Dragon sighting at Winterfell?!?

[Ghost of Groat]

Is there any way that he was seeing the past when we know of dragons visiting winterfel? It could be that he was seeing through the wierwood or that Bloodraven sent him the dream and it was a vison of his past. Note: I'm not saying this is what it was. I'm asking ok?

[Duir]

Yes of course it is a possibility. It has been discussed earlier in this thread as well, and yes Bran's wolf dreams can perhaps merge with greenseeing or BR sending him dreams.

But for me it seems to be in the present due to the sentence before mentioning "ash and smoke" and is believed to be in winterfell.

Did Winterfell ever burn according to history?

Torrhen Stark bent the knee to Aegon because of the dragons, so it might very well be.

[FittleLinger]

I got a strong impression from the show on this matter. In one of the very few wolf dreams of Bran's that are shown there, he runs randomly around, and then looks up for and examines the comet for an extensive amount of time (strong stress was put on it). So I think this is our answer - the dragon is the comet.

[Sidonie]

Hey, it's been 5 months...this thread is worth bumping! :drool:

[jentario]

I remember this... But I doubt it really is a dragon, there has been literally no mention or hint of something like that for 3 books straight and it seems like too little and confusing a detail to actually mean something. It's probably GRRM symbolizing/foreshadowing.

[mindchap]

It was Bloodraven's dragon clearing a path for Bran to escape Winterfell

[Runaway Penguin]

Interesting catch in this thread... Now I am intrigued :)

And I have to admit I completely missed the winged snake before - I guess for the same reason Bran didn't notice it to the others: there were more immediate concerns (where is Ramsay, who is dead, who is alive, how will they get out, where will they go...)

As for witnesses... There is only one, dying maester Luwin, who would see it. He might have told Osha, he wouldn't tell to the boys. And after the dragon is flown, it can fly to the Gift. Nobody lives there and area is big enough not to be seen from either Wall or normal Northern territory. So yes, it would be possible. Plausible? Not sure, we shall see.

[sabrecmc]

Very interesting! I have not read all of this thread yet, just the first few pages, but it made me think of this:

During Dany's HotU trip, there was this quote: "Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow. A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd. From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire..."

I speculated in another thread that the smoking tower was a post-sack Winterfell, but I was thinking more along the lines of a metaphorical dragon (Jon) than an actual dragon, but it tied in with the whole waking a dragon from stone thing. Hmmm...but this is an interesting catch with Summer seeing something dragon-like in the sky.

[aegon...aegoff]

Does anyone else not see wolf dreams quite so literally? No way is there a dragon in Winterfell it just doesnt make sense for a fire breathing heathen to live in perpetual winter. I think the dream is a foreshadowing. As we learned in ADWD Bran's greenseeing is not just limited to the present and this could possibly just be a reflection of the future. If some wights happen to get beyond the wall (or it falls) then there would be great use for a dragon at Winterfell and they are destructive beasts so a little of the castle may burn... There has not been a dragon in the North yet, but this dream is foreshadowing one coming.

[FittleLinger]

Does anyone else not see wolf dreams quite so literally? No way is there a dragon in Winterfell it just doesnt make sense for a fire breathing heathen to live in perpetual winter. I think the dream is a foreshadowing. As we learned in ADWD Bran's greenseeing is not just limited to the present and this could possibly just be a reflection of the future. If some wights happen to get beyond the wall (or it falls) then there would be great use for a dragon at Winterfell and they are destructive beasts so a little of the castle may burn... There has not been a dragon in the North yet, but this dream is foreshadowing one coming.

Or it was the comet, just like in wolf dreams swords are iron claws etc. The comet looked to the wolf like a fire serpent. But yeah, I totally agree it was not a literal dragon.

[silent sistah]

I may be way off in my timeline here, but isn't the time that the boys, Osha and Hodor were leaving Winterfell about the same time that the night's watch were on the fist of the first men hearing the horn blast three times for the first time in a thousand years? After reading a majority of the posts in this thread, it seems to me that might have been the magical moment that could have awakened this hypothetical Winterfell dragon. If this has already been discussed, please berate me appropriately.

[lcd52]

I may be way off in my timeline here, but isn't the time that the boys, Osha and Hodor were leaving Winterfell about the same time that the night's watch were on the fist of the first men hearing the horn blast three times for the first time in a thousand years? After reading a majority of the posts in this thread, it seems to me that might have been the magical moment that could have awakened this hypothetical Winterfell dragon. If this has already been discussed, please berate me appropriately.

Jon was in the mountains and dreamed himself into the crypts as a wolf sniffing a weirwood with his brother's face. The weirwood touched his third eye and he suddenly was in Ghost overlooking the milkwater, just as an eagle attacked. Jon woke screaming Ghost's name.

Bran woke in the crypt, having been gone three days (per Jojen). He remembered talking to Jon and seeing Winterfell burned and abandoned, through Summer. He did not mention the dragon; just the facts that he had talked to Jon and seen Winterfell in ruins. That's why they went up.

I don't really want to go all smoke and salt and fire; but blood is a saline solution, too and Jon was there in spirit at least. It is a (slim) possiblity a dragon egg hatched. I just don't remember how long it took Dany's dragons to fly. Availability of Cooked Meat probably wasn't an issue.

[mindchap]

It just seems strange that everyone totally abandoned Winterfell. It's the center of power in the north so whichever side won the fight for it wouldn't have just abandoned it. Plus some of the fire damage that's mentioned seems a little extreme to have been cause by someone setting the place on fire. And places where the walls are cracked and hot water is gushing out, if hydrothermal pressure never cracked those walls it seems unlikely that people could, or would. I mean if Winterfell is as formidable as is mentioned in the books why not just take it and hold it, instead of trying to destroy it?

[MasterJack]

It just seems strange that everyone totally abandoned Winterfell. It's the center of power in the north so whichever side won the fight for it wouldn't have just abandoned it. Plus some of the fire damage that's mentioned seems a little extreme to have been cause by someone setting the place on fire. And places where the walls are cracked and hot water is gushing out, if hydrothermal pressure never cracked those walls it seems unlikely that people could, or would. I mean if Winterfell is as formidable as is mentioned in the books why not just take it and hold it, instead of trying to destroy it?

Ramsay doesnt bother with reasons

[mindchap]

Ramsay doesnt bother with reasons

Yeah there's that too.

[The Great Jon]

Instead of flying from Winterfell what if it's flying to Winterfell? What if it was a meteorite that broke away from the comet? Would explain the severe destruction, fire damage and why it disapeared so quickly. Just a thought.

[MacNobody]

I have never seen that passage in the book before, and now I cannot wait to see what happens here!

[mitch176]

Interesting catch in this thread... Now I am intrigued :)

And I have to admit I completely missed the winged snake before - I guess for the same reason Bran didn't notice it to the others: there were more immediate concerns (where is Ramsay, who is dead, who is alive, how will they get out, where will they go...)

As for witnesses... There is only one, dying maester Luwin, who would see it. He might have told Osha, he wouldn't tell to the boys. And after the dragon is flown, it can fly to the Gift. Nobody lives there and area is big enough not to be seen from either Wall or normal Northern territory. So yes, it would be possible. Plausible? Not sure, we shall see.

Pure speculation here to try and support your theory, but is it not possible that Luwin told Osha about the Dragon, and in fact the way it went? This would then bring up the possibility of (for some unknown reason) Osha tracking the Dragon to Skagos. Complete crackpot I know, but could you imagine Cannibal Rickon returning on the back of a Dragon?

[Summerset]

I think it's possible to have a dragon hibernating under Winterfell. Tyrion found many rare and old books on dragons in the library when he was visiting Winterfell. Maybe they had these books there for a reason? My first thought when I read Summer's vision was that one of Dany's dragons got away, weren't they disappearing on her from time to time? But the more I think about it, it would have been a long way for one of hers to go, so I think there was a dragon under Winterfell, and I have no reasons why we haven't seen it spotted by anyone else, other than someone else mentioning earlier that we just haven't had a POV that would give us that information. And I'd like to add that we still don't know who Ned's mother was, so.....

[FittleLinger]

I think it's possible to have a dragon hibernating under Winterfell. Tyrion found many rare and old books on dragons in the library when he was visiting Winterfell. Maybe they had these books there for a reason? My first thought when I read Summer's vision was that one of Dany's dragons got away, weren't they disappearing on her from time to time? But the more I think about it, it would have been a long way for one of hers to go, so I think there was a dragon under Winterfell, and I have no reasons why we haven't seen it spotted by anyone else, other than someone else mentioning earlier that we just haven't had a POV that would give us that information. And I'd like to add that we still don't know who Ned's mother was, so.....

Or, the more logical - that it was not a literal dragon, just like swords are not literal iron claws and similar analogies wargs make when in wolf mode.