Alden Rothack Posted November 5, 2022 Author Share Posted November 5, 2022 Tyrells are descended through the female line and considered lesser for it, the Baratheons on the other hand are the main line 20 hours ago, Adelstein said: Or perhaps this kind of nonsense is why he decided not to get into the business of tiering titles and just called everyone "lord", letting them sort it out between themselves. which is understandable but dosn't work or William the Bastard would have done the same thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 2 minutes ago, Alden Rothack said: William the Bastard Harold Godwinson. The last true king of England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alden Rothack Posted November 5, 2022 Author Share Posted November 5, 2022 What a pity his reign was so short Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 Just now, Alden Rothack said: What a pity his reign was so short Could have been a great king for a longer period of time. Such a cool name too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alden Rothack Posted November 5, 2022 Author Share Posted November 5, 2022 Give him a dragonrider Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 2 minutes ago, Alden Rothack said: Give him a dragonrider Straight up just make him a dragonrider. Harold Godwinson riding a dragon. That is a film I would pay to see. Also I would like to see Konradin as a dragon rider, reclaiming his rightful Kingdom of Sicily, getting rid of Charles of Anjou and becoming King of the Germans and Emperor. I would give my appendix to see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 54 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: Harold Godwinson. The last true king of England. Too bad no one gave Aegon seven feet of good Westeros soil, or as much more as he needed, since he is said to be taller than Others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 5 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said: Too bad no one gave Aegon seven feet of good Westeros soil, or as much more as he needed, since he is said to be taller than Others. As much as I dislike William him becoming king of England is arguably more impressive than Aegon becoming king of Westeros since Aegon only did that because he had dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 1 minute ago, Craving Peaches said: As much as I dislike William him becoming king of England is arguably more impressive than Aegon becoming king of Westeros since Aegon only did that because he had dragons. He dealt a low blow by attacking Harold who was also under attack by Harald. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 2 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said: He dealt a low blow by attacking Harold who was also under attack by Harald. From my understanding Harald had already been beaten by that point. The larger Saxon army got drunk celebrating and then were beaten by the smaller Norman army. But yes, it was a low blow by invading when someone else was also invading. Still not as low a blow as invading with dragons though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldarion Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 28 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: From my understanding Harald had already been beaten by that point. The larger Saxon army got drunk celebrating and then were beaten by the smaller Norman army. But yes, it was a low blow by invading when someone else was also invading. Still not as low a blow as invading with dragons though. No, they weren't. Harold's Saxon army was in southern England to counter William's expected invasion when it had to force-march (185 miles in four days) to counter Harald's Vikings. They beat them (Battle of Stamford Bridge), but then Harold received news of William landing, and so had to force-march his army all the way back again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alester Florent Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 11 minutes ago, Aldarion said: No, they weren't. Harold's Saxon army was in southern England to counter William's expected invasion when it had to force-march (185 miles in four days) to counter Harald's Vikings. They beat them (Battle of Stamford Bridge), but then Harold received news of William landing, and so had to force-march his army all the way back again. There is some debate over whether the army that fought at Hastings was substantively the same as fought at Stamford Bridge or whether it was mostly comprised of freshly-raised levies from the local area, but it's undeniable that had Harald and William not attacked near-simultaneously (thanks in part to some very fortuitous weather on William's part) Harold would have been in a much stronger position to resist, and since Hastings was a close-run thing anyway... Then again, Harold arguably got quite lucky at Stamford Bridge 1 hour ago, Alden Rothack said: which is understandable but dosn't work or William the Bastard would have done the same thing William didn't create any new titles when he conquered England. He retained the title of "earl" although reduced it significantly in power (pre-conquest earls had generally governed former kingdoms; post-conquest earls were associated with shires). Other than the earls, other nobles were generally just of "lord" rank. This was, notably, a much less complex noble system than existed in France at the time. The baronage evolved over the next 150 years, before becoming semi-formalised in the 13th century. The first dukes were created in the 1330s. The first marquesses were created in the 1390s and the first viscounts in the 1440s. 1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said: Also I would like to see Konradin as a dragon rider, reclaiming his rightful Kingdom of Sicily, getting rid of Charles of Anjou and becoming King of the Germans and Emperor. I would give my appendix to see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 23 minutes ago, Aldarion said: No, they weren't. Harold's Saxon army was in southern England to counter William's expected invasion when it had to force-march (185 miles in four days) to counter Harald's Vikings. They beat them (Battle of Stamford Bridge), but then Harold received news of William landing, and so had to force-march his army all the way back again. Well then my secondary school history teacher lied to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldarion Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 18 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: Well then my secondary school history teacher lied to me   Maybe, maybe not. As @Adelstein noted, there is some debate on what exactly happened, as Anglo-Saxon fyrd system (in some ways similar to Byzantine themes) meant that they actually had extensive well-trained territorial militia. So there is a possibility that Harold only marched his personal retinue north and back south while rest of the forces would have been raised locally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alden Rothack Posted November 6, 2022 Author Share Posted November 6, 2022 7 hours ago, Craving Peaches said: As much as I dislike William him becoming king of England is arguably more impressive than Aegon becoming king of Westeros since Aegon only did that because he had dragons. And three other brillant commanders who were loyal to him, Williams brothers rebelled almost as soon as the conquest was over Willam was a bastard and the harrowing of the north was unforgivable but he was damn good at conquering, if he'd stayed in france he'd be my second favourite frenchman after Karl the Hammer (names just aewsome) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 6, 2022 Share Posted November 6, 2022 3 hours ago, Alden Rothack said: Willam was a bastard and the harrowing of the north was unforgivable Yep. No good. Bad even by standards of time I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alden Rothack Posted November 6, 2022 Author Share Posted November 6, 2022 yes, not even the ironborne deserve that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alester Florent Posted November 6, 2022 Share Posted November 6, 2022 15 hours ago, Alden Rothack said: And three other brillant commanders who were loyal to him, Williams brothers rebelled almost as soon as the conquest was over Willam was a bastard and the harrowing of the north was unforgivable but he was damn good at conquering, if he'd stayed in france he'd be my second favourite frenchman after Karl the Hammer (names just aewsome) William's brothers didn't rebel against him. He later fell out with his half-brother Odo, and imprisoned him for a while, but it's not clear why and there were never any banners raised in Odo's name. His other half-brother Robert remained loyal throughout. The Conqueror's half-brothers did briefly rebel against William II, but it does not seem to have been a significant issue. His son, Robert, did rebel, but that was much later than the Conquest, largely confined to Normandy, and because he was dissatisfied with the inheritance arrangements. That dispute continued into the reigns of William's successors William II and Henry I, which may be what you're thinking of. William did face a number of rebellions in England after the Conquest, but they were at the hands of the native aristocracy rather than his own disloyal companions. The rebellions were also in almost all cases sponsored and in some cases actively joined by foreign powers - Scotland and Denmark in the case of the English rebellions and France in the case of the Norman ones. Foreign interference is, thanks to geography, much less of a factor in Westeros, and the only place where there seem to have been significant rebellions is the one place Aegon was unable to hold onto, i.e. Dorne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted November 6, 2022 Share Posted November 6, 2022 3 minutes ago, Alden Rothack said: yes, not even the ironborne deserve that I know some people here are in favour of wiping out the Ironborn. But not all Ironborn are murdering bastards. We see reformers in Asha and the Reader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alden Rothack Posted November 6, 2022 Author Share Posted November 6, 2022 8 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: I know some people here are in favour of wiping out the Ironborn. But not all Ironborn are murdering bastards. We see reformers in Asha and the Reader. Even you put every man in the Iron Fleet to the sword it would only be a tenth as bad as what William did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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