Crackpot - Viserys alive.

[yolkboy]

And you seem to choose to ignore the text. This wasn't bored kids using softened gold to decorate themselves.

Same principle IMO. Gold is gold. Vis was like a kid.

Back on topic, I dont think Vis is alive, because he died.

[DaveSnow House Stark]

You can't know that. Especially when Targs are fireproof. Viserys ate that molten gold like candy. Then he choked and died.

Man I love sarcasm, especially when used properly!

[Twist]

I just can't get the image of someone with a dead viserys head down in a cooking pot trying to melt off all that gold that must've hardened on his head out of my head! Unless he's walking round with a gold plated head... "omg, really annoying itch on my forehead right now, but can't scratch it due to irremovable crown, so annoying!"

[tormund's beard]

We over think to much the stuff, if we keep going like that, nobody died at all

or maybe they are all dead! amybe we're all dead!

[Dr. Pepper]

We over think to much the stuff, if we keep going like that, nobody died at all

What is dead may never die. Weren't you paying attention?!?

[Adara]

What is dead may never die. Weren't you paying attention?!?

Have payed attention, no happy ending.

For the Night is dark and full of Errors.

It is known.

[Ser Duncan of Flea Bottom]

Maybe some stuff work different in Planetos, we see it as Earth and it's not

they have dragons, we don't, for example

[WhiteWalder]

Same principle IMO. Gold is gold. Vis was like a kid.

Back on topic, I dont think Vis is alive, because he died.

:agree: I also think that Viserys is dead from all the different references in the book of him being dead.

[Light a wight tonight]

Of course it is possible. Considering the process of the way he got burnt its quite hard to understand that it actually killed him.. Drogo didnt get brunt when he lifted up the pot which he had used to melt the golden belt.. Which says it probably wasn't that hot.

Have any idea how hot gold needs to get to melt? Nearly 2000 degrees Fahrenheit, just over 1000 Celsius, for pure gold. Alloys would be less, but still very hot.

There are plenty of things that don't correspond to reality in the story. That gold would have melted in that fire is one of them. You have to accept the premise and read on. However hot that molten gold was it would have cooked Viserys's brains. And Drogo didn't pick the pot up barehanded. He used mitts.

[jet199]

Is it a coincidence that Viserys got his head covered in gold and the gold company cover the skulls of their leaders in gold? Maybe foreshadowing that Dany will take his bones back to Westeros.

[DaveSnow House Stark]

Have any idea how hot gold needs to get to melt? Nearly 2000 degrees Fahrenheit, just over 1000 Celsius, for pure gold. Alloys would be less, but still very hot.

There are plenty of things that don't correspond to reality in the story. That gold would have melted in that fire is one of them. You have to accept the premise and read on. However hot that molten gold was it would have cooked Viserys's brains. And Drogo didn't pick the pot up barehanded. He used mitts.

Yippee! Another person of logic! Yeah it is another planet and yes they have dragons, but they use fire for heat, same as us. That means hot is hot.

As for picking up the pot, has no one else cooked over a campfire? You pick it up from the outward most point and use gloves or rags, they likely would have had ones made of animal hide to use.

Now, you have to accept the melting point part of gold as being needed for the story.

[Light a wight tonight]

As for picking up the pot, has no one else cooked over a campfire? You pick it up from the outward most point and use gloves or rags, they likely would have had ones made of animal hide to use.

It specifically said that Khal Drogo used mitts of horsehair to pick up the pot. Don't know why people ignore points like this.

[WhiteWalder]

It specifically said that Khal Drogo used mitts of horsehair to pick up the pot. Don't know why people ignore points like this.

Because they watch the tv show and don't read the books. He did not have on gloves on in the tv show.

[Viserion-Dracarys]

Oh, believe me, I want this to be true so, so much, but he is dead. As a previous poster said, there is no way he could have survived that. At the beginning I was hoping that the fact that we didn't see his burial (or if there was one such) may point to something, but these hopes faded away gradually. I would have loved it if he had survived, he could have had a great development, but alas. At least he might have found peace at last.

And honestly, I would prefer him dead than being Daario. Or the Harpy.

[Light a wight tonight]

Because they watch the tv show and don't read the books. He did not have on gloves on in the tv show.

Hmph. In another topic somebody griped that people in the book subforums don't like it when TV "facts" are used here. I think I'm one of the 17 people worldwide who have read the books and not seen the show, so sometimes I miss "gems" like this.

[Wise Fool]

Yes, ordinarily that kind of burn trauma applied to the head would be totally fatal since it would raise the temperature of the central nervous system beyond normal operating levels. However, Viserys never had a brain to begin with, and therefore would be immune to molten gold skull damage. Years of inbreeding caused him to be born with a severe birth defect, brain-not-having-itus. Which itself would be ordinarily fatal, except this is ASoIaF and, well, magic. Hey, we already know from Shadow Babies that you don't really need a body, why would you specifically need a head? We've heard of the Faceless Men. He's one of the Brainless Men.

So he wasn't killed. At least, not by Drogo. He went on to the Golden Company, as someone rightly mentioned, so that he could sell his golden crown (and the head with it) in exchange for their services in helping him be restored to the Iron Throne. Why would the Golden Company cross the narrow sea for (f)Aegon, really? In the books it's implied that they were all just so awed by his awesome bravery and sharp intellect. Hogwash, I say. That was an act. In reality, they support Viserys, mostly because he's no sharp intellect. He's the perfect ruler - easily manipulated. By which I mean he literally can't move anywhere, at least not without bumping in to things, and he can't speak either, so the Golden Company can rule the Seven Kingdoms through him. Likely Illyrio had the same plan.

Anyway, Viserys fell overboard one night on the way to Westeros (cruel irony, to have gotten so far but to have died in sight of his rightful kingdom) and drowned. But Euron has that horn that potentially summons krakens from the deep. And we all know Viserys is no dragon. Because he's a kraken. When Ned and Rob put down the Greyjoy rebellion, Ned took Balon's son as a ward and hostage. Only it turned out his son "Theon" was Viserys, and Ned couldn't cope with trying to tolerate a brainless child so he did the old child switcheroo and brought home a different child who he called Theon, and sent the original Theon across the seas into exile, where he murdered and took the identity of the actual Viserys (who was by all accounts a stand-up fellow, really great guy, smart, noble, fond of kittens and diplomacy).

Of course whether Euron's plan will work is up for debate, because also Viserys is AAR...

[TheMysteriousOne]

The HOTU visions show that Viserys is dead and gone.

[Cheshire Rat]

There is someone who created a theory that Viserys choked to death. The molten gold entered his nasal passages and he asphixiated. If you're going to go for dumbest theory ever, you might as well go all the way. The ashphixiated Viserys theory is the dumbest one there ever was.

Wasn't the crux of that argument the idea that no Targs had ever died from fire? I have a headache just thinking about it. I really have nothing new to add to this except that if Viserys hadn't died, I think he would've shown back up by now to try to steal the dragons or with some other insane plan. He was not exactly subtle. Maybe we'll get another hallucination of him, but I think that's the only way we'll see him again.

[WhiteWalder]

The HOTU visions show that Viserys is dead and gone.

This and the several times that Dany thinks or refers to him as dead.

[Wise Fool]

This and the several times that Dany thinks or refers to him as dead.

She thinks wrongly.

Also the HOTU showed her her son by Drogo, all tall and awesome with burning cities behind him. And that's clearly not the case, her son died. So HOTU can show dead people as being alive, why not living people as being dead?