Mad Max- Fury Road

[Hayyoth]

Sure - but Furiosa was beneath both of them. She wasn't a second in command. There's no sign that Joe trusted her beyond carrying out missions, or talked with her, or included her in anything.

Well of course not, she ran off with the tanker in the fisrt third. Joe gives her an heroic send off, the people cheer her. And given the fact that she was commanding the most important mission imaginable, transporting gas to sustain the comminity, I'm pretty sure Joe would have had the odd chat.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Sure - but Furiosa was beneath both of them. She wasn't a second in command. There's no sign that Joe trusted her beyond carrying out missions, or talked with her, or included her in anything.

Yeah, I think it's safe to assume that she's basically a Lieutenant of sorts. Seems to me she's somewhat trusted, as she has her own squad of Warboys who were more or less loyal to her. And she drives what appears to be the communities most important vehicle. She has a surprising amount of pull, given the overall mysogyny of the community.

[Dr. Pepper]

I took it that Furiosa was simply grabbing a chance to escape with a shit load of fuel to her previous home. I also took it that she'd sell the women she rescued for safe passage. i didn't however see her 'fuck over' other women either in action or plot expostion. The only people she deceived and led to their deaths were the warboys under her command, (who constantly referred to her as boss if memory serves)

Considering she was meant to drop the fuel with the canyon boys in exchange for them cutting off the pass from Joe's war parties, it's unlikely the goal had been to escape with a shit load of fuel. There is also no indication that she intended to sell the girls considering she was taking them to her former home, a matriarchal society that didn't appear to have enslaved humans, even when they were more than a roving band.

Yes, the only people we see her screw over are the war boys. But that's because we are dropped into the story on the day that Furiosa has decided to redeem herself. How exactly do you think she made it into the upper echeclons of society? Do you think she got there by spending her days actively opposing Joe and his system? The film didn't spell it out for us, but it's not like it takes a lot of brain power to conclude that Furiosa has done some horrible things and that many of those things were against women.

[Kalbear]

And we see his second in command, his CEO to his Chairman of the Board, and that be a woman. I can understand your need to explain it away though, it completely destroys your argument.

He also names other Imperators in that scene. It doesn't destroy my argument if she is the second in command; it's just an incorrect thing. It really has nothing to do with the argument at all.

ictus was Joe's son, and he was also dumber than a bag of rocks. Second in command? Hardly, more like standby muscle.

Nope. We see others listening to him. We see him at the head of the line. We see him right there with Joe. We have him entrusted to save the lives of the wives. He might be stupid - but that doesn't matter to Joe any more that it matters that his other son is feeble. Both are his sons, and in the hierarchy of Immortan Joe that's far more important than anything else.

We see his war slaves, all young men.

Ah, and here's the problem you have with your argument. The movie makes it abundantly, overwhelmingly, hugely clear that women aren't just good for breeding and can fight. And not just fight - fight really well. Why would the warboys be only men if it was somehow egalitarian and not misogynist? Why would Joe ignore the capabilities of women who can fight? He doesn't in one - and only one - case, Furiosa. And it's clearly not just because she's so exceptional - again, we see many other women fight, and fight well. (as we see throughout the rest of the Mad Max movies). What is the reason for that if it isn't because of a sexist society?

I took it that Furiosa was simply grabbing a chance to escape with a shit load of fuel to her previous home.

The tanker wasn't carrying fuel other than the spare tank which was being used to buy safe passage. The tanker was carrying milk.

i didn't however see her 'fuck over' other women either in action or plot expostion. The only people she deceived and led to their deaths were the warboys under her command, (who constantly referred to her as boss if memory serves)

No, you didn't see it - because you didn't see a whole lot of things that the story implied, because it assumes that the people watching it have half a brain and can figure it out. Again - why do you think that Furiosa was looking for redemption? If the only people she fucked over are the warboys on her rig, why would she need redemption? Just think about that. Furiosa isn't freeing the women because it's the right thing to do (or doesn't say as much). She isn't fleeing Joe because she hates him specifically. She is doing this because she needs to be redeemed. What does that imply? The movie doesn't have the actors say a whole lot, so it's kind of a big deal when she actually does say something.

[MerenthaClone]

She's not second-in-command. The Warboys running past Nux say "An Imperator gone rogue!" not "The Imperator gone rogue!" Rictus might not be smart, but Joe is all about his family. When Joe follows over the arch rubble, he takes Rictus' vehicle for a reason. Corpus Colossus appears to have been the one left in charge when Joe left, too.

I took it that Furiosa was simply grabbing a chance to escape with a shit load of fuel to her previous home. I also took it that she'd sell the women she rescued for safe passage. i didn't however see her 'fuck over' other women either in action or plot expostion.

...You thought Furiosa would sell the women she rescued? And escape with the same shitload of fuel she explicitly tried to sell for safe passage? The fuck movie did you watch? And yes, the implication behind "redemption" is that she'd led raids and killed many people in Joe's service, which would also lead to women being captured. Her whole motivation is redemption. This is explicitly stated; one of the few things that's explicitly stated. That's important. Why you think you can read between the lines of a movie when you missed the most explicit parts of it that weren't literal explosions, I don't know.

Also, the idea that the wives would flee a gilded cage because its still a cage is something that's been written about by feminist writers for years. I don't understand why you think that isn't a feminist "trope" or how that's even...yeah, what? This movie's pretty fucking feminist, dude.