Is it possible that Alys Karstark conspired with Bowen Marsh to kill Jon Snow

[Sveto]

Some of her words to Jon were really suspicious, she said to him "Karstarks remember" (it was totally out of place) and I think it was after they talked about Rickard Karstark's death and how Robb killed him. Jon is Robb's brother and defended his actions. We also know that the Magnar of Thenn doesn't like Jon Snow.

There's also the Melisandre's vision about the girl that Jon Snow must save and this girl is Alys Karstark. I wonder what was the point of that (why he must save her) because after her marriage she disappeared. It might mean that he must've saved her so she can betray him and kill him, so Melisandre could save him somehow. We also don't know if Alys didn't lie about everything.

One of the steward's reaction, he acted like "it wasn't him".

[Cladinator]

I never really got that impression but I suppose it's possible.

The relationship between Styr-the Magnar of Thenn and Sigorn-the Magnar of Thenn seem very different. I don't think there was much contempt between Jon and Sigorn.

Jon and Styr, on the other hand, hated each other.

[The Witch King of Asshai]

I'd be very surprised, and confused, if this was the case. She was fleeing to the wall, where is the motive in killing her former protector? IIRC there is a whole conversation about how all those blood ties are set aside and don't matter. And then look at what Jon did for her, protection, punishment of the other Karstarks, played a role in getting her a husband and his wildling army. Why would she kill him? That's ignoring the fact they actually seem to like each other.

Also, what role would she play? She certainly didn't stab Jon, and I find it hard to believe that she was the shadowy puppet-master that is manipulating Bowen Marsh and his allies. She's barely a grown woman and offers nothing to the conspiracy. As for the Magnar, Jon is one of the few members of the NW that is pro-wildling. Why would he work with the wildling hating Bowen Marsh, or vice-versa?

I honestly think that Bowen Marsh simply stabbed Jon because he was pissed off at his leadership and his decisions to help wildlings and break vows. Or was warged by Bloodraven. :cool4:

[Sveto]

I'd be very surprised, and confused, if this was the case. She was fleeing to the wall, where is the motive in killing her former protector? IIRC there is a whole conversation about how all those blood ties are set aside and don't matter. And then look at what Jon did for her, protection, punishment of the other Karstarks, played a role in getting her a husband and his wildling army. Why would she kill him? That's ignoring the fact they actually seem to like each other.

And what if her so called escape was planned from first place, her arranged marriage a lie, and her intentions were to kill the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch? Bolton is cunning after all, also Karstarks worked for Bolton. Her motive might be to kill the last Stark male - revenge for her father's death.

[The Witch King of Asshai]

It's true Arnolf Karstark worked for the Boltons, but that was intended to disinherit Harrion, the legitimate heir and Alys's brother. There are two rival Karstark factions, Arnolf and his progeny, and Rickards's progeny allied with the Thenns. Arnolf wants to be lord of the Karhold, no way is he going to let Alys live as a threat to his legitimacy. The two factions are not working together. She will marry his heir and then have an "accident". Plus she didn't kill him, certainly not directly, and if you're going to assassinate a LC then you send grown men as "recruits", not 15 year old girls.

And if the escape was planned, why would Cregan consent to risk captivity in one of the worsts cells in westeros, and why would one of the hunters attempted to fight back and die for it?

[Julia H.]

Some of her words to Jon were really suspicious, she said to him "Karstarks remember" (it was totally out of place) and I think it was after they talked about Rickard Karstark's death and how Robb killed him. Jon is Robb's brother and defended his actions. We also know that the Magnar of Thenn doesn't like Jon Snow.

There's also the Melisandre's vision about the girl that Jon Snow must save and this girl is Alys Karstark. I wonder what was the point of that (why he must save her) because after her marriage she disappeared. It might mean that he must've saved her so she can betray him and kill him, so Melisandre could save him somehow. We also don't know if Alys didn't lie about everything.

One of the steward's reaction, he acted like "it wasn't him".

What exactly would Alys Karstark's role in the conspiracy be? Did she flee to the Wall pretending to run from her relatives just to have a word with Bowen Marsh and tell him to kill Jon Snow? And having done that, she let herself be married off to a wildling of Jon's choice? What would be the role of the rest of the Karstarks? If Alys did indeed flee from them, why would she want to have her protector killed in revenge for a deed that she knew said person had not done (like he had not even been near when it was done)? If the whole Karstark family was part of the conspiracy, then what was Cregan doing in an ice cell while his niece was married off to a wildling then travelled to Karhold to take possession of everything there? If everything Alys said was a lie, then Alys and Arnolf were in agreement, too, but then why did Alys tell Jon that Arnolf had betrayed Stannis, allowing Jon to send Stannis a message? Or, if Alys and Arnolf were on two different sides, then Arnolf should have been on Stannis' side and then Alys would have lied about the betrayal. However, that's pretty improbable considering

the Theon chapter we have from TWoW:

He had seen the cloak before, he knew, just as he had seen the man who wore it. At the Dreadfort. I remember. He sat and supped with Lord Ramsay and Whoresbane Umber, the night they brought Reek up from his cell.

<snip>

Instead his eyes found Theon. "And who is this?" Recognition came a heartbeat later. Lord Arnolf paled.

If Alys told the truth about Arnolf, she probably told the truth about everything. Then perhaps she was intent on getting all her relatives and Jon Snow killed - but I don't see why she would want to have Jon killed if she got genuine protection from him, and why she would accept the marriage Jon arranged for her if she was planning that. With war and winter coming, she could not hope to survive totally on her own, and once she was allied with wildlings, she was allied with Jon.

Sigorn had no reason to want Jon dead after he had become head of a newly created Westerosi house whose legitimacy to a large extent depended on whatever authority Jon had.

The quote you mentioned is not "Karstark", but "Karhold remembers", and it was said during the wedding, as they were talking about the winter and how the old men in the North went off to die in the snow when there was a shortage of food. Jon made a suggestion:

"When your stores begin to dwindle, my lady, remember us. Send your old men to the Wall, let them say our words. Here at least they will not die alone in the snow, with only memories to warm them. Send us boys as well, if you have boys to spare."

"As you say." She touched his hand. "Karhold remembers."

"Karhold remembers" as per doing what Jon has just asked. It is not out of place. Of course, it might be a lie, but I don't think Alys has any bad memories to recall in connection with Jon.

[three-eyed monkey]

I'm all for a good conspiracy but I think this is a real stretch.

Bowen Marsh made it quite clear throughout ADwD that he was not happy with Jon's decisions surrounding the wildlings. He was also worried that the crown would consider them traitors if they helped Stannis. Jon even wrote a letter to Kings Landing to assure the crown that the Watch take no part.

In Cersei's chapters in AFfC the small council have received the letter but are not convinced. Cersei considers Ned's bastard to be a traitor like his father. Harys Swyft is Hand at the time, and he and Pycelle advise writing to Castle Black to insist that LC Snow be removed or else the Watch would receive no more assistance from the crown, (not that they helped much anyway!) Cersei ignores the advice and tells the council that she will deal with the matter, and proceeds to hatch the plan to get Kettleblack sent to the wall to kill Jon. The High Sparrow scuttles that plan and Cersei is imprisoned, leaving the realm in the hands of Swyft and Pycelle, who obviously proceed with the plan of action they had originally advised. That is why Marsh says, "for the Watch" when he stabs Jon.

It is as simple as that, in my opinion, but a detail that is often lost in the parallel timelines of ADwD and AFfC. The only conspiracy was between the small council and a reluctant Marsh. If there was another party involved on the Castle Black end of things then I think Thorne is the most likely candidate, but there is no need for anyone else.

[Ferocious Veldt Roarer]

It would be one convoluted plan...

"Imma ride to the wall, pretend to be in distress, ask that crow Jon Snow for help, and somehow jump from that to sway his officers to murder him".

Short answer: no. Long answer: nope.

[James Arryn]

Her involvement seems incredibly complicated and largely superfluous.