Without the shadow baby, is Renly king?

[Universal Sword Donor]

Joffrey is not a Lannister. He is a Baratheon, and Renly's nephew. He'd be tainted as a kinslayer before his reign even began. Remember, Stannis' only proof is a book. Hell, even if he has Edric Storm, he can prove nothing.

Joffrey took the crown and murdered the man who supported Robert and Stannis.

Not many historical examples of a hostile king actively abdicating in favor of a rival claimant and, um, staying alive.

Also Renly gets a smidge more influence as king and head of a 100K army, more if you add Robb's forces as he was marching south to kill the Lannisters and get justice for his father.

Joffrey is gone, kinslaying or no.

[In A Coat of Gold]

Yes, an army has never found a hitherto unknown to them path allowing them to bypass a formidable obstacle. They've definitely not written about it or made a graphic movie about it.

Except in the case of the battle of Thermopylae, the Greeks were betrayed by a fellow Greek. The Persians didn't have a magical wolf to show them the way lol.

[In A Coat of Gold]

Joffrey took the crown and murdered the man who supported Robert and Stannis.

Not many historical examples of a hostile king actively abdicating in favor of a rival claimant and, um, staying alive.

Also Renly gets a smidge more influence as king and head of a 100K army, more if you add Robb's forces as he was marching south to kill the Lannisters and get justice for his father.

Joffrey is gone, kinslaying or no.

Joffrey didn't take anything. The throne is his, by rights. Stannis and Renly are usurpers.

Except Joff isn't going to abdicate. He'll be forcibly removed.

Again, he could just keep them alive and there would be no backlash. If Robb insists on calling himself King without bending the knee, he can get destroyed as well.

[Minsc]

Joffrey didn't take anything. The throne is his, by rights. Stannis and Renly are usurpers.

Except Joff isn't going to abdicate. He'll be forcibly removed.

Again, he could just keep them alive and there would be no backlash. If Robb insists on calling himself King without bending the knee, he can get destroyed as well.

Renly directly promises Catelyn both Joff and Cersei's head for justice for their execution of Ned

[Universal Sword Donor]

Except in the case of the battle of Thermopylae, the Greeks were betrayed by a fellow Greek. The Persians didn't have a magical wolf to show them the way lol.

You're right. It's shocking there's a magic wolf in a fantasy series. History is chock full of examples of battles or campaigns where a force goes around or blows past a formidable fortification.

The Wildlings climbed the wall, though their strategy was, um, not the greatest.

Manchus bribed a Ming commander to open a fortified pass and conquer the rest of China.

Bohemond bribed a guard to take Antioch.

The Germans went through Belgium to attack France.

[Universal Sword Donor]

Joffrey didn't take anything. The throne is his, by rights. Stannis and Renly are usurpers.

Except Joff isn't going to abdicate. He'll be forcibly removed.

Again, he could just keep them alive and there would be no backlash. If Robb insists on calling himself King without bending the knee, he can get destroyed as well.

No backlash from the Lannisters but a huge threat to his throne. The North is not going to be happy with either Cersei or Joffrey being alive.

Renly is politically expedient and pragmatic. If he can solidify his claim on the throne and bring his father's staunchest allies back into the fold, he will.

[It's Not That Littlefinger]

yes. he would have smashed stannis and then marched on, and quickly taken KL.