A nice post I found on Tumblr which elaborates on the Madonna/whore complex the fandom has regarding Jaime and Cersei's relationship.

[frenin]

5 minutes ago, Dofs said:

I've already said that Jaime wants to marry Cersei and just thinks of the most obvious way how because it was already done by others. That's all there is. Jaime at the point of thinking this doesn't care whatsoever about politics, how anyone perceives anything and what would anyone say about it. He simply wants to realize his lifelong dream of stopping to hide his relationship with Cersei because he really doesn't like hiding it. That's all there is, you can of course see whatever you want there, will not make it true though.

So Jaime saying that he and his family too are above the laws of men, just like gods is simply a severe case of lovesick. Ahain, how convenient, i wonder what the reaction would be if Cersei said that. Yeah, maybe OP was onto something when he's calling the double standards when it comes to the twins.

He does not need to care about politics, he still believes he can be a god. There's an even more obvious way to get to be with Cersei, the one Ned offered them, getting the hell out of there but no, the first thing that comes to his not at all narcissistic ass is imitating the ptolemaic dynasty with god complex. 

 

11 minutes ago, Dofs said:

You sure you are quite sure?

Come one, spill it aalready.

 

13 minutes ago, Dofs said:

So... you are saying "Lannister" is not his identity?

A part of it yeah. 

 

13 minutes ago, Dofs said:

What, Kevan wasn't blind to her cheating on Jaime? 

Including, incoming headcanon i agree beforehand, but Kevan already knew Cersei was meant to Rhaegar so she was never that in love with Jaime.

 

On 11/20/2023 at 7:36 PM, Dofs said:

Was Kevan in my edition.

Weird, i don't think Jaime makes that connection with Kevan but admittedly, i may have missed it.

 

 

On 11/20/2023 at 7:36 PM, Dofs said:

You did say she doesn't count. And are still saying it in this very post.

No, i didn't i asked what others.

 

On 11/20/2023 at 7:36 PM, Dofs said:

And what are you trying to say to me here?

Jaime wasn't attracted by the Tully sis.

 

On 11/20/2023 at 7:36 PM, Dofs said:

The entire reason Jaime even remembered of his visit of the Tullys was because someone said that Jaime was very lucky not to marry Lysa, and Jaime thought that actually she was actually pretty nice when she was young. And also remembered that Catelyn was even more interesting to him than Lysa. So yeah, they definitely got his attention, even if Bryden, one of his heroes, was the start for him during that visit.

Nope, Jaime saw them pretty and moved on quickly.

But if that's the bar then what are we even arguing? Cersei was in love with Rhaegar who resembled nothing like Jaime and that's why she was attracted to Auranne so it seems she too can bigger and better.

 

 

On 11/20/2023 at 7:36 PM, Dofs said:

That Tyrion didn't read Jaime's thoughts? Yeah, I am pretty sure.

No he doesn't, funnily enough you and Tyrion reach to the same reasoning.

 

 

On 11/20/2023 at 7:36 PM, Dofs said:

I believe I gave a more elaborate answer that just Cersei being hot.

Jaime thought his own reflection was hot, nothing weird about it stop staring, staring and also projected a vaague and undefined idea of partner in Cersei... vague and undefined in so far as the only thing that breaks the camel back is her cheating.

[Dofs]

2 hours ago, frenin said:

So Jaime saying that he and his family too are above the laws of men, just like gods is simply a severe case of lovesick. Ahain, how convenient, i wonder what the reaction would be if Cersei said that. Yeah, maybe OP was onto something when he's calling the double standards when it comes to the twins.

I think you should start asking about triple standards, actually.

2 hours ago, frenin said:

He does not need to care about politics, he still believes he can be a god. There's an even more obvious way to get to be with Cersei, the one Ned offered them, getting the hell out of there but no, the first thing that comes to his not at all narcissistic ass is imitating the ptolemaic dynasty with god complex. 

Of course, a god, then his hand got chopped, and he thought he was worthless. 

Makes perfect sense.

I won't even talk about how we have almost twenty chapters of his where it's pretty clear that he is not narcissistic but it's not like you read them fully anyway.

2 hours ago, frenin said:

Come one, spill it aalready.

On what?

2 hours ago, frenin said:

A part of it yeah. 

So why he feels worthless without a sword hand?

2 hours ago, frenin said:

Including, incoming headcanon i agree beforehand, but Kevan already knew Cersei was meant to Rhaegar so she was never that in love with Jaime.

Why headcanon? You obviously read it from your version, otherwise I have no idea how you could have thought of this seriously.

2 hours ago, frenin said:

Weird, i don't think Jaime makes that connection with Kevan but admittedly, i may have missed it.

You did indeed.

2 hours ago, frenin said:

No, i didn't i asked what others.

You did though. This is the reason why you mentioned how he thought of Cersei during it.

2 hours ago, frenin said:

Nope, Jaime saw them pretty and moved on quickly.

But if that's the bar then what are we even arguing? Cersei was in love with Rhaegar who resembled nothing like Jaime and that's why she was attracted to Auranne so it seems she too can bigger and better.

What are you even arguing about? That Jaime didn't proclaim his love towards the Tullys or what? 

2 hours ago, frenin said:

No he doesn't, funnily enough you and Tyrion reach to the same reasoning.

The irony is you reaching a reasoning about me reaching a reasoning.

2 hours ago, frenin said:

Jaime thought his own reflection was hot, nothing weird about it stop staring, staring and also projected a vaague and undefined idea of partner in Cersei... 

I have no idea what you wrote here.

2 hours ago, frenin said:

vague and undefined in so far as the only thing that breaks the camel back is her cheating.

And yet Jaime couldn't help but get angry about everything she did in Feast.

Anyway, what's the point of the argument here? You and I have clearly read different books and neither you or me are going to be arguing seriously with each other. 

Edited November 21, 2023 by Dofs

[Lord of Raventree Hall]

8 hours ago, frenin said:

But if that's the bar then what are we even arguing? Cersei was in love with Rhaegar who resembled nothing like Jaime and that's why she was attracted to Auranne so it seems she too can bigger and better.

….Why do you assume Jaime and Rhaegar look nothing alike? They both have fair hair and fair eyes. They are both considered beautiful men (I think this part is important when seperating from other handsome men like Robert who was not considered beautiful). I would say it’s quite possible that Rhaegar and Jaime had overlapping features. Cersei has a type : Somewhat slim, fair features, who are pretty boys. 

Also I’ve noticed a tendency for people to say this line : “They liked this person only because they look like another person they like.” - Nah peeps, they have a type. Do none of the users here have a type? lol. Granted, I do think you could LEARN to like certain things through dating someone (although i think those would mostly be personality related and not physical feature related)…but honestly, Cersei just has a type. 

Edited November 22, 2023 by Lord of Raventree Hall

[frenin]

17 hours ago, Dofs said:

I think you should start asking about triple standards, actually.

I do have to agree indeed, when a man comparing himself to gods completely seriously is not a sign of narcissism there's only one thing for me to say. Bravo George.

 

17 hours ago, Dofs said:

Of course, a god, then his hand got chopped, and he thought he was worthless. 

Makes perfect sense.

I won't even talk about how we have almost twenty chapters of his where it's pretty clear that he is not narcissistic but it's not like you read them fully anyway.

How doesn't it make perfect sense? One of the things that made him believe he was a different breed was very much his skill in combat, lost that he does not know who he is anymore.

 

 

17 hours ago, Dofs said:

On what?

You keep asking me if i'm sure.

Do you have a big reveal you're just teasing?

 

18 hours ago, Dofs said:

So why he feels worthless without a sword hand?

Him being a great knight was part of his identity, he lost that.

 

18 hours ago, Dofs said:

You did indeed.

Can you quote it?

 

18 hours ago, Dofs said:

You did though. This is the reason why you mentioned how he thought of Cersei during it.

No, I asked what others and i stated that he was too thinking too about Cersei when it came to Brienne.

 

18 hours ago, Dofs said:

What are you even arguing about? That Jaime didn't proclaim his love towards the Tullys or what? 

That him considering pretty is not the same as him being attracted to them.

Then again this whole discussion started because of the assertion Cersei could not do better than Jaime because he is her twin, it seemed she found her match in Aurane who resembled the person she truly wanted.

 

18 hours ago, Dofs said:

I have no idea what you wrote here.

You do not believe there's nothing odd or narcissistic on the fact that the person Jaime fell in love with was his carbon copy... it is not odd at all, it is just Jaime finding himself hot but there is nothing to see here.

 

 

18 hours ago, Dofs said:

And yet Jaime couldn't help but get angry about everything she did in Feast.

And howdy, he seemed to recall every three seconds the fact that she had fucked even with Moonboy, Jesus i  wonder if there's no correlation.

 

 

18 hours ago, Dofs said:

Anyway, what's the point of the argument here? You and I have clearly read different books and neither you or me are going to be arguing seriously with each other. 

Indeed, you seemed to reach that conclusion earlier but couldn't help yourself i guess. 

Debating is fun, so long it's civil, and when we get tired or bored, i'll call it quits.

 

12 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

Why do you assume Jaime and Rhaegar look nothing alike?

Cersei has never said they resembled each other and she thought about both of them quite a bit, when she saw Aurane her first thought was Rhaegar, not Jaime.

 

 

12 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

They both have fair hair and fair eyes.

Unless the point is that they both glow at night. I don't think a person having blond golden hair and green eyes resembles one who has silver platinum hair and violet eyes.

 

 

12 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

They are both considered beautiful men

So is Loras, i don't remember Cersei noticing or anyone else for that matter.

 

 

12 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

I would say it’s quite possible that Rhaegar and Jaime had overlapping features. Cersei has a type : Somewhat slim, fair features, who are pretty boys. 

The only comparison we have is from Cersei, who said that Jaime was nothing compared to beatiful Rhaegar.

 

12 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

Also I’ve noticed a tendency for people to say this line : “They liked this person only because they look like another person they like.” - Nah peeps, they have a type. Do none of the users here have a type? lol. Granted, I do think you could LEARN to like certain things through dating someone (although i think those would mostly be personality related and not physical feature related)…but honestly, Cersei just has a type. 

Everyone has a type but when the type happens to be yourself, it becomes sus.

[Lord of Raventree Hall]

44 minutes ago, frenin said:

Cersei has never said they resembled each other and she thought about both of them quite a bit, when she saw Aurane her first thought was Rhaegar, not Jaime.

frenin, lol - That isn't how types work. Hmmm. I do not ever talk about my ex-girlfriends looking like my wife...but they do. Because I have a type. Now granted, they don't look like sisters or something, but there are clear features they have in common. Large cheekbones, round faces, lots of eye fat, and strong jawlines, literally 6 women in a row I dated all had these features. However, I am not going around talking about how much they look alike...as they aren't twins or family member looking, lol. 

Again, even in my own head, I don't think about this often. It would just be weird, lol. Now, if I dated someone who looked like a sister of my ex...then I would comment/think about it. But that has yet to happen, lol. 

[Dofs]

6 hours ago, frenin said:

I do have to agree indeed, when a man comparing himself to gods completely seriously is not a sign of narcissism there's only one thing for me to say. Bravo George.

What's the one thing?

6 hours ago, frenin said:

How doesn't it make perfect sense?

I thought I said it made perfect sense?

6 hours ago, frenin said:

One of the things that made him believe he was a different breed was very much his skill in combat, lost that he does not know who he is anymore.

What do you mean he doesn't know who he is anymore? Isn't he a Lannister above gods?

6 hours ago, frenin said:

You keep asking me if i'm sure.

Do you have a big reveal you're just teasing?

I am teasing.. a big spill out... on something... 

6 hours ago, frenin said:

Him being a great knight was part of his identity, he lost that.

But why would he feel worthless if he was a Lannister above gods?

6 hours ago, frenin said:

Can you quote it?

Eh, fine, so be it, I will:

"Aye," his cousin said. "I don't doubt your sister needs you. Why did she send off Kevan? I thought she'd make him Hand."

"He would not take it." He was not as blind as I was.

6 hours ago, frenin said:

No, I asked what others and i stated that he was too thinking too about Cersei when it came to Brienne.

So why did you mention that he thought about Cersei in that moment?

6 hours ago, frenin said:

That him considering pretty is not the same as him being attracted to them.

Yet he thought Catelyn to be interesting and compared her to Cersei. Yeah, it was totally platonic, brotherly even, haha

6 hours ago, frenin said:

Then again this whole discussion started because of the assertion Cersei could not do better than Jaime because he is her twin, it seemed she found her match in Aurane who resembled the person she truly wanted.

Haha, I wasn't even serious when I mentioned it. 

Not sure what Aurane has to do with anything either. In what way she found her match?

6 hours ago, frenin said:

You do not believe there's nothing odd or narcissistic on the fact that the person Jaime fell in love with was his carbon copy... it is not odd at all, it is just Jaime finding himself hot but there is nothing to see here.

I believe that it can be a sign, but not necessarily, and you have to look at more evidence than just that. You will see this evidence in Cersei, but not in Jaime.

6 hours ago, frenin said:

And howdy, he seemed to recall every three seconds the fact that she had fucked even with Moonboy, Jesus i  wonder if there's no correlation.

You think there is?

6 hours ago, frenin said:

Indeed, you seemed to reach that conclusion earlier but couldn't help yourself i guess. 

Debating is fun, so long it's civil, and when we get tired or bored, i'll call it quits.

What conclusion are you talking about?

And, I mean, I simply respond to short snappy remarks with short snappy remarks, I will not say I was debating at all since I know it's pointless. Because as I have said, we read different books, and you tend to bend facts in order to win an argument instead of actually debate with any kind of analysis.

But if you wanna continue to do that, sure, I will.

5 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

frenin, lol - That isn't how types work. Hmmm. I do not ever talk about my ex-girlfriends looking like my wife...but they do. Because I have a type. Now granted, they don't look like sisters or something, but there are clear features they have in common. Large cheekbones, round faces, lots of eye fat, and strong jawlines, literally 6 women in a row I dated all had these features. However, I am not going around talking about how much they look alike...as they aren't twins or family member looking, lol. 

Again, even in my own head, I don't think about this often. It would just be weird, lol. Now, if I dated someone who looked like a sister of my ex...then I would comment/think about it. But that has yet to happen, lol. 

To be honest, I think Cersei's infatuation with Rhaegar should have a huge asterisk because she was in love with him... before she even saw his face. She really fell head over heels with his status of a crown prince more than anything.

Edited November 22, 2023 by Dofs