Stag_legion Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 . . . . stannis starts seeming like a viable option again? Stormlords bent the knee after blackwater, but that was because it was either bend the knee or die/lose everything. Those who made it out with stannis stuck with him, and I think its pretty clear that +90% of stormlords would want to join stannis (the last legitimate baratheon) as soon as there is a chance to do so. Am I correct in thinking this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilish Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 No one like Stannis and the Baratheon found great opposition when they rebelled against the Mad King. Some banner men actually appreciate those who put them in a noble role in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 By not allowing Stannis to seem like a viable option. As easy as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibzit Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 Jon Con can probably rally the remaining Stormlanders pretty well, infact he is probably one of the last people who could do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferocious Veldt Roarer Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 Because changing coats is their thing. Remember Davos' riddle? "Last year they were Robert’s men. A moon ago they were Renly’s. This morning they are yours. Whose will they be on the morrow?" And the answer was, apparently, Joffrey's. Then Tommen's. Then Aegon's. Why on Earth would they suddenly become die hard Stannis followers (again)? And while the Golden Company landed in the Stormlands, and Lannisters and Tyrells are just across the street, Stannis is half the world away. For now at least, they'll rather declare for one of claimants already on the site. If Stannis ever gets back south (and that is one huge if), sure, stormlords may change their banners yet another time. But fAegon can achieve a lot in the meantime. It's certainly shorter distance from Storm's End to King's Landing than from Winterfell to Storm's End. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettes Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 Half the houses of the stormlands fought for the dragon under RR or sat in their Castles doing nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordQorgyle Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 The SL aren't loyal to Stannis, the Carons are done and the new lord of Nightsong is a Lannister man, Lord Swann hasn't participated in the war, the Dondarrions too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 some say he will use Edric Storm as Lord of SE and LP of the Stormlands. he already took half of the Stormlands castles.. most of their lords would fight for him just to get their lands back and keep their relatives safe.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skagosi High Chef Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 Ah, guys... I wouldn't worry much about fAegon and company. They will make a big splash and then sink just as quickly. Not going to be a major plotline or cause any real changes to any other plotlines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibzit Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 some say he will use Edric Storm as Lord of SE and LP of the Stormlands. he already took half of the Stormlands castles.. most of their lords would fight for him just to get their lands back and keep their relatives safe.. Seems unlikely considering that JonCon vowed to end the userper's line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stag_legion Posted May 19, 2015 Author Share Posted May 19, 2015 Half the houses of the stormlands fought for the dragon under RR or sat in their Castles doing nothing That was only when the rebels seemed unlikely to win. Once Robert won the three battles of summerhall, the stormlords joined him completely (minus jonCon), even the lords who fought him earlier. Once stannis is a viable option again I think the same will happen again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stag_legion Posted May 19, 2015 Author Share Posted May 19, 2015 Jon Con can probably rally the remaining Stormlanders pretty well, infact he is probably one of the last people who could do this. Why would stormlanders have any love for Jon Con? wasn't it one of his own relatives who promised the iron throne he would kill Jon Con? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 That was only when the rebels seemed unlikely to win. Once Robert won the three battles of summerhall, the stormlords joined him completely (minus jonCon), even the lords who fought him earlier. Once stannis is a viable option again I think the same will happen again. ...and a lot of other Stormlanders. JonCon's army was made up of Stormlanders to a very large extent and way more Stormlanders fought for RHaegar at the Trident than the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsOfBrains Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 The Storm Lords seem like a bunch of fickle A holes if you ask me. Whoever seems to be the most likely to give them their way in whatever petty squabble/land grab they are currently embroiled in is likely to be their new lord. I kind of liked fAegon before I heard that he had a bunch of elephants messing up the lands belonging to my main man Davos. Now that kid has to go. Considering only one or two dudes IN HIS OWN CASTLE recognized him I don't know how much of a following Jon Con is going to automatically command, especially considering he is/was exiled by a Targaryn (how is a secret Targaryn loyalist supposed to follow a man exiled by Targaryn power?), has grey scale (that can't stay secret forever), and is a homosexual (I guess it didn't keep them from loving Renly but its another strike against him). I have a feeling fAegon is going to be the Quentyn of Winds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Seems unlikely considering that JonCon vowed to end the userper's line. i took that to mean "his" legitimate children ... but its a good point.. Robert killed Rhaegar... so he may hate him enough to actually try to kill his bastard children as well... or at least refuse to give them SE.. even though it would be a good solution to keep the Stormlords in line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord of Moat Cailin Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 some say he will use Edric Storm as Lord of SE and LP of the Stormlands. he already took half of the Stormlands castles.. most of their lords would fight for him just to get their lands back and keep their relatives safe..I would've assumed he'd give JonConn that title until JonConn died and probably Raymund Connington as his heir, as he's a male Connington not declaring he'll kill JonConn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord of Moat Cailin Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 The Storm Lords seem like a bunch of fickle A holes if you ask me. Whoever seems to be the most likely to give them their way in whatever petty squabble/land grab they are currently embroiled in is likely to be their new lord. I kind of liked fAegon before I heard that he had a bunch of elephants messing up the lands belonging to my main man Davos. Now that kid has to go. Considering only one or two dudes IN HIS OWN CASTLE recognized him I don't know how much of a following Jon Con is going to automatically command, especially considering he is/was exiled by a Targaryn (how is a secret Targaryn loyalist supposed to follow a man exiled by Targaryn power?), has grey scale (that can't stay secret forever), and is a homosexual (I guess it didn't keep them from loving Renly but its another strike against him). I have a feeling fAegon is going to be the Quentyn of Winds.I don't think people know he's homosexual Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhitewolfStark Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 The Storm Lords seem like a bunch of fickle A holes if you ask me. They're simply doing what most Medieval lords would do: find a way to preserve the family and keep what they have. Often times families in Medieval times would (if they had large enough families) send brothers to fight on opposite sides of a war, in order to ensure that no matter who won, the family lands and titles would remain in the family, and that the family name would go on. Inheritance & legacy is everything to a Medieval lord (and still a hot button issue to this day), and the prime motivator for about 90% of their actions.It's why Richard II IRL was deposed so easily by his lords, and why Richard III couldn't muster up a majority of the nobility to keep his throne (nearly 80% of the nobility chose to stay home than ride and defend Richard III's crown). Those kings messed with inheritance rights, and messing with inheritance rights will win you little loyalty amongst a nobility whose entire point in living is to try and ensure that what you have will pass on to your children--that the family line will prevail, that you might end up getting better, but the answer acceptable to everyone is that you don't end up making things worse or losing things in clearly risky gambles.Richard II outright suspended the inheritance right of his cousin Henry Bolingbrooke. Bolingbrooke was banished for X amount of years, during which his father John of Gaunt, the Duke of Lancaster died. Richard II extended Bolingbrooke's banishment to life and plundered John of Gaunt's wealth to support his wars in Ireland. While Richard was away, Henry returned to claim his inheritance, and the nobles gathered round him because they realized if the precedent of Richard taking Henry's inheritance away went unchallenged, then what was to prevent their own inheritances from being stolen from their families by the crown in the future? Richard II is deposed. Richard III along with his brother George, Duke of Clarence, violated inheritance laws in a "exploit the legal loophole" kind of way. He married Anne Neville, daughter of the Duke of Warwick. The Duke of Warwick had been on the Yorkist side of the Wars of the Roses but switched after the Woodvilles continued to social climb through advantageous marriages (that were seen as above their station), and Warwick was shamed after having made a betrothal arrangement for Edward IV to marry a French Princess, only to receive word that Edward IV had secretly wed Elizabeth Woodville in secret. So Warwick switched allegiances (along with George), only to be killed in battle. George and Richard married Warwick's two daughters (George had married to seal the switching sides allegiance, and Richard married Anne after she'd been traded first to Prince Edward (of the Lancaster line) but then made quickly a widow. To jump ahead to the inheritance games that were played... while Edward IV was alive, George and Richard fought over who got the Warwick estates and lands. It didn't help they were the wealthiest and largest in England at the time, and that they'd been the result of many many marriages and estates being joined together by a lot of strategic marriages over the years--especially with Warwick's own latest marriage to his wife, the now widowed Dowager Duchess of Warwick. In the legal battles that would follow where George and Richard turned on each other--each challenging the other to what the other claimed in trying to divide the estate that was rightfully their wives'--the lands and estates that the Dowager Duchess of Warwick had brought to the marriage herself. The Dowager Duchess was declared "legally dead" despite being very alive and kicking, and her lands and inheritances were added into the legal battle between George and Richard. You see it was that long messy inheritance battle where the legal loophole was found of declaring the Dowager Duchess "legally dead" which really didn't inspire a lot of the nobles to put a lot of faith in the House of York. That again sent noblemen worrying what might happen in the future if any king might be able to declare any of them "legally dead". And that's why nearly 80% of the nobles didn't respond to Richard III's call to do battle with Henry Tudor, but instead decided to stay at home. They voted with their feet. Compare that to when Edward IV was fighting the throne and the majority of them came out to fight. That's when you know that you've got a bad "approval rating". And guess what Cersei has been messing with the entirety of AFFC? Inheritance rights.That's why I see fAegon entering King's Landing and having the South accept him with welcome arms. Cersei's been making all the wrong decisions with regards to inheritance choices and it's going to come back to bite her big time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Aegon expects aunt Dany to show up with dragons. No matter how great Stannis is, or how much support he has, dragons are a game changer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibzit Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Considering only one or two dudes IN HIS OWN CASTLE recognized him I don't know how much of a following Jon Con is going to automatically command, especially considering he is/was exiled by a Targaryn (how is a secret Targaryn loyalist supposed to follow a man exiled by Targaryn power?), has grey scale (that can't stay secret forever), and is a homosexual (I guess it didn't keep them from loving Renly but its another strike against him). I have a feeling fAegon is going to be the Quentyn of Winds. Nobody knows that JonCon is a homosexual, even JonCon doesn't know JonCon is a homosexual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.