Breaking Bad Season 3

[Relic]

Skylar does what she does because she's an emotionally immature child. I mean really, the fact that she is upset or even wants a divorce certainly isn't unreasonable but her actions are ridiculous. I guess the reason she's in such terror of Walt is that she sees that he's no longer the henpecked bitch she can control and boss around anymore. Hopefully Walt with his new calmness and perspective will be able to see through her last pathetic and desperate attempt to exert some kind of control over him.

Hmm, sounds like her actions hit a nerve.

Anyway, Walt forced his way back into the house, and into her ever day life. Doing so is akin to emotional rape. He tells her his "truth" (leaving out the fact that he enjoyed what he was doing and that he basically killed Jesse's gf) and expects her to just roll over and spread her legs for him again. So Skylar, in return, does something she's been wanting to do, with the added bonus that it might get him out of the house.

Seems fair to me.

edit - aside from the immorality of his cooking meth, lets not forget the danger Walt has put his family in. Had Skylar or Walt Jr been home when the Cartel came a-knocking to you think they would have survived?

[Zadok]

Hmm, sounds like her actions hit a nerve.

Anyway, Walt forced his way back into the house, and into her ever day life. Doing so is akin to emotional rape. He tells her his "truth" (leaving out the fact that he enjoyed what he was doing and that he basically killed Jesse's gf) and expects her to just roll over and spread her legs for him again. So Skylar, in return, does something she's been wanting to do, with the added bonus that it might get him out of the house.

Seems fair to me.

edit - aside from the immorality of his cooking meth, lets not forget the danger Walt has put his family in. Had Skylar or Walt Jr been home when the Cartel came a-knocking to you think they would have survived?

Yeah, Walt is a real asshole, he's asking her to take all this money he made and to let him have contact with his kids. I must've missed the part where Walt was trying to get Skylar to be intimate with him again. He just wants to live out his life with his family around him knowing they're taken care of. You have to remember that she knows little to nothing about what Walt actually had to do or of any danger they might be in. So in that context her actions are ridiculous.

[Commodore]

If anyone cares, one of the guys Hank beat up was MMA fighter Keith "the dean of mean" Jardine.

I also have zero sympathy for Skylar.

Walt comprises all of his ethics to provide for his family, does some horrible things, and she shits all over him.

[jurble]

Walt comprises all of his ethics to provide for his family, does some horrible things

Exactly.

[ztemhead]

why oh why can't Skylar be more like Carmella Soprano and spread her legs every time her big strong man brings home a fur coat?

[Tyrellius]

why oh why can't Skylar be more like Carmella Soprano and spread her legs every time her big strong man brings home a fur coat?

Is he bringing home a furcoat? Or is he trying to put away some money for his families mortgage and future?

I was a bit disappointed when Walter finally had his chat with Skylar. He should have laid everything down on her and fully explained that he only started cooking after he found out he was dying and that he didnt want to bankrupt them when he eventually died. Skylar felt powerless and betrayed so she reverted to a teenager and fucked someone else to hurt him.

Neither Walter nor Skylar did the right thing, but Walter had good intent behind his breaking of the law while Skylar just acted in juvenile anger.

Its not about having her spread those legs for her big strong man. Its about understanding what a dying man must be feeling with regards to his families future, without him.

Was the house fully bugged by the way? It'd be interesting to see if Saul and the chicken man overheard the I fucked Ted comment.

[Mathis]

Wow @ Skyler.

Bitch.

Skylar does what she does because she's an emotionally immature child...I guess the reason she's in such terror of Walt is that she sees that he's no longer the henpecked bitch she can control and boss around anymore. Hopefully Walt with his new calmness and perspective will be able to see through her last pathetic and desperate attempt to exert some kind of control over him.

Yeah, Walt is a real asshole, he's asking her to take all this money he made and to let him have contact with his kids.

I also have zero sympathy for Skylar.

Walt comprises all of his ethics to provide for his family, does some horrible things, and she shits all over him.

Walter had good intent behind his breaking of the law while Skylar just acted in juvenile anger.

Walt turns down the offer of financial help from his former friends, preferring to risk the lives of his family by selling drugs to crazy gangsters (murdering various people along the way), yet Skylar is the bitch in this situation? She shits all over him?

That is some twisted thinking.

[SwordoftheMorning]

Man, I guess I get the overwhelming anger towards Skylar in this forum, most of the posters I see with that attitude are men and I guess naturally sympathetic towards Walt. Me ? Fuck em, he deserves exactly what Skylar is doing to him. He agreed to leave the house, but since Skylar is moving forward with cutting his ass out of her (and the kids) life, the selfish prick tosses all that to the side and once again put's what Walt wants over everything.

Noble motives ? are you guys kidding me. There is nothing "noble" about selling drugs, or "manufacturing" to use Walt's rationalization. His hair-brained get rich quick (and undeservingly) scheme has wreaked nothing but havoc in his life, Jesse's life, and even Hank's life. Jane isn't the only one dead. The two dealers from season one, the kid Jesse had slinging for him, and I'm prolly missing a few. Let's add putting Hank's life at risk in the shootout with Tuco to the list tho.

Relic is right, Walt is using physical and emotional force to impose himself on Skylar and the kids, when she has begged him to stay away and leave her alone. He is delusional enough to think the money can buy her, like it's bought him. And lets not forget that sans the lucky break of Saul Goodman, Walt and Jesse didn't really make any money. Not nearly enough for what it's cost them and everyone around them.

Don't get me wrong. I LOVE this show, for it's realness, grittiness, pain and questions asked (and answered). The tale of Walt is clearly that shortcuts, even with the "noblest" of intentions usually don't work. There is little if any glorification of Walt and his quest. Just the painful reality that he's made a terrible decision for all the wrong reasons and that truth is costing him. As it should and generally does.

[Zadok]

Walt is a prideful ass, Skylar is a straight up cunt. I guess it's up to you which you think is worse.

She only vocalized for the first time last episode that she wished Walt would just die already but from her actions and words in the earlier seasons it's clear that she's felt that way for quite some time, even before she had any knowledge of what Walt was doing.

[Relic]

Man, I guess I get the overwhelming anger towards Skylar in this forum, most of the posters I see with that attitude are men and I guess naturally sympathetic towards Walt. Me ? Fuck em, he deserves exactly what Skylar is doing to him. He agreed to leave the house, but since Skylar is moving forward with cutting his ass out of her (and the kids) life, the selfish prick tosses all that to the side and once again put's what Walt wants over everything.

:agree:

[Tyrellius]

Don't get me wrong. I LOVE this show, for it's realness, grittiness, pain and questions asked (and answered). The tale of Walt is clearly that shortcuts, even with the "noblest" of intentions usually don't work. There is little if any glorification of Walt and his quest. Just the painful reality that he's made a terrible decision for all the wrong reasons and that truth is costing him. As it should and generally does.

Its probably the best thing on TV right now.

I kinda though Jessie in the cooking van was going to try blow himself up, but then he put the gasmask on. I cannot wait for next weeks episode.

[Samalander]

1) I think it's important to note Walt's "I earned this money" speech, as it demonstrates a very important aspect of his character - He couldn't go and accept charity from others, he has to feel he earned the money himself, through his own skills.

2) We don't actually know Skyler fucked Ted. We know she came on to him, and we know she told Walt she fucked him, but do we really know it happened?

3) What are the odds that Walt and Jesse will eventually end up on opposing sides in the drug business? And thus, Walt's one decent act (taking good care of his parter) will come back to bite him in the ass?

[ztemhead]

Man, I guess I get the overwhelming anger towards Skylar in this forum, most of the posters I see with that attitude are men and I guess naturally sympathetic towards Walt. Me ? Fuck em, he deserves exactly what Skylar is doing to him. He agreed to leave the house, but since Skylar is moving forward with cutting his ass out of her (and the kids) life, the selfish prick tosses all that to the side and once again put's what Walt wants over everything.

yeah, I was being sarcastic with the Carmella Soprano comment. I HATED her character, and am glad there's finally a mom/ wife character on TV who has a set of balls. From the moment she jacked off a tired Walt on his birthday in the first episode, I knew she was awesome.

[Third Knight on the Left]

1) I think it's important to note Walt's "I earned this money" speech, as it demonstrates a very important aspect of his character - He couldn't go and accept charity from others, he has to feel he earned the money himself, through his own skills.

2) We don't actually know Skyler fucked Ted. We know she came on to him, and we know she told Walt she fucked him, but do we really know it happened?

3) What are the odds that Walt and Jesse will eventually end up on opposing sides in the drug business? And thus, Walt's one decent act (taking good care of his parter) will come back to bite him in the ass?

She better have or I'll lose a lot of respect I have for this show.

I think the Skylar hate is easy to understand and doesn't reflect anything on the viewer, its as simple as the fact that she's always been pretty damn bitch like, going back before Walter even 'broke bad', so its just sort of a continuation of that.

Now I'm not about to defend Walt at all, he's made his decisions and needs to live with the consequences and I have no problem with Skylar wanting out, but to act like Skylar is being anything else but petty and vindictive by sleeping with Ted is just nonsense. Truth is that when things get to this point people just tend to be shitty toward each other and both are to blame in the cycle that continues.

[Rockroi]

Well, let me say that I think it’s a testement to how good a show BB is that it allows us all to get into such “lively” debates. And it has obviously struck a nerve with many here (on both sides of the debate).

Let me say this: if I were a Skylar fan (and I think at this point I am not, but I could come around), I would love the way she handled telling Walt what she did. She fucked her boss, and she said so immediately to basically kill any fantasies Walt had about getting their life together back in order.

But the problem I have (and others have) with Skylar’s infidelity is that it was done purely and wholly to make Walt angry; it was done out of spite and vindictiveness. Which is fine, I guess. But she did it to a man who is dying of cancer, who just spent the last 10 months of his life ensuring the financial stability of his family (something he had been unable to do prior to this), and who – after a time –gave into each and every demand Skylar made on him prior to unilaterally kicking him out of the house.

Skylar wanted to know what the extra cell phone was about; he told her. She wanted to know if he was a drug dealer; he told her. How much money? He told her. But when Skylar was going all crazy at the end of season 2, when Walt DID try to explain, she REFUSED to here the answer. She said that she didn’t WANT to know.

As Walt said- in that coldly logical way that few possess (certainly not Skylar) –he EARNED that money; he did not steal it. Its his. And its security. Like it or not. The fact that he cooked crystal meth is utterly besides the point.

Onto specific comments,

Ted isn't stealing. He's over-stating expenses in order to bring down revenues so he can give his employees cash under-the-table or something like that, so they don't have to pay taxes. It's the only way he can compete with larger businesses that are outsourcing their shit. He explained it like that or something in S2.

That’s stealing. Or at the very least he is engaging in duplicity and scheming; and I THOUGHT those were the things that Sky did not like about Walt. I think its telling here that Sky can forgive it in Ted but find it unforgivable with Walt EVEN WHEN Walt fesses up (while, you will note, Ted is – almost comically –ineptly trying to pretend its all fixable). Either you are honest and upright, or you are not.

Anyway, Walt forced his way back into the house, and into her ever day life. Doing so is akin to emotional rape.

I think this is a classic example of just tossing around the word “rape” for effect without identifying how it fits. Walt was kicked out of his house by his wife NOT for being a drug dealer (she didn’t know); we are actually not 100% sure why she wanted him out. This is why I find Skylar infuriating. She never states TO ANYONE why she cannot stomach Walt and why he has to leave. She never even demands or asks that he stop selling Meth AFTER she finds out. She never asks for the truth; she never asks for reasons or answers. She just gets angry. Fine. But now don't complain that you didn't know or that Walt was being dishonest. He came clean. Either say "Stop dealing Meth" or "I need space" or something else, but don't just keeping huffing and puffing and DEMANDING that Walt do what you want.

Thus, when she unilaterally kicked him out of his own home, he had the NERVE not to like it. She then said she wanted a divorce. Okay. He moved back into the house. I find it odd that people are okay with her kicking him out of his own home BEFORE she knew what he was up to. Be that as it may, Walt then made the cogent and rational decision to move back- as was his right (as the police officer stated).

So… now… Walt calls Sky’s bluff (brilliantly I may add). If Skylar REALLY WANTS a divorce, all she has to do is file the paperwork. Nothing else changes (he is not going to leave, nor would he have to). She could even say to the police “He is a meth cooker.” Walt is 100% ready for that. He made that decision.

Sky has not. She caves. Therefore, I think its safe to say that EVEN SHE does not want a divorce THAT badly.

So, again, why is she so upset? Because she isn’t getting her way? Because Walt- using merely his wits and courage – out-thought her? Well, that’s many things- its cold, its harsh, maybe difficult, but its certainly NOT rape.

aside from the immorality of his cooking meth, lets not forget the danger Walt has put his family in. Had Skylar or Walt Jr been home when the Cartel came a-knocking to you think they would have survived?

Yeah, but Sky’s not even angry about that. She never even says anything about the danger she and Walt Jr. could be in. Again, I am really unclear as to why Skjy is upset. And I think to a large degree, so is she. Its not dishonesty- he has come clean; its not the meth in and of itself, she NEVER demanded that he stop.

He tells her his "truth" (leaving out the fact that he enjoyed what he was doing and that he basically killed Jesse's gf) and expects her to just roll over and spread her legs for him again. So Skylar, in return, does something she's been wanting to do, with the added bonus that it might get him out of the house.

Fine. But that’s spite. Skylar is spiteful and mean. Let’s not pretend its something its not. And Walt never seems to have sex on his mind (but how could you blame him? HE has been having radiation and cancer for 9 months- the man may want to have sex again). What Walt does want is his family back- something he fought and killed and sacrificed so much for… oh yeah, while dying of cancer. Sky NOT ONLY does not respect that, she also DOES NOT EVEN WANT TO HEAR HIM OUT! Seriously- she does not want to be exposed to his logic (and we have no idea why). This is not about sex. Regardless she does something she has always wanted to do NOT for the sake of doing it, but for the sake of hurting Walt. You can put whatever you want on Walt; but he NEVER did anything to Skylar for the sole purpose of hurting Skylar.

Neither Walter nor Skylar did the right thing, but Walter had good intent behind his breaking of the law while Skylar just acted in juvenile anger.

This is very close to my feelings on the matter.

Walt turns down the offer of financial help from his former friends, preferring to risk the lives of his family by selling drugs to crazy gangsters (murdering various people along the way), yet Skylar is the bitch in this situation? She shits all over him?

But she does. See, Skylar NEVER ONCE states she is upset with Walt has done. Yeah, he ran with bad people for bad reasons, and made his family a small fortune and getting them financial security and stability. He killed people- she is not angry at that; he “sold drugs to crazy gangsters”; she is not upset about that. Skylar is angry for reasons that are not 100% clear. So, her reaction REALLY IS about HER and NOT about Walt.

Skylar fucks a guy FOR THE SOLE AND EXCLUSIVE PURPOSE of getting Walt angry; as angry as she is. She wants HIM to feel as bad as SHE does. That sounds disturbingly like "shitting" on a person to me.

As far as “turning down financial help” that is all well and good while Walt is alive. But were these people going to pay Sky’s mortgage? Get Walt Jr and the girl through college? I mean, really, Walt was thinking far ahead of all that. A few bucks today does not solve the underlying problems of tomorrow.

Man, I guess I get the overwhelming anger towards Skylar in this forum, most of the posters I see with that attitude are men and I guess naturally sympathetic towards Walt. Me ? Fuck em, he deserves exactly what Skylar is doing to him. He agreed to leave the house, but since Skylar is moving forward with cutting his ass out of her (and the kids) life, the selfish prick tosses all that to the side and once again put's what Walt wants over everything.

Yes, we are men. You figured us out! Us men. You OTOH are so far advanced than us.

And yet… I know how weird it is for a man to NOT BE OKAY with being completely cut out of his family’s life! GOD! Why can’t he just accept that he and his family can no longer speak EVER AGAIN! If he could only accept Sky’s unilateral fiat that SHE is making all the decisions- irrespective of logic – everything would be fine.

That selfish prick!

Walt is not putting what he wants over everything. He states FLAT OUT that Sky can get EXACTLY what she wants- the divorce and him gone; all she has to do is tell the police. Walt has pushed “all in” and Sky cannot do it. If Sky REALLY wanted him gone, all she has to do is utter two words: crystal meth. And the whole house of cards comes tumbling down. But … she can’t do it. Why? We still do not know. But Walt is willing to lose it all. This is not merely about what he wants, but what he is willing to give up.

Noble motives ? are you guys kidding me. There is nothing "noble" about selling drugs, or "manufacturing" to use Walt's rationalization. His hair-brained get rich quick (and undeservingly) scheme has wreaked nothing but havoc in his life, Jesse's life, and even Hank's life. Jane isn't the only one dead. The two dealers from season one, the kid Jesse had slinging for him, and I'm prolly missing a few. Let's add putting Hank's life at risk in the shootout with Tuco to the list tho.

I also find the righteous indignation of some to be intellectually dishonest when people say that Walt was a “drug dealer.” I bet that if we did a cross reference with those people and the thread about legalizing drugs, I BET we would get a few people who are all for legalizing drugs, but still find the time to criticize Walt. I find that baffling.

But suddenly its immoral? What if he sold bathtub gin? Or sold illegal fireworks? Or poorly made transmissions that would NEVER pass state inspection? I mean, there has to be a base-line here, right?

Alright, lets assume for a moment that it IS immoral. So its IMPOSSIBLE to have a noble motive after that? Ah.. the man was dying with a son nearing college and another child on the way, making next to nothing. He found an out. He did all that for his family. Did he enjoy some of it along the way? I am sure he did. That does not suddenly make his actions immoral.

Relic is right, Walt is using physical and emotional force to impose himself on Skylar and the kids, when she has begged him to stay away and leave her alone.

That’s not all she is doing: she is commanding him to act in a manner incongruent to everything they have had for 18 years for reasons unknown. And he is not using ANY physical force. He is living in his own home. If Sky can command him to leave, he can refuse her wish. He has. He is an adult, Sky is an adult. If Sky wants to leave, she is free to do so. Walt can raise the kids for a while; he is free to do so. She can file for divorce and demand that he pay her Separate Support, demand the house be sold, etc. But she CHOOSES NOT TO! That is her choice. She is free to do so.

That’s not “force.” That’s real life.

2) We don't actually know Skyler fucked Ted. We know she came on to him, and we know she told Walt she fucked him, but do we really know it happened?

This is an excellent point. It doesn’t change much because she did all she did just to HURT Walt, which is still shitty. And I don’t know- if you sing the Marilyn Monroe “Happy Birthday Mr. President Song” to your boss in front of your whole office, and you are a statuesque blond, pretty much everyone should assume you are fucking him.

[Blaine]

Weirdly, I agree with all of you. There isn't any moral high ground here. Not anymore, after this last episode.

Fact is, Walter has done terrible things. Ostensibly, he's done them under the guise of securing a future for his family if he dies - but we all know that his motives aren't that pure. Walt's been striking back at life in anger. He's pissed that life has dealt him this many shitty cards in a row - crap jobs, no money, cancer. Walt wasn't purely making money, he became a criminal and unleashed a really dark part of himself. And his attempts to explain that to Skylar weren't exactly 100% disclosure - but I think he believes that he did it all for his family. However, the fact is that he has put his family in a great deal of danger and he should be acknowledging that.

Skylar on the other hand has been harder to read. As Rockroi said, we don't know exactly why she turned on Walt. But after the cell phone and Walt's attempts to cover it up, she has given up on him. Maybe it's because she was mentally preparing herself to accept losing him. But the point is, when she found out Walt had the money, she didn't want to know why, she just wanted out. Why? Because she doesn't love Walt anymore. So she kicks him out. Threatens to expose him. When he won't accept that, she cheats on him.

It's ridiculous to condemn Skylar for her infidelity because she didn't assign some "higher purpose lie" to justify it, like Walt did. She did it to regain control. Because it was easier than calling the cops and putting her family through that sort of scandal. Sure, Walt's sins brought forth a big duffel full of cash, but that doesn't make them any better.

So, in short Walt is liar, a criminal and a killer. Skylar is an adulterer. Neither one of them is some sort of hero for these shitty things they've done. And saying whose worse or whose better is pointless - as it is in any crumbling marriage.

[Relic]

Well, that’s many things- its cold, its harsh, maybe difficult, but its certainly NOT rape.

Well, not physical rape, but it certainly is comparable on an emotional level. He's forcing himself onto her , no respecting her wishes that he stop doing so. I'm not sure how long its been since the plane crash and since he got asked to leave but since everyone is still wearing that stupid ribbon we can assume that no more than a month has passed. He got busted, he should at least give her some fuckin space. But Walt can't do that, because Walt is slowly turning into a sociopath, unable or unwilling to relate to her feelings on the matter.

(Damn Rock, you certainly know how to write a long fuckin post man.)

[Anya, Vengeance Demon]

he EARNED that money; he did not steal it. Its his. And its security. Like it or not.

It's not "security." If Walt ever runs afoul of the law, his family will lose the money that he earned from cooking meth PLUS the house, the car, and anything else that may have been employed as part of his criminal enterprise. One exceedingly likely result of Walt's decision to cook meth is to impoverish his family well beyond where they were at the start of the show. The idea that Walt was too far-sighted to take the Grey Matters, only to pick a line of work where he's likely to cost his family everything, perhaps including their lives, is ridiculous.

And on top of that, Walt is also frequently possessed by juvenile anger, spitefulness, and cruelty. So he has all of the faults that you attribute to Skylar, plus he's putting his family in mortal danger.

[Rockroi]

Well, not physical rape, but it certainly is comparable on an emotional level. He's forcing himself onto her , no respecting her wishes that he stop doing so.

But where it is different is that Walt is not making her do anything; he just refuses to act in accord with her directions. Walt has made it clear: call the cops on me, the money is in the duffel bag; whatever you want to do, just do it. He actually gave HER the choice and fully respected her wishes. She chose to stay quiet.

In a way, I find it troubling that we should all assume that Walt just fold to his wife's commands. Get out of the house, stay away from our children, and do not try to make contact. How is that fair to Walt? Would all of us just ascent to such treatment? Would any of us just go away without so much as a fight?

He got busted, he should at least give her some fuckin space. But Walt can't do that, because Walt is slowly turning into a sociopath, unable or unwilling to relate to her feelings on the matter.

I am not sure about this at all. First, Walt DID give Sky her space; she basically stated that his family life was over and NEVER listened to Walt or what he had to say. Her decision is void of anything resembling the give-and-take that any marriage needs (strangely, this is most prominent insofar as Sky has NEVER asked Walt if he is still cooking meth or if he plans on cooking meth... I mean, is she hates it so much, she should really demand he stop, no?). Instead, she decides on a course of action (not out of strength as others have suggested, but out of panic), REFUSES to listen to any outside influences, and then becomes sullen when she does not get her way. She is acting the child.

She then throws a temper-tantrum by fucking Ted, a crooked boss. Again, I have no problem with that if we see it for what it is: base vindictiveness, shallow cruelty and spite.

And I do not think Walt is a sociopath. I think his issues at the start of the season with the loss of the plane illustrate that. Yes, Walt is a mega jerk sometimes. But I think he is legitimately trying to mend all that. He is just horrible at it.

(Damn Rock, you certainly know how to write a long fuckin post man.)

Yeah... I meant for it to be shorter, but I had some time today and I wanted to address all the salient points. There is another thread on the board that I want to address, but it involves real life stuff and I am not sure how many people I want to offend... I'd like to keep it to under "everyone."

[Tyrellius]

Well, not physical rape, but it certainly is comparable on an emotional level. He's forcing himself onto her , no respecting her wishes that he stop doing so.

She is not cut off from the rest of the family, hell she could even move out herself. Walt is not forcing her to stay there. She should take herself off that cross, we need the wood.