sweetsunray Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 1 minute ago, Corvo the Crow said: Mormonts raven was where when this talk happened? At the Fist of the First Men, great ranging. Not that would make a difference for Bloodraven, who can use the weirnet to function south and north of the Wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 31 minutes ago, sweetsunray said: At the Fist of the First Men, great ranging. Not that would make a difference for Bloodraven, who can use the weirnet to function south and north of the Wall. If weirwood network can work both sides Theon’s dream may very well do so as well. Bran south of the Wall dreams of heart of winter while Jon and Bran both, as well as their wolves lose connection to the ones on the other side. So magical wolves are barred but magical dreams are not it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 1 hour ago, Corvo the Crow said: If weirwood network can work both sides Theon’s dream may very well do so as well. Bran south of the Wall dreams of heart of winter while Jon and Bran both, as well as their wolves lose connection to the ones on the other side. So magical wolves are barred but magical dreams are not it seems. The difference is not wolf or dream, but being a greenseer: the greenseer can travel to wherever via weirnet. Theon is not a greenseer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 17 minutes ago, sweetsunray said: The difference is not wolf or dream, but being a greenseer: the greenseer can travel to wherever via weirnet. Theon is not a greenseer. Is Bran one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 2 hours ago, Corvo the Crow said: If weirwood network can work both sides Theon’s dream may very well do so as well. Bran south of the Wall dreams of heart of winter while Jon and Bran both, as well as their wolves lose connection to the ones on the other side. So magical wolves are barred but magical dreams are not it seems. No, they don’t. They communicate in a dream of sorts when Jon & Ghost are beyond the Wall w/ Qhorin and Bran & Summer are hiding in the Winterfell crypts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 1 minute ago, Corvo the Crow said: Is Bran one? ““Will this make me a greenseer?” “Your blood makes you a greenseer,” said Lord Brynden. “This will help awaken your gifts and wed you to the trees.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Just now, kissdbyfire said: No, they don’t. They communicate in a dream of sorts when Jon & Ghost are beyond the Wall w/ Qhorin and Bran & Summer are hiding in the Winterfell crypts. Quote “Snow,” the moon called down again, cackling. The white wolf padded along the man trail beneath the icy cliff. The taste of blood was on his tongue, and his ears rang to the song of the hundred cousins. Once they had been six, five whimpering blind in the snow beside their dead mother, sucking cool milk from her hard dead nipples whilst he crawled off alone. Four remained … and one the white wolf could no longer sense. -ADwD Jon III Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Just now, Corvo the Crow said: One example where they couldn’t, and one where they could. So you can’t say it’s impossible because it clearly isn’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 5 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said: One example where they couldn’t, and one where they could. So you can’t say it’s impossible because it clearly isn’t. One example he couldn't because he was beyond the wall. Quote Sometimes he could sense them, though, as if they were still with him, only hidden from his sight by a boulder or a stand of trees. He could not smell them, nor hear their howls by night, yet he felt their presence at his back . . . all but the sister they had lost. His tail drooped when he remembered her. Four now, not five. Four and one more, the white who has no voice. -ASoS Bran I Another example of Bran Sensing, before passing the wall. Couldn't find any mentions of Bran sensing/feeling etc. the rest after passing the wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 11 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said: Quote Four remained … and one the white wolf could no longer sense. -ADwD Jon III The one Ghost can no longer sense is Grey Wind, because Grey Wind is dead. There are 4 direwolves left Ghost Summer Shaggy Nymeria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 4 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said: One example he couldn't because he was beyond the wall. Another example of Bran Sensing, before passing the wall. Couldn't find any mentions of Bran sensing/feeling etc. the rest after passing the wall. I don’t know what else to say. You said communication is not possible when the Wall is between the individuals in question. I posted a quote where communication happens when Bran is south of the Wall and Jon north of the Wall, clearly proving it isn’t impossible since it’s happened already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 8 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said: One example he couldn't because he was beyond the wall. Another example of Bran Sensing, before passing the wall. Couldn't find any mentions of Bran sensing/feeling etc. the rest after passing the wall. Bran appears in Jon's dream in the Frostfangs. Bran is in the crypts at that moment. Yes, Bran is a greenseer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 2 minutes ago, sweetsunray said: The one Ghost can no longer sense is Grey Wind, because Grey Wind is dead. There are 4 direwolves left Ghost Summer Shaggy Nymeria Four remained and one of them Ghost could no longer sense, Summer, because he was on the Other side of the wall. Quote It was a long moment before he understood what was happening. When he did, he bolted to his feet. “Ghost?” He turned toward the wood, and there he came, padding silently out of the green dusk, the breath coming warm and white from his open jaws. “Ghost!” he shouted, and the direwolf broke into a run. He was leaner than he had been, but bigger as well, and the only sound he made was the soft crunch of dead leaves beneath his paws. When he reached Jon he leapt, and they wrestled amidst brown grass and long shadows as the stars came out above them. “Gods, wolf, where have you been?” Jon said when Ghost stopped worrying at his forearm. “I thought you’d died on me, like Robb and Ygritte and all the rest. I’ve had no sense of you, not since I climbed the Wall, not even in dreams.” The direwolf had no answer, but he licked Jon’s face with a tongue like a wet rasp, and his eyes caught the last light and shone like two great red suns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Just now, Corvo the Crow said: Four remained and one of them Ghost could no longer sense, Summer, because he was on the Other side of the wall. The one that can no longer be sensed is Grey Wind. After Jon wakes up he realizes Ghost knows Robb and Grey Wind are dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Just now, sweetsunray said: Bran appears in Jon's dream in the Frostfangs. Bran is in the crypts at that moment. Jon sees Bran in dreams, doesn't mean it's Bran, doesn't mean even if it's Bran no special circumstances apply such as being near Weirwood tree etc. and even then, let's say Bran reaches through te weirwood underground fiberglass, how does Jon receive, did he have any Weirwoods close at hand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 2 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said: Jon sees Bran in dreams, doesn't mean it's Bran, doesn't mean even if it's Bran no special circumstances apply such as being near Weirwood tree etc. and even then, let's say Bran reaches through te weirwood underground fiberglass, how does Jon receive, did he have any Weirwoods close at hand? It is Bran, because Bran's last chapter (that reveals he's in the crypts) has Bran remembering he dreamed of Jon. Quote He remembered who he was all too well; Bran the boy, Bran the broken. Better Bran the beastling. Was it any wonder he would sooner dream his Summer dreams, his wolf dreams? Here in the chill damp darkness of the tomb his third eye had finally opened. He could reach Summer whenever he wanted, and once he had even touched Ghost and talked to Jon. Though maybe he had only dreamed that. (aCoK, Bran IV) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 3 minutes ago, sweetsunray said: The one that can no longer be sensed is Grey Wind. After Jon wakes up he realizes Ghost knows Robb and Grey Wind are dead. No. Sorry but you are making stuff up. This takes place in ADwD III. Jon has already been made Lord Commander, Stannis come and gone, he knows of Red Wedding as seen in earlier chapter. Quote Jon pissed in darkness, filling his chamber pot as the Old Bear's raven muttered complaints. The wolf dreams had been growing stronger, and he found himself remembering them even when awake. Ghost knows that Grey Wind is dead. Robb had died at the Twins, betrayed by men he'd believed his friends, and his wolf had perished with him. Bran and Rickon had been murdered too, beheaded at the behest of Theon Greyjoy, who had once been their lord father's ward … but if dreams did not lie, their direwolves had escaped. At Queenscrown, one had come out of the darkness to save Jon's life. Summer, it had to be. His fur was grey, and Shaggydog is black. He wondered if some part of his dead brothers lived on inside their wolves. -ADwD I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Not making things up, just remembering it as being in Jon I. Must be because the same quotes get quoted often in the same analysis. Nevertheless: Jon thinks Ghost knows about Grey Wind being dead, because Jon knows Ghost cannot sense him whenever Jon skinchanges him. And yes, the dream of Jon I is an example of that. The recent library draft versions of aFfC, are in support of the one he cannot sense anymore is the 5th, Grey Wind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted March 7, 2023 Author Share Posted March 7, 2023 On 3/6/2023 at 12:22 PM, kissdbyfire said: Yes, she’s deader than Ned. I question Ned being dead too. Nobody recognizes his body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 1 minute ago, Tradecraft said: I question Ned being dead too. Nobody recognizes his body. Oh. I suppose we disagree then, I think Ned is deader than Bobby B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.