Whose going to protect the Frey's now?

[Elrick]

I can't help but remember the wed wedding in avid detail when I think back and wonder because I know that the Frey's only did this evil move due to the support from house Lannister. Now with Tywin pretty much murdered and the Lannister's very well on the verge of losing the crown is it possible that House Frey may very well be in a lot of trouble? I don't envision Stannis or Dany really embracing House Frey or should I say protecting house Frey if the Northern folk decide to revolt against them. Of course this may not really mean much because Dany hates the Starks so I doubt she'd care and Stannis's R'Hllor folk seem to think murder is okay and rejoiced at the news that Robb was murdered even though he acted upset when Jon was around about the news.

Anyway is it very likely that Frey's in butchering Robb and his men through guests right assured that he will get very little allies against any revolts that he might inherit?

[King Banhammer]

I don't think even Jaime will trouble to protect them. The Freys are really in a bad, bad position at this stage.

[AutomatedTeller]

That's all true... but who is going to step in? There's no north, now, and the Ironmen hold the only way south, anyway.

I think the Frey's are pretty secure for now.

[Kaitscralt]

That's all true... but who is going to step in? There's no north, now, and the Ironmen hold the only way south, anyway.

I think the Frey's are pretty secure for now.

Don't forget that Lady Stoneheart and the BwB are still taking out one Frey at a time, and eventually they may become so bold to make a move for the higher ups.

[Drogo]

they already made they're move to the higher ups at the end of Swords and Crows where they hang Petyr Pimple who was important and then at the end of Feast they kill Ser Rymam (that right? the frey heir who was getting drunk and fucking instead of doing his job). Those were two important Freys and I think there have been a few others from the closer family who also bit the bullet. but i'm a crazy person what do i know?

[Elrick]

Don't forget that Lady Stoneheart and the BwB are still taking out one Frey at a time, and eventually they may become so bold to make a move for the higher ups.

I think that their are several ways that this may come about. One the Blackfish may step in and join their ranks and than their are the smallfolk my feeling is that more and more of them will be trained by the brotherhood without banners and this means that they'll be able to join up with the bwb will step that much closer to achieving whatever their goals may be.

I want to add that the Greyjoys are going to find themselves in some trouble before too long but thats just a guess.

[Kaitscralt]

they already made they're move to the higher ups at the end of Swords and Crows where they hang Petyr Pimple who was important and then at the end of Feast they kill Ser Rymam (that right? the frey heir who was getting drunk and fucking instead of doing his job). Those were two important Freys and I think there have been a few others from the closer family who also bit the bullet. but i'm a crazy person what do i know?

This is true, but when I meant the higher ups I suppose I meant the "higher higher ups" -- ie; the BwB may leave the forest and abandoned villages and pillage a populated and armed Frey city.

This of course is assuming their ranks are swelled at some point.

[Jaak]

Wonder how the Freys are going to get along with the Paramount Lord of Riverlands. Especially if there is a dispute about Frey inheritance....

[Pink Walder Frey]

Wonder how the Freys are going to get along with the Paramount Lord of Riverlands. Especially if there is a dispute about Frey inheritance....

I think Petyr will not care much about them, only turn the things to his favour - but I think he'll not have to deal too much with them, they are not important enough for him.

Also Jaime made a point calling them twice a traitor as the other Riverland Lords...

Noone will care about my poor family :(. The Twins will burn before ASOIAF ends and many of my kin will be slain.

[Jaak]

I think Petyr will not care much about them, only turn the things to his favour - but I think he'll not have to deal too much with them, they are not important enough for him.

Leading the Riverlands lords against Freys, which they want to do, would give the Paramount Lord some influence and supporters.

If there is a dispute between Freys, supporting the weaker party (among the Freys) would give a good pretext to put most Freys in their place.

[Lord Varys]

If Petyr is going to press his claim for the Riverlands any time in the future, he could put himself at the head of an anti-Frey-movement. After all, he honestly had no hand in the Red Wedding, and as guardian of the presumed Lady of Winterfell he would have the perfect pretext to cleanse the Riverlands from its foul weasel brood on his way North.

And there is actually no way that the Freys and Littlefinger/Sansa/Harry are able to maintain a peace with House Frey after they reveal Sansa's true identity. Learning that there is still a Stark heir with Tully blood around, might be enough to unite the complete Riverlands against the Freys. They will never rule the Riverlands, nor will they be able to maintain their position as a house. They might very well be completely destroyed in the end.

[King Banhammer]

If Petyr is going to press his claim for the Riverlands any time in the future, he could put himself at the head of an anti-Frey-movement. After all, he honestly had no hand in the Red Wedding, and as guardian of the presumed Lady of Winterfell he would have the perfect pretext to cleanse the Riverlands from its foul weasel brood on his way North.

And there is actually no way that the Freys and Littlefinger/Sansa/Harry are able to maintain a peace with House Frey after they reveal Sansa's true identity. Learning that there is still a Stark heir with Tully blood around, might be enough to unite the complete Riverlands against the Freys. They will never rule the Riverlands, nor will they be able to maintain their position as a house. They might very well be completely destroyed in the end.

Very well stated. I suspect you've laid out Littlefinger's plan for things to come regarding the Riverlands, right here. It wouldn't be too hard for him to set himself up as the King on the Rivers here, given what he's got going for him.

[Bronn is God]

Roose "Rightful King of the Andals" Bolton.

[Sting]

I thought you wanted Bron to be the King? Maybe if he marries Ramsay Snow both your wishesh come true?

[Spaceman Hobbes]

Isn't the BWB covertly moving people into Riverrun which is now in Frey hands?

They hold the Riverlands for now, but the Freys are sandwiched between the Ironborn and Sansa's Vale. Things CAN'T end well for them.

[Ealasaid]

This is true, but when I meant the higher ups I suppose I meant the "higher higher ups" -- ie; the BwB may leave the forest and abandoned villages and pillage a populated and armed Frey city.

This of course is assuming their ranks are swelled at some point.

Even if the BWB were to swell their numbers....there are a lot of Freys.

[Jon Lannister]

I don't think the Freys are in such a bad situation as you say they are. Rob Stark is dead and there's no one willing to avenge him, only Catelyn and the BWB, that cannot really threaten Lord Frey. The Lannisters are half-broken, and it doesn't matter who stays in the Iron Throne, as long as it isn't a Stark or a Tully, they're not in a bad position. They managed to have their lands untouched. The only possible threat to their prosperity is Sansa Stark, now very close to the new Lord of the East and the Riverlands, Littlefinger. But the lords of the Vale are divided, they have no strenght, and Petyr's authority in the Riverlands is only nominal. The Iron Men want the North, they don't care about the Twins. In the end, the Frey will remain very well. If the BWB becomes a serious problem, Lord Walder would have no problem to summon some swords and put an end to the Stark issue.

[Kaitscralt]

Unless Catelyn and Thoros are still hiding the full extent of their otherworldly powers...

Yeah, I'm a typical Brotherhood fanboy... sue me.

[Jon Lannister]

I used to like the BWB when Lord Beric was the leader, because it defended the true King and his Hand. But now, with Catelyn leading them, they're only moved by revenge.

[Alexia]

The Lannisters are half-broken, and it doesn't matter who stays in the Iron Throne, as long as it isn't a Stark or a Tully, they're not in a bad position. They managed to have their lands untouched.

I disagree with your conclusion. A couple things: 1) There are, IIRC, anti-Frey protests currently taking place - and the Lannisters are thinking of punishing the Freys since they were careful not to get their hands dirty. 2) The Faith is currently rising in influence at the moment, as well as fanaticism, and what the Freys did is a serious sin. 3) The BwB seems to be growing in strength at the moment and a storming of Riverrun doesn't seem out of the ordinary. 4) The Lannisters are poised to lose the Iron Throne, and what the Freys did is so repugnant to common sensibilities that I have no doubt that they will be severely punished by whoever takes control.

Additionally, Sansa is (as you note) a threat to the Freys. There is no doubt in my mind that she will end the series as the Lady of Winterfell OR the Lady of Riverrun (I do think that is a possibility). If Sansa of House Stark backs Daenerys (for example, or another claimant) in return for the support of her rights and justice for her brutally murdered relatives who died in the crime of the century, I have no doubt that Daenerys will agree. The Freys are nothing to nobody - even Tywin rigged it so that Lannisters appear as clean as snow. They threw their lots in with House Lannister but I honestly do not believe that they could have survived their actions even had Tywin and Joffrey lived. They simply threw away too much credibility in the pursuit of revenge - they should have declared war on House Stark publicly and marched against Robb or forced Tywin to publicly support them in a much more tangible way than a few marriages.

Even if Sansa doesn't end up as lady in her own right (which is where I think the story is taking her) I do believe that she will demand justice for her murdered relatives and her husband will join her (if only out of greed for Frey lands).