last week people were discussing how dragons are going to be greatest threat to humanity... Now we are back to dragons have limits and babies and can easily be defeated .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 28 minutes ago, The Young_Lion said: It does call into serious question whether Daenerys would be able to launch a successful conquest of Westeros - her 8000 unsullied are not nearly enough, so without the support of several kingdoms (possibly the north, the vale and the reach), it seems unlikely that she can win the iron throne. Dany still has her barbarians and Westeros in in bad shape. So I think that the Iron Throne will be a piece of cake for her. But at the end of the day what it matters is the Long Night and the Battle of the Dawn when her dragons will be not useless but will have very limited power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Vance II Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 10 minutes ago, Drogonthedread said: Just last week people were discussing how dragons are going to be greatest threat to humanity... Now we are back to dragons have limits and babies and can easily be defeated .. I have no idea how they could be seen as the greatest threat to humanity. If Dany had Balerion, the discussion would be totally different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogonthedread Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 2 minutes ago, Lord Vance II said: I have no idea how they could be seen as the greatest threat to humanity. If Dany had Balerion, the discussion would be totally different. Well according to GRrm drogon will become like Balerion ...and we are supposed to suspend the belief of him being only years old.. But we do know she has more numbers than Argon on balerion had and she is aegon come again and drogon baleriom come again.. And westerod is not in a good shape It's not even that people think that way annoys me but as I said in that thread the view from threat to babies keeps changing according to the topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 9 minutes ago, Lord Vance II said: I have no idea how they could be seen as the greatest threat to humanity. Because they haven't have done nothing good for the humanity, they were proved profitable for their masters who had used them to kill and enslave people. And because since they are fire they are extremities and the extremities are never a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Vance II Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 7 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said: Because they haven't have done nothing good for the humanity, they were proved profitable for their masters who had used them to kill and enslave people. And because since they are fire they are extremities and the extremities are never a good thing I mean "danger to humanity" sounds like people think they're going to band together and exterminate mankind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Young_Lion Posted July 27, 2016 Author Share Posted July 27, 2016 43 minutes ago, Lord Vance II said: There are dozens of threads about this exact topic. But yes, it does. She will *most likely* have tens of thousands of Dothraki and the Iron Fleet, so its not just the unsullied. And people just want Dany's Dragons to be the end-all on the battlefield. GRRM made it very clear that dragons have limitations (Meraxes). Lord, I hope I didn't make this into another "can Dany succeed" thread (granted it wasn't far off.) Sorry if this has been discussed repeatedly before. It was not intended to be about whether or not dany will succeed, but more specifically on the expected size of the dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 4 minutes ago, Lord Vance II said: I mean "danger to humanity" sounds like people think they're going to band together and exterminate mankind. The extremities are a danger. Those people who have died because of the dragons would more definitely see them as evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxxine Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 The size of the dragons are the biggest issue. Yet another issue caused by scrapping the 5 year gap. Due to their size the dragons aren't enough to be even close to threat that Aegon's were unless they have some miraculous unexplained growth spurt. So they won't be the trump card they were for Aegon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogonthedread Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 32 minutes ago, Lord Vance II said: I mean "danger to humanity" sounds like people think they're going to band together and exterminate mankind. Exactly. .last time we checked dragons were extinct and not humans.. It all comes down to humans ..you can enslave continents using dragons...hell people enslave continents and used to enslave even before dragons were born ( ghiscari).. But you can also use them to free the continent. So the greatest threat to humanity is humans themselves not some animals.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khal drogon Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 Her dragons are never going to be the size of Aegon's. That's why he is giving her a bigger army. If Westeros is united they would put up a good fight against Dany's army but a fractured Westeros can't. That's why GRRM has Euron who would be a real challenge for her army because magic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khal drogon Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 8 minutes ago, Maxxine said: The size of the dragons are the biggest issue. Yet another issue caused by scrapping the 5 year gap. Due to their size the dragons aren't enough to be even close to threat that Aegon's were unless they have some miraculous unexplained growth spurt. So they won't be the trump card they were for Aegon. But George accelerated dragon growth process to compensate the five year gap. He says they will grow as much as the story needs it. Anyways they were not meant to be the size of Aegon's dragons. Nor do she wants them for the purpose Aegon used them. Aegon used them to show his power to subjugate an entire continent. Dany will use them to push her claim. She doesn't need to intimidate lords into submission. She has to show she really is a legitimate dragon riding Targaryen and say Targs are back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[Deleted] Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 If Dany's dragons are able to act more or less normal in winter weather, they should be extremely effective against the wights, since they have been shown to be very flammable, and possibly the Others, since they seem to have a vulnerability to all things related to dragonfire (dragonglass, dragonsteel). As far as conquering Westeros goes, yeah, they are probably too small and vulnerable to arrows. We don't know what the effective range of dragonfire is, but I'd be willing to bet that if a dragon were to get close enough to use their fire, that would also put them in range of archers and definitely scorpions. Granted, they'd still be moving around a lot and so difficult to hit, but it'd only take one good shot to bring one down. They can be useful as an element of surprise, but as soon as people know to prepare for them, they won't be nearly as effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BricksAndSparrows Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 They can still rain fire from above... They may not have reached their potential yet, but if they behave, they are a HUGE advantage. I think that the dragons are going to end up getting warged. So with that direction and control, they will be extremely effective. And depending on the timeline, and how much time passes, they might get significantly larger. In short, once again, in answer to your question, I say "Very effective." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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