Is Timett the son of Timett the heir to the Vale of Arryn?

[Modesty Lannister]

Mance is considered king by the Northmen who want his head to roll. What is it you do not get? Sense the dawn of time, people have given titles to people they believe bares the title in a society. The kings-beyond the Wall have always been seen as savages, title or not. Again, what is your point? That they see their rule among their own that the Seven Kingdoms woul accept them as their lords and masters?

I cannot even make sense of this paragraph. Reread Jon's chapters and refresh your memory of how Mance, Val and baby Aemon are considered by Stannis's knights (who have nothing to do with the north).

[Wmarshal]

I cannot even make sense of this paragraph. Reread Jon's chapters and refresh your memory of how Mance, Val and baby Aemon are considered by Stannis's knights (who have nothing to do with the north).

What. Is. Your . Point . No where does these men see baby Aemon or Val as candidates to rule them. King's beyond have been called kings beyond the wall forever, no one saw them less savage.

[Pain killer Jane]

Here is the passage from AFFC in which Petyr Baelish explains to Sansa Stark why Harry the Heir is the heir of the Vale in case Robyn Arryn dies:

So, the fourth surviving daughter of Jon Arryn’s sister Alys and current lady Waynwood’s uncle Ser Elys was carried off by the Burned Men. She was of noble birth, so it stands to reason she would not have been killed. There are two possibilities for her subsequent fate:

1. A ransom would be asked from her family

2. She would be claimed by one of the Burned Men as a wife or a mistress.

The latter scenario is more likely since no one heard from her ever since. But, she was a lady and it is likely that she would be claimed by the chief of the clan. And that chief is most likely Timett’s father Timett.

That would make Timett the son of Timett not only a future leader of the Burned Men, but the heir to the Vale of Arryn.

But, why would anyone care for an illegal offspring such as Timett the son of Timett? TWOIAF offers an idea:

This fire-witch can only be Nettles and the dragon Sheepstealer.

From The Princess and the Queen we know that the affair between Daemon Targaryen and Nettles ended:

Which does not mean she was not seen in the mountains of the Vale. Judging from the heartbreaking farewell between her and prince Daemon, one can speculate she may have been with child at the time of their parting. Else, she may have died together with Daemon in his final battle or even managed to win it. But it was obvious that prince Daemon was not willing to risk her heath.

So, she hid in the mountains of the Vale. The Burned Men obviously provided her and her dragon with food. Since they “worshiped” her, it does not seem likely that she would have taken any of them for husband.

But, in any case, we have three possible scenarios:

1. Nettles had a child by Daemon

2. Nettles took a husband from the Burned Men clan and had children with him

3. Nettles lived her days without a man

Since Nettles does not strike me as a celibate type, but an earthly one, I find the third scenario highly unlikely.

So, if she had a child regardless of who their father was, that child was set to become the leader of the Burned Men.

The custom of burning parts of one’s body to prove one’s manhood may have derived from numerous attempts by members of the clan and potential offspring of Nettles to tame Sheepstealer after Nettles died since we know dragons live much longer than humans.

So, today, we have potentially a descendent or descendents of Nettles living in the Vale. Some of them may even be descendents of Prince Daemon. All of them potentially have dragonriding abilities. Also, Sheepstealer had planty of time to lay eggs in the Vale since Craxes seemed as heartbroken by Sheepstealer’s departure as Prince Deamon was with that of Nettles.

Why do I think Timett the son of Timett is a good candidate for such a descendent?

So, our man Timett is so fearless even Bronn fears him, he likes to gamble and he dislikes cold although he lived all his life in the Mountains of the Moon. All these traits resemble Daemon Targaryen who was not called the Prince of Fleebottom for nothing.

I am not going to speculate on one eye Timett has and his very choice to take it out, which may lead us to Bloodraven, but it is also a thought to be entertained.

Arya and the Hound learn that

So, if Daenerys lands in the Vale, she may find that there is a dragonrider there and perhaps some dragon eggs as well. And when riding a dragon, the status of a bastard doesn’t mean much anymore. So, Timett may rule the Vale yet.

ETA: Just wanted to add that the lady abducted by the Burned men was on her way to wed a Bracken when taken. Given the ancient and still ongoing feud between Brackens and Blackwoods, it may have not been coincidental. The Bracken connection reinforces my belief that Bloodraven may be involved in the whole thing. That would make Timett's choice to take his eye out with a hot knife a further sign that his actions may be manipulated by the Bloodraven as were actions of his predecessors.

I was pointed to this post after expressing a dislike of not knowing where Nettles was after the Dance. You may not consider this theory credible anymore but I just had to express my liking of this theory. I didn't go through all eight pages but did anyone consider that Timmett has more than two sources of Dragonblood as the Lord of the Eyrie married a Targ princess and the Lady of the Eyrie was quote as being cousin to the King Aegon III and because of Queen Rhaenerya's mother being an Arryn. So is it safe to assume that Lady Jeyne Arryn was the mother of Jasper Arryn who was the father of Jon Arryn and his siblings?

[Lost Melnibonean]

I was pointed to this post after expressing a dislike of not knowing where Nettles was after the Dance. You may not consider this theory credible anymore but I just had to express my liking of this theory. I didn't go through all eight pages but did anyone consider that Timmett has more than two sources of Dragonblood as the Lord of the Eyrie married a Targ princess and the Lady of the Eyrie was quote as being cousin to the King Aegon III and because of Queen Rhaenerya's mother being an Arryn. So is it safe to assume that Lady Jeyne Arryn was the mother of Jasper Arryn who was the father of Jon Arryn and his siblings?

From our resident expert on timelines and genealogy...

Interesting, thanks! I'll have to look into it a bit better when I have the time, but for now..

I was pointed to this post after expressing a dislike of not knowing where Nettles was after the Dance. You may not consider this theory credible anymore but I just had to express my liking of this theory. I didn't go through all eight pages but did anyone consider that Timmett has more than two sources of Dragonblood as the Lord of the Eyrie married a Targ princess and the Lady of the Eyrie was quote as being cousin to the King Aegon III and because of Queen Rhaenerya's mother being an Arryn. So is it safe to assume that Lady Jeyne Arryn was the mother of Jasper Arryn who was the father of Jon Arryn and his siblings?

No, it is not safe to assume... :)

Aemma seems to have been an only child, so Rhaenyra had no aunt on her mother's side, at least, not a Targaryen-blooded aunt (Lord Rodrik Arryn could always have remarried after Daella's death, of course). So no Targaryen blood for Lady Jeyne of the Eyrie.

Timeline-wise, no, Jasper won't have been Jeyne's son. Jeyne seems to have been around the age of Rhaenyra (still in her minority in 101 AC). Jon Arryn, on the other hand, was born roughly between 217 and 220 AC.. He was an old man at the birth of his first child, but that is absolutely not the standard. Jaspar seems to have had no problems with having children, so he will have been around the regular age-range for a Westerosi noble man at having his first child (which usually is anywhere between 15 and 30)..

Which leaves slightly less than a century between Jeyne and Jasper..:)

In addition, we have the following info from the MUSH (which, of course, is not canon, but it should be noted that the MUSH was updated to 2.0 for the World Book release, and that this particular piece of info had not been present in 1.0):

• {Lord Joffrey} (b. 100), once Knight of the Bloody Gate, a most unlikely heir (d. 151),

The date of birth would make him a bit younger than Jeyne, but the most interesting part is the "a most unlikely heir". That means he was not Jeyne's brother (as he would have inherited the Vale over her if he had been). Which would make Joffrey a cousin, (possibly to the degree of Harrold Hardyn vs Robert Arryn, who knows, there's no info on that).

The fact that that info was added to the MUSH in an update specially done for the World Book, would suggest this is something from left-over notes. It has not been published, so of course, it is still subject to change, but it is something interesting, nonetheless.

It would also mean that Lady Jeyne's line ended not too long after the Dance (also note that at no point in time, any children have been mentioned for Lady Jeyne).

[Daendrew]

Love it.

Long live the true king.

The Vale of Timmett.

I theorized in my unDivorce blog post that Tyrion would pay his debt and give the Vale of Arryn to A Stormcrow. But I might have bet on the wrong crow.

Great post. You are far too modest, Brilliance Lannister.