wiffy Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 i wanna hear the reason to why Brienne got the Oathkeeper sword in the show if LS is cut from the show ? This sword is used just before she is hanged when she yells "sword" meaing she will keep her oath to Cat and bring Jamie to her. This is just messed up as hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scabbard Of the Morning Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 To give them the benefit of the doubt, maybe with Jon's resurrection coming up they are worried about having too many dead people coming back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiffy Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 i wanna hear the reason to why Brienne got the Oathkeeper sword in the show if LS is cut from the show ? This sword is used just before she is hanged when she yells "sword" meaing she will keep her oath to Cat and bring Jamie to her. This is just messed up as hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiffy Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 something wrong with board "doubleposts" :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sati Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 To give them the benefit of the doubt, maybe with Jon's resurrection coming up they are worried about having too many dead people coming back. Yes, but why oh why go with Gregor instead... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheButcherCrow Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 99% confirmed no LS.http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/06/25/michelle-fairley-24-lady-stoneheart/ You couldn’t have missed the online furor over the lack of Lady Stoneheart in theThrones finale. Were you surprised by that attention?I actually haven’t seen any of that. I don’t look that stuff up. I avoid it like the plague. I was totally unaware.There was a lot of online conversation. I heard third-hand that you were basically told that it’s not likely to ever happen. Is that accurate?Yeah, the character’s dead. She’s dead.Do you have a preference at all—do you think Catelyn’s arc should end where it ended, or would you be into the resurrection idea?You respect the writers’ decision. I knew the arc, and that was it. They can’t stick to the books 100 percent. It’s impossible—they only have 10 hours per season. They have got to keep it dramatic and exciting, and extraneous stuff along the way gets lost in order to maintain the quality of brilliant show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scabbard Of the Morning Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Well technically Gregor never actually dies, he was dying and then Qyburn kept him alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fey Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Don't see much wiggle room around what she says. Unless she's straight up lying. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chebyshov Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Yes, this, all of this! Watching Thrones was my absolute favorite thing - watching trailers over and over, shaking with anticipation on Sundays because my favorite stuff was coming (I thought it did) and I was just dying to see what it will look like on the show. 38 episodes of such fun. And then Stannis didn't arrive in 4x09. I was so let down. Then finale came and his scene was amazing and even though LS wasn't there I still hoped she will eventually show up. Before 4x09 I always though 'ok, there are changes but there are some opportunites for great scenes from the book there is no way they won't take them'. But now that hope is pretty much gone. People say it's silly or whatever to judge episodes by lack of one scene but as a book reader there are some scenes I've been waiting for so much I don't care about other changes. And I'm apparently very unfortunate because Stannis and Cat are my favorites. It would still be fine if they just wouldn't talk about it at all. But all that confusion really makes it look like they are making that show for themselves and have no interest in other fans. Sure, they are allowed to do that but they are just so blatant about it. It's very hard to enjoy the show now and it's surprising for me, as I said I used to love the show. It's just as if they took two massive shits on my favorite painting that no matter what won't be erased :lol: I enjoyed many changes and I wouldn't say I'm a book purist but I just wanted this one thing to happen. Change her appearance, change the scene for all I care, but just make it happen was my one wish. I will obviously continue watching but I don't think I'll ever enjoy the show as much as I used to. Even if they give reasons for it, which I'm not sure they will, there is just no reason good enough for me, seeing how many ridiculous time wasting scenes they had and even if LS is not important in the end, which would shock me as I don't think Martin would bring someone from the dead for nothing, her scenes would provide such great, creepy imagery which would be stellar to witness on screen.A lot of good stuff here. I'll add my own lengthy thoughts for anyone who's interested. Stannis and Cat aren't my favorites (don't kill me :P ), and yet those episodes still fell flat for me. I think making 4x09 one, super battle was a narrative mistake, but I at least hoped there would be a payoff in terms a resolution to the tension they had built. Instead, we had what felt like a half-episode with poignant character moments eclipsed by chefs fighting with soup and giants riding mammoths. It was the first time that I was really thrown off by the show. Prior to that, although I'd nitpick some changes and exclusions, I often thought the show did a fantastic job in terms of story-telling. But 4x09 made me question that. Going into 4x10 I was determined not to be thrown off, and to get excited for what I was sure were going to be big payoffs (you may recall how nuts I went over-analyzing the soundtrack, promo footage, etc.). Once again, the episode fell flat. The Wall stuff was great, but left Jon far behind other plotlines; going into the season I was sure we'd see Jon become LC. Post 4x09 I was at least hoping for something setting that up. Instead, we got great moments, but none that felt appropriate for the finale. The Bran stuff was visually disappointing, and the Cersei-scenes, out of character (for Jaime and Tywin as well). And then there was the complete butchering of Tyrion's story, which really upset me. Post ADWD I felt that Tyrion was one of the greyest characters in the story, and yet the show treated his killings in an almost-sympathetic way. This shook me more than anything, I'd say. And then we get the end with no LS. It just felt like such a buzzkill of an episode, and made me really, really question their story-telling abilities. Is it silly for 2 episodes to sour me? Maybe. But the fact that we were left with these 2 episodes as the final note to the season makes it worse. These episodes were flawed, and showed a disturbing lack of appreciation/understanding for certain storylines (especially Tyrion's). I agree that the post-episode commentary about LS's exclusion has made matters worse. Graves in his interview basically laughed at book-readers for expecting something that is a major plot point and twist, and then insulted the meaning of it in one breath. I do think that if she is truly cut, as MF's comments indicate, then we need to be have some sort of definitive answer as well as an explanation. I get that there are only 3 seasons next and they need to be strategic about storylines moving forward. It's interesting, because perhaps their explanation would be something like "well she dies in TWOW so it wasn't worth it." Their rationale may be a spoiler in and of itself. But given that all we've heard have been rude remarks and somewhat evasive answers, there needs to be some sort of clarity. I don't feel the show "owes us" anything, but to ignore book-readers entirely I think is a mistake (especially given that there are a growing number of us each year). I will definitely continue watching it, and probably feel better about it as we get closer to S5. But I am worried now, where I never had been worried before. And that's not a good feeling moving forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheButcherCrow Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Don't see much wiggle room around what she says. Unless she's straight up lying. :/ yup, that was my conclusion too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cake Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Well technically Gregor never actually dies, he was dying and then Qyburn kept him alive. Gregor died and then Qyburn reanimated his body, I think. So he's dead alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourneblade Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 What I do not understand is that the Rat King story was included and the lightning lord story was included, both of which set up Lady Stoneheart. She is a supernatural response to the breaking of guest right, the same way the rat king story was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiffy Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 yup, that was my conclusion too well all actors lie when people ask if they are coming back to a show if they been killed off, and then BAM they are back.. Its part of the business if its a surprise she can't say it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scabbard Of the Morning Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Gregor died and then Qyburn reanimated his body, I think. So he's dead alright. Not in the show. Gregor's still alive and Qyburn started to work on him, i'm pretty sure they'll never cut off his head either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cake Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Not in the show. Gregor's still alive and Qyburn started to work on him, i'm pretty sure though never cut off his head either Maybe because the show hasn't got to that part yet? I knew that I must have misunderstood something about your comment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheButcherCrow Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 well all actors lie when people ask if they are coming back to a show if they been killed off, and then BAM they are back.. Its part of the business if its a surprise she can't say it while I agree, it does tend to be somewhat less categorical than, "she's dead, the character's dead". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scabbard Of the Morning Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 The point is they might be trying to keep Jon's resurrection special by reducing the number of them I n the show therefore no resurrection for Cat or Gregor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sati Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 A lot of good stuff here. I'll add my own lengthy thoughts for anyone who's interested (spoiler tag for neatness). Stannis and Cat aren't my favorites (don't kill me :P ), and yet those episodes still fell flat for me. I think making 4x09 one, super battle was a narrative mistake, but I at least hoped there would be a payoff in terms a resolution to the tension they had built. Instead, we had what felt like a half-episode with poignant character moments eclipsed by chefs fighting with soup and giants riding mammoths. It was the first time that I was really thrown off by the show. Prior to that, although I'd nitpick some changes and exclusions, I often thought the show did a fantastic job in terms of story-telling. But 4x09 made me question that. Going into 4x10 I was determined not to be thrown off, and to get excited for what I was sure were going to be big payoffs (you may recall how nuts I went over-analyzing the soundtrack, promo footage, etc.). Once again, the episode fell flat. The Wall stuff was great, but left Jon far behind other plotlines; going into the season I was sure we'd see Jon become LC. Post 4x09 I was at least hoping for something setting that up. Instead, we got great moments, but none that felt appropriate for the finale. The Bran stuff was visually disappointing, and the Cersei-scenes, out of character (for Jaime and Tywin as well). And then there was the complete butchering of Tyrion's story, which really upset me. Post ADWD I felt that Tyrion was one of the greyest characters in the story, and yet the show treated his killings in an almost-sympathetic way. This shook me more than anything, I'd say. And then we get the end with no LS. It just felt like such a buzzkill of an episode, and made me really, really question their story-telling abilities. Is it silly for 2 episodes to sour me? Maybe. But the fact that we were left with these 2 episodes as the final note to the season makes it worse. These episodes were flawed, and showed a disturbing lack of appreciation/understanding for certain storylines (especially Tyrion's). I agree that the post-episode commentary about LS's exclusion has made matters worse. Graves in his interview basically laughed at book-readers for expecting something that is a major plot point and twist, and then insulted the meaning of it in one breath. I do think that if she is truly cut, as MF's comments indicate, then we need to be have some sort of definitive answer as well as an explanation. I get that there are only 3 seasons next and they need to be strategic about storylines moving forward. It's interesting, because perhaps their explanation would be something like "well she dies in TWOW so it wasn't worth it." Their rationale may be a spoiler in and of itself. But given that all we've heard have been rude remarks and somewhat evasive answers, there needs to be some sort of clarity. I don't feel the show "owes us" anything, but to ignore book-readers entirely I think is a mistake (especially given that there are a growing number of us each year). I will definitely continue watching it, and probably feel better about it as we get closer to S5. But I am worried now, where I never had been worried before. And that's not a good feeling moving forward. I thought the Wall episode being the centric one was a mistake too, especially since big part of that could have been shown in earlier episodes, what the battle started after 20 minutes? As for Tyrion and the Lannisters in finale - good God that scene in which Cersei tells Tywin. I think if an actor like Charles Dance comes off ridiculous than there is something very, very wrong with the script - him going 'no, no, no you lie' was comical. It was like the mighty Tywin escaped to his happy place. I didn't mind all the changes because I really only cared about Stannis so I enjoyed the ep but there is just something so important to me about final scene and final episodes - I love it when they have a punch. And that finale not only didn't have one, it was handed to them on silver platter and they didn't use it. GoT episodes used to have amazing jaw dropping endings. Jon going through the tunnel. Arya on a boat. Oh, my. I'm starting to feel bad for the actors and Ramin Djawadi. These people and George's book deserve better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourneblade Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I posted a thread, waiting for approval, on this because I feel the removal of this character completely deserves its own thread imho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janicia Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 What I do not understand is that the Rat King story was included and the lightning lord story was included, both of which set up Lady Stoneheart. She is a supernatural response to the breaking of guest right, the same way the rat king story was. If there is no LS, both stories still work in the show: Rat King was included to explain that guest right was a sacred thing and we should hate Frey more than we do. Eventually I expect somebody to take the Freys out. Possibly next season. And anyway, Bran telling that spooky story while they're camping in the dreadfort might have been his best scene all season. The lightning lord story was setting up for Jon - Melissandre saw Beric and her wheels started spinning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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