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Eltharion21

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  1. They are not tortured same in literal sense, Tyland Lannister has more similar parallel - who was disfigured by Rhaenyra's torturers to discover location of royal treasury. Result of their actions and decisions, has similar outcome physically devastated young man - a ruin. First of all if you try to behave like a stickler it is "physically" not "phisically". Both have various injuries, through different causes - but both have suggested injuries to their reproductive organs, both person with promiscuous behavior unable to enjoy that. Theon hobbles like an old men through loss of several toes, and nowhere it says Aegon II couldn't walk just that he wanted to recover and didn't want to have his legs amputated he was starting to recover later as stated in material - something you don't seem to observe in detail: Offer to take the black in pivotal moment, after being in rulership of the city where character threatened or tried to kill children to protect their rules, which they both refuse after genuine consideration is very reminiscent -and there are NONE in the novel that compare. What it narrows the circle is multiple comparisons held in two different characters, and not separating them and trying to dissect them just because somebody's fan canon is offended. Likewise. Parallels are always there with eyes to see them and open mind to acknowledge them. There is expression that everything you say before "but" doesn't count. Joffrey is often compared to Aemond or Aegon , which is superficial comparison to say the least. Tv show also incited it by having Joffrey happy seen talking about Rhaenyra getting munched by his dragon. But also same actor, though in different tone narrating the same event in Season 5 lore. Joffrey wasn't insane. Oh really how fortunate, one of Daeron the Daring boy pretenders agrees. Aegon was also broken soul, and there was chance for him to make progress until the very end - like he was given chance to surrender and take the black, yet under influence of his mother - and maybe threat toward what remained to his family - Princess Jaehaera, refused. There is lot of dark in Theon yet. Any small progress he made due to Ramsey's torment isn't enough to wash all the blood and treason. Maybe in fires of R'hllor he will find penance for his sins. Aegon shows restraint, and capability to be influenced by his advisors, for good or ill, despite heavy grievances and emotional distress. You clearly haven't read the novel in detail, or have comprehension issues - there are various ways of sadness, depression and coping with the loss: Nothing says I love you than wanting to make two golden statues of his brothers- larger than Titan of Braavos, not quite smart but lovable nonetheless.
  2. There is depth to character of Jaime, huge part are introspection, judgement and development- for which we can thank his Pov chapters, which we don't have for characters of Fire & Blood, therefore Daemon seems like a sketch of character - with hints of Red Viper, and poor man's Elric of Melnibone like Darkstar - "the most dangerous man in Dorne". Topics like honor, evil , justice, chivalry, oaths are all encompassed in his character. Jaime himself reminds me besides Ser Cole a bit of Maedhros also, though never of lordling fleabottom. Main characteristics of Daemon that Jaime lacks besides roguishness was his ambition, capriciousness or even whoremongery. Gold Cloaks love or respect doesn't amount to much. They are simply said scum, ordinary armed thugs who are adoring person who bought them by giving them power in capital and free reign in the slums of King's Landing. It is truly hypocritical to blame Rhaenyra as reason for "most dangerous man in Westeros" who orders - blood & cheese to get unnerved. Daemon is main reason of Rhaenyra's corruption- from her early age up until her downfall - being the one of main reasons why Greens moved against her in fear from her husband, but also promoting people like Mysaria, Luthor Largent or two betrayers in Rhaenyra's service. To me it seems you are projecting lot of imaginary virtues to a character who doesn't have them and whose most acts are self-serving, impulsive or exploitative, with gifts given to him by fate - skill, charisma, high birth, dragon, valyrian steel - he could become a great man yet he destroyed it by his own idiotic actions. Only thing I agree with that many people are blind of, lauding character as badass or awesome that he was a failure - one of guiding forces of downfall of Targaryen dynasty.
  3. Result of their torture is the same, they are both ruined image of promising careless youth they were. There is more enough to show that Aegon II injuries influenced him in similar way to Theon ( for example when taunted by Mance Rayder's spearwives): They are both given choice to take the black in the moment while the settlement they are holding - King's Landing /Winterfell is being surrounded by superior army and both are for moment given to ponder the chance but they refused it : Maybe half population are lecherous or douches, as you speak from personal experience or introspection mayhaps? Yet not many characters in Asoiaf have all those parallels at same time. Also you can't compare each character you dislike with Joffrey, as there are many sort of villainous douchey nobleman characters like - Viserys, Aerion Brightflame, Gerold Dayne, Leo Tyrell even in other Martin's novels like Annelyn or Bretan Braith. It is ridiculous notion that Theon was "acting out of character" in doing many of his gruesome misdeeds, including allowing rape and murder by his men while he took control of Winterfell, murder of miller's wife who he did sleep whit frequently while she was begging him for mercy and two of her young boys, it is also ridiculous notion that his redemption is fully deserved or guaranteed - he easily might end up burned or decapitated in next chapters, or caught by Ramsey - various degrees of justice. Aegon actually in some sources shows restraint in claiming the throne, he clearly shows love toward his family - especially his brothers and dragon- I doubt all was black about that man, there might have been something golden besides Sunfyre. Regarding your "herd mentality" and claim that there is certain truth in numbers I say this : "Always Outnumbered, Never Outgunned".
  4. She spared them so that she could torment them, and Helaena was dead soon as Green army was approaching the city. ... Rhaenyra's death was one of rare just Aegon II's decisions though it was maybe too cruelly enacted by forcing her son to watch it - influencing in Aegon becoming the Dragonbane.
  5. Who said explicitly that Aegon II had a redemption arc? I compared him to Theon for which there are plenty of parallels. ( lecherousness, general douchiness, suffering terrible injuries in the war- including his reproductive organs, having to murder or threaten lives of children to keep their social position, being offered to take the Black in pivotal moments of their lives - which they both refuse). Aegon the Younger was a hostage - various characters take hostages even hundreds of years later - like Eddard Stark, Jon Snow, Daenerys, Robb Stark, Lannister's. When army supporting their hostage is approaching intent of killing them - they don't have much choice than to use them to their defense. Advice to murder Aegon the Younger was actually given by Ser Tyland Lannister believing Black armies would disintegrate after loosing their claimant, which In my opinion wouldn't be possible because even without Viserys who lived still they had Rhaena of Pentos and her dragon to rally to. Aegon II's two sons and wife died - influenced or directly caused by decisions of Rhaenyra and Daemon - blood & cheese, knight's inquisitor, Maelor being torn to pieces in place supporting Rhaenyra, Mysaria's torment or Luthor Largent, so he really had just reasons to execute Rhaenyra though making her son watch was indeed cruel, he just didn't seem to care being focused on getting his revenge. Aegon might have done worse if he was truly cruel - like his half sister, like kill Aegon before his mother,or kill Baela after she attacked Sunfyre with Moondancer, wounds that would prove fatal to his dragon- yet they both survived as Aegon is showing more restraint. Rhaenyra was groomed to rule yet she failed miserably - especially in allowing the death of her hostage, her son and all dragons - including her own - not even once mounting it in battle unlike Aegon, it doesn't prove much - if he was more reasonable as Corlys suggested and offered pardons - it would might have changed Aegon's fate, or Borros Baratheon not being idiot and charging uphill on the shield wall in the muddy terrain- not remembering the battle of the Last Storm, or Crownlands army not betraying at the Battle of Kingsroad
  6. Yep he wasn't the best of Kings, yet he was capable of acts of mercy and redemption - like making some right choices on his deathbed, maybe too late but still it's something. But Robert riding a dragon wielding a huge warhammer, would be some sight to behold - even better then when he rode "The Last Dragon's" ass on the Trident. My opinion is based on their age - since Aemond was 20 year old at time of his death, and Daemon was 49 or something and despite his life experience - championed some of the worst decisions during the war: recruiting Dalton Greyjoy appealing on his bloodlust, promoting people like Mysaria, Luthor Largent and two betrayers, and blood & cheese.
  7. "Robert with a dragon", now that is a high praise, i see Aegon more like a Theon Greyjoy figure. Regardless Aegon showed he is less cruel than his half- sister, through multitude of her acts alone. Aemond is but a mirror image of his uncle, yet there was a chance for redemption as he was still young - and Daemon was corrupt until the end.
  8. It is relatively small step from sworn shield of a King's daughter to Kingsguard as for example Sandor Clegane's promotion would testify. You could say Jaime is loyal to the "Baratheon" regime - being sent as Lord Commander of Kingsguard to pacify the Riverlands- also both Jaime's and Cole's travails are tied to Harrenhal. Ser Cole is accused of murdering Lyman Beesbury by slitting his throat in Small council meeting - which is reminiscent of Jaimie's act. They are both Lord Commander of Kingsguard - not just any knight and leading armies in Riverlands - not simply fought, were best fighters of their time, had liaison with a lady of Royal court - controversial Queen figure that both had three bastards - one of which is named Joffrey... Any knight can make a knight - as we see with Perkin the Flea knighting every bum during the Moon of Three Kings. or Beric Dondarrion, or even person could pretend to be a knight like Duncan the Tall. Getting murdered in premeditated trap, in a meeting with three renowned warriors - Garibald the Gray, Pete the Lionslayer and Roddy the Ruin - who refuse his challenge, with Robb Rivers finest archer in Westeros and two more have him on scope is selling it short as a "peasants death". Ser Cole certainly died bravely acknowledging his doom: It is doubtful that Cole had similar relationship with Rhaenyra, as they met while he was 23 years old and Rhaenyra was 7 year old girl- he spent his next 10 years always being in her proximity - and it is doubtful he would develop romantical tendencies, unlike other characters like Daemon or Harwin Strong - which is much more plausible version. Despite what George says, Littlefinger's actions speak louder than that- Petyr has large part in downfall of Sansa's family and torment of people dear to her like Jeyne Poole - who he forces in one of his brothels to be "educated" for his purposes. There is hardly any good in that man even in relation to things he cherishes most - like adolescent fantasy of Catelyn. Cole is more then only women - "all he has is his honor and his skill with sword and lance", and he is also linked to Alicent Hightower, her sons as their tutor and even Alys Rivers. You unwittingly prove another parallel of Jamie and Cole - they both interfere in presumption of irreproachable royal authority, one by slaying the king and other as supporting other claimant. As true Varys said - they are both part of the riddle of the power, shadow on the wall, both Jaime and Cole represent swordsman who with his action influences fates of the Realm. Aemond is but a mirror image of his uncle Daemon- they are basically same person, yet there was still chance for Aemond's redemption as he was young, Aegon II proved he is less cruel than his half-sister in his actions. Though some dog might do better job than Aegon and especially Rhaenyra. It is explicitly stated that Aemond didn't command Cole to leave. In paragraph reason to split of Aemond and Cole is left far more open, than for example some idiotic suggestions that Rhaenyra had romantic relationship with Laena Velaryon - based on phrase "more than fond".
  9. Jaime and Cole have extraordinary martial prowess, they both got their female companions influence joining the Kingsguard - Rhaenyra and Cersei ( who are also parallels), they both become Lord Commander of Kingsguard, they are both involved majorly in fighting in Riverlands. Jaime Lannister was also fairly popular with women ( as Pia states), and as a tourney knight, Cole and Jaime are also both reviled in histories as Kingmaker and Kingslayer. Despite Jaime's high societal position he was chosen as a Kingsguard despite of it as a means of reigning in Tywin and through suggestion of Cersei, so your analogy doesn't apply. Jaime and Cole have also similar way of dealing with foes - in battle of the Whispering Wood - Jaime despite taken by surprise and his army annihilated, he attempts to cut his way to Robb and kill him, before the Butcher's ball - Ser Cole, when caught in a trap suggests a fight between him and three commanders of Riverlords , and draws his blade when negotiations fail. Littlefinger is hardly a complex character, in ethical sense he has grievance toward upper classes, unfulfilled adolescent sexual fantasy, yet he doesn't grow from there but becomes worse than those who have wronged him in his view , by exploiting lower classes and especially sexually exploiting young people in his brothels, manipulating and murdering those who cared for him - Lysa and causing war to achieve his aspirations. Ser Cole on the other hand was possibly right in attempt to stop Daemon's and Rhaenyra's corruption in ruining the Seven Kingdoms. Ser Cole died while returning alone from Harrenhal- being left by Aemond and Vhagar- the reason for their split is debatable, it might have been matter of tactics and joining forces with Hightowers and Daeron the Daring, feud for the Alys Rivers or I daresay he might have been disenchanted with his cause after witnessing Aemond's genocide inside of Harrenhal.
  10. Daemon is hardly anything like Jaime Lannister- he is a version of Oberyn or with some hints of Tyrion Lannister darker personality and issues. If any character is similar to Jaime Lannister it is Ser Criston Cole, with multitude of parallels, for example: Cole could be only linked to Littlefinger in most biased interpretation of events and even then doesn't seem to share Baelish's shrewdness and is more blunt in his approach, then again Martin's own introduction to a casting for a tv show makes him seem more morally complex than Lord Mockingbird.
  11. Braavosi have history of bad blood with Valyrians and dragons - of which House Targaryen is leftover, it is explicitly stated in material. They might be sympathetic toward Daenerys, yet human lives are short and dragons long. Who knows what next Targaryen rulers would do with them. Don't forget that Elissa Farman sold three dragon eggs to Braavosi, who might be very same eggs that Daenery's hatched - Jaehaerys I threatened to burn the city for them and Braavos with assassins yet they made Iron Bank reduce debts of the throne. For all the time they had them Braavosi might have figured they are useless to them and they respond only to the blood of dragonlords. Braavos rise started with the fall of Valyria and their might lies in their navy - which dragons are huge threat.
  12. Looking at their history: they were founded by escaped slaves from Valyrian Freehold, Faceless men who are part of their culture were created in torments of Valyrian volcanic slave mines, very city was hiding for centuries until they had some power to defy remaining dragonlords. Their rising power - naval supremacy and trade would be threatened by rise of aerial power of dragons, which looking at the Fire & Blood are long lived creatures- for around three hundred years or more. Who is to guarantee that Daenerys's heir or people who claim dragons would remain true to her policy of anti-slavery? If Braavos was to prevent rise of new Valyria- which is anathema to their society - time to strike is now while dragons aren't fully grown.
  13. Nah Braavos would never support Daenerys, because of dragons, their long life span and possibility of rebuilt Valyrian empire. Despite they might sympathize with Daenerys anti slavery attitude.
  14. If it is publicly released, which it was it, than it falls under scrutiny of the ruling power in Westeros at the time - Targaryen dynasty - which was ever sensitive about bad image - examples of censure by Baelor the Blessed, Aerion Brightflame,Bloodraven, Aerys the Mad King. Saying all Maesters are part of a hive mind is like saying all the doctors are part of same conspiracy, it couldn't be true as they have varied loyalties, ideas and goals and the more people are involved more the chance it would be found out.
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