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Doreah

Dothraki

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Anybody know or guess how they'll handle Dothraki speech in the show? Will they just speak the Common Tongue/English, or will we get to hear real Dothraki spoken like Elvish in LOTR? I hope the latter. It would be awesomely cool to finally hear it. "Khalakka dothrea mr'anha!" I hear it in my head as gutteral but somehow also soft, especially when I imagine Khal Drogo speaking. I'm guessing GRRM created their language. Anyone know?

And who will play Khal Drogo? I can't wait for the wedding scene...God, that'll be so awesome. HBO isn't shy about putting provocative stuff on the air, so I have high hopes that they'll do it up right.

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It would be very cool to hear them talk. I hear it as First Nation (Native American) sounding.

ETA welcome to the Board.

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It would be very cool to hear them talk. I hear it as First Nation (Native American) sounding.

ETA welcome to the Board.

Native American would be cool, or Mongolian. Or maybe a combination of both. They seem a lot like the Mongols, like their word for king is "khal", which is pretty close to "khan". But you're right, they do have Native American qualities too. There aren't that many Dothraki words in the series, so I hope GRRM has more, so they can speak it in the show. It'd really make them stand out.

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Native American would be cool, or Mongolian. Or maybe a combination of both. They seem a lot like the Mongols, like their word for king is "khal", which is pretty close to "khan". But you're right, they do have Native American qualities too. There aren't that many Dothraki words in the series, so I hope GRRM has more, so they can speak it in the show. It'd really make them stand out.

GRRM made them a combination of Native American, Monogolian and one other people I can't remember at this moment, so it should be interesting to see them. (At least I think there is a third people in there)

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Native American and Mongolian seem to sum up the Dothraki well enough, not sure what a third people would be as the two already provided pretty much sums them up IMHO.

I reckon they will have Dothraki spoken as it should be. Just need to teach the guys playing the roles those lines and it's done. I wouldn't think it would be much harder (probably easier in fact) than learning Elven for LOTR would have been.

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One of the beautiful things about literature is that no matter what the author presents, we can see things in our own way. The dothraki are a perfect example for me. I do not see face hair and I hear them speaking Cherokee. Hey ya hey a ya ya. I'm all about it. Sure there are alot of differences, but There again is the beauty. It's also nice to think of some epically huge tribe sweeping the land and doing as they please. not that they aren't, as a people, starting to see the sun now, just that its nice to think what might have happened to Cortez if Khal Drogo rode out to meet him...and Cortez didn't have gunpowder, tall ships, or syphilis.

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I always definitely got a Mongol/Hun vibe from them. Nomadic, horse society, endless grass plains, feared by the 'civilised' people. Yeah, definitely more Asian Steppe than American Plains, in my opinion. A major part of that is that the Dothraki are portrayed as savage warriors, to an extent, and that's not really the first thing I think when I think of Native Americans.

Of course, the beauty of creating your own world for your story, is that you can pick and choose attributes and qualities from whatever real society you want, and just blend them all together to make something new.

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One of the beautiful things about literature is that no matter what the author presents, we can see things in our own way. The dothraki are a perfect example for me. I do not see face hair and I hear them speaking Cherokee. Hey ya hey a ya ya. I'm all about it. Sure there are alot of differences, but There again is the beauty. It's also nice to think of some epically huge tribe sweeping the land and doing as they please. not that they aren't, as a people, starting to see the sun now, just that its nice to think what might have happened to Cortez if Khal Drogo rode out to meet him...and Cortez didn't have gunpowder, tall ships, or syphilis.

I believe syphilis came from the new world, it was whooping cough, measles, tuberculosis and thousands of viral colds that the europeans brought with them that devastated the native people here.

I always pictured the Dothraki as more Mongol than native American. Wonder how hard it would be to hire a bunch of mongols in Ireland? I suppose they won't need many until later in the series, at first it would only be Drogo and maybe his bloodriders etc.

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I always pictured the Dothraki as more Mongol than native American. Wonder how hard it would be to hire a bunch of mongols in Ireland? I suppose they won't need many until later in the series, at first it would only be Drogo and maybe his bloodriders etc.

Apparently they are going to film the Dothraki scenes in Morocco. So they may look Arabic. :P

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I believe syphilis came from the new world, it was whooping cough, measles, tuberculosis and thousands of viral colds that the europeans brought with them that devastated the native people here.

I always pictured the Dothraki as more Mongol than native American. Wonder how hard it would be to hire a bunch of mongols in Ireland? I suppose they won't need many until later in the series, at first it would only be Drogo and maybe his bloodriders etc.

I know that a form of syphilis came from the new world, but then why didn't the Vikings get the disease since they were the first easterners to arrive in the new world? They settled for a period in Newfoundland, where you can still see the archaeological remains of longhouses.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norse_coloniz...of_the_Americas

They had some good and some bad relations with the Native Americans (the vikings called them Skraelings), and I'm sure there was some rape and at times consentual sex between the two peoples. So, why didn't the whole syphilis theory start here instead of with Columbus? Native Americans mixed with tribes who lived far away, so if it was true- then the tribe that dealt with the Vikings would have it as much as (say) the Lenape Indians... Wouldn't it have been wide spread in the Americas with the native populations? And, the Vikings travelled to other countries so they would've spread syphilis to Europe themselves hundreds of years before the Spanish, French or English ever set foot on the Americas. Unless there already was a form of the dreaded disease in Europe pre-Columbus... Which is another theory.

Also, there are some incongruencies in the timeline of Columbus' strain:

Read the origins section... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syphilis

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8503058...ogdbfrom=pubmed

Sorry, this has nothing to do with the Dothraki...Just saying, there seem to be some holes in the history we thought we knew.

Apparently they are going to film the Dothraki scenes in Morocco. So they may look Arabic. :P

Oh, I hope not. This would just open a can of worms that may be better left unopened. Some folks were pretty pissed that the baddies looked middle eastern in the LotR trilogy... And although the Dithraki aren't the bad guys, still it's delicate.

I always thought of the Dothraki as Mongols or Huns, seems to be the general belief.

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Oh, I hope not. This would just open a can of worms that may be better left unopened. Some folks were pretty pissed that the baddies looked middle eastern in the LotR trilogy... And although the Dithraki aren't the bad guys, still it's delicate.

I always thought of the Dothraki as Mongols or Huns, seems to be the general belief.

Well, GRRM has said that they are a mixture of Mongols/Huns/Native Americans. But at the same time, if they are filming in Morocco, they will presumably use locals. Although they may be made to look like Mongols.

I'm not sure its a big deal though. After the first season, they don't play much of a role.

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Well the Dorathki are hardly Mongol.

They like bows and shooting them from horseback.

They like horses.

The the word Khal sounds like Khan.

They are nomads who live on the steppes.

The only thing Mongol there is the Khal/Khan everything else is just generic brand Horse Nomads.

The Mongols were insignificant tribes scratching out a living in a desert or conquerers only surpassed by the British. Neither of which is the Dorathki.

The Mongols were tactical geniuses and the Dorathki have 2 tactics, charge and shoot arrows.

The Dorathki are nothing but Cowboy/Biker gangs on a massive scale who like to ride around smashing stuff up and getting into fights.

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I always definitely got a Mongol/Hun vibe from them. Nomadic, horse society, endless grass plains, feared by the 'civilised' people. Yeah, definitely more Asian Steppe than American Plains, in my opinion. A major part of that is that the Dothraki are portrayed as savage warriors, to an extent, and that's not really the first thing I think when I think of Native Americans.

Of course, the beauty of creating your own world for your story, is that you can pick and choose attributes and qualities from whatever real society you want, and just blend them all together to make something new.

Try telling that to the Apache :lol:

As for the Syphilis thing yes the most deadly strain came from the New world and it only got transported after Columbus because that was the only time there was enough interaction for diseases to be caught. Syphilis did kill alot of Europeans but it wasn't even close to the extent Euro diseases killed First Nations. (not to make the amount of Euro's that died seem small it wasn't it just wasn't as devestating)

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I've always had the terrifying picture of a buffed up Rob Schneider as Drogo.

I've always tried to get rid of it, and it always came back...

I can't wait for the show to start if only to replace my perception of Drogo.

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Try telling that to the Apache :lol:

As for the Syphilis thing yes the most deadly strain came from the New world and it only got transported after Columbus because that was the only time there was enough interaction for diseases to be caught. Syphilis did kill alot of Europeans but it wasn't even close to the extent Euro diseases killed First Nations. (not to make the amount of Euro's that died seem small it wasn't it just wasn't as devestating)

It's now believed by some in the field that it wasn't the strain that came from the new world but a mix of that strain with a strain the Europeans already had that created the virulent disease that raged through Europe.

"Historian Alfred Crosby suggests both theories are partly correct in a "combination theory". Crosby says that the bacterium that causes syphilis belongs to the same phylogenetic family as the bacteria which cause yaws and several other diseases. Despite the tradition of assigning the homeland of yaws to sub-Saharan Africa, Crosby notes that there is no unequivocal evidence of any related disease having been present in pre-Columbian Europe, Africa, or Asia.

There is indisputable evidence of syphilis having existed in the pre-Columbian Americas. Crosby writes, "It is not impossible that the organisms causing treponematosis arrived from America in the 1490s...and evolved into both venereal and non-venereal syphilis and yaws."[13] However, Crosby considers it more likely that a highly contagious ancestral species of the bacteria moved with early human ancestors across the land bridge of the Bering Straits many thousands of years ago without dying out in the original source population. He hypothesizes that "the differing ecological conditions produced different types of treponematosis and, in time, closely related but different diseases."[13] Thus, a weak, non-syphilitic bacterium survived in the Old World to eventually give rise to yaws or bejel. A New World version evolved into the milder pinta and the more aggressive syphilis."

There is also a "Pre-Columbian theory" holds that syphillis was present in Europe before the discovery of the new world and that:

"Some scholars believe its symptoms were described by Hippocrates in Classical Greece in its venereal/tertiary form. There are other suspected syphilis findings for pre-contact Europe, including at a 13–14th century Augustinian friary in the northeastern English port of Kingston upon Hull. This city's maritime history, with its continual arrival of sailors from distant places, is thought to have been a key factor in the transmission of syphilis.[5] Carbon-dated skeletons of monks who lived in the friary showed bone lesions that supporters say are typical of venereal syphilis, although this is disputed by critics of this theory. Skeletons in pre-Columbus Pompeii and Metaponto in Italy with damage similar to that caused by congenital syphilis have also been found,[6][7] although the interpretation of this evidence has been disputed.[8] Douglas Owsley, a physical anthropologist at the Smithsonian Institution, and other supporters of this idea say that many medieval European cases of leprosy, colloquially called lepra, were actually cases of syphilis. Although folklore claimed that syphilis was unknown in Europe until the return of the diseased sailors of the Columbian voyages,

... syphilis probably cannot be "blamed" as it often is, on any geographical area or specific race. The evidence suggests that the disease existed in both hemispheres from prehistoric times. It is only coincidental with the Columbus expeditions that the syphilis previously thought of as "lepra" flared into virulence at the end of the fifteenth century.[9]

Lobdell and Owsley wrote that a European writer who recorded an outbreak of "lepra" in 1303 was "clearly describing syphilis."[9]"

So no, it's not as clear cut as comeing from the New World, now that modern science and understanding of the disease brings up more questions of it's true origins.

I personally think it's most likely the mix theory.

I agree, it's nothing like what the First Nations suffered. They didn't even have to have sex to get sick and die either- just had to be in contact with the Europeans.

But if we want to talk about ancient diseases, their origins, and modern theories maybe I should start a thread on that.... Fun for all! :P

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Anybody know or guess how they'll handle Dothraki speech in the show? Will they just speak the Common Tongue/English, or will we get to hear real Dothraki spoken like Elvish in LOTR? I hope the latter. It would be awesomely cool to finally hear it. "Khalakka dothrea mr'anha!" I hear it in my head as gutteral but somehow also soft, especially when I imagine Khal Drogo speaking. I'm guessing GRRM created their language. Anyone know?

And who will play Khal Drogo? I can't wait for the wedding scene...God, that'll be so awesome. HBO isn't shy about putting provocative stuff on the air, so I have high hopes that they'll do it up right.

Roy Dotrice =p

(the audiobooks will show you what it sounds like perfectly)

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