New R. Scott Bakker interview

[Bastard of Godsgrace]

Really great interview. So short, and so informative. This is the sure sign of great worldbuilding that some offhand remarks about a fictional world may have the power of revelation for fans.

Tusk and Inchoroi, at least one of the theories I always favored proved to be right. And yes, it means Fanim were right about the Tusk. Good cacth. I wonder what else they are right about. Some here also guessed Wutteat being the prototype of dragons which removes the seeming inconsistency of Wutteat's wrods. Aurang and Aurax were two of only six Inchoroi grafted with ability to do magic. I wonder what happened to the rest.

Another interesting question: what happens if Kellhus masters Inchoroi powers of genetic engineering?

[lokisnow]

All hail Curethan, First of His Name, Lord of the Tusk Theory and King of the InchoroiDidIt.

One thing, it seems I overstated my case by suggesting that the Inchoroi yoked demons to the tusk with promises of easy nomnoms. Bakker does say they wrote down the legends of Eanna and only added one bit, go kill the false-men.

Also, this seems to reflect somewhat on the "they called us false" thing, perhaps this is a far greater crime to the non-men, a way of shaping the attack to uniquely wound them.

The Isuphyris is unclear on the order of things, but I wonder if things in it later on regarding Sirwatta are backwards. Perhaps Sirwatta was grafted by the Inchoroi while on his watch and then after that he impregnated the cunoroi female that led to the birth of Cimoira. This may have been the first (failed) attempt at a bio attack, a way to attack the Cunuroi without their realizing the source of the attack. Bakker says the Inchoroi never noticed the Halaroi except for slave labor and congress. What better way to attack their enemy than through the enemy's thralls/sex slaves? But for whatever reason it didn't work, instead of diminishing the cunoroi, it only resulted in one halfbreed.

The description of the Psukhe seems to suggest that Moenghus or Kellhus would both be able to grasp it. We've been relying on the limitation that the psukhe was all about passion, but in truth it's about non-cognitive meaning. the idea of non-cognitive should align with being The Unconditioned or grasping the Absolute, these goals would seem to be in alignment and accordance. It would be Inrithism and sorcery's fucking with meaning that would lead one away from the goals of the Dunyain. Again, these revelations suggest that Moenghus was not making a big mistake when he went with Fanimry.

(side crackpot, can't remember if I mentioned it, but I wonder if Moenghus conditioned Conphas, specifically with how to beat the Scylvendi, wasn't Conphas a prisoner of the Padirajah many years before PON?)

[Papirolle]

Aurang and Aurax were two of only six Inchoroi grafted with ability to do magic. I wonder what happened to the rest.

No, Bakker says that they were two of only six Inchoroi that survived that grafting. The number of Inchoroi that they tried to graft in total is not mentioned and how the other four that survived died is also unknown.

[Antonius Pius]

Interesting interview. Makes me even more excited for The Unholy Consult. Especially the full range of their depravity.

(side crackpot, can't remember if I mentioned it, but I wonder if Moenghus conditioned Conphas, specifically with how to beat the Scylvendi, wasn't Conphas a prisoner of the Padirajah many years before PON?)

IIRC, Conphas was a hostage at Skauras' court. Xerius uses Skauras' familiarity with Conphas to set up the Holy War.

[Madness]

sciborg, check out the wiki article on metre(m). Bakker's Wutteat analogy was referring to when humans decided the modern precision measurement of the metre and the standard for metres worldwide was (perhaps is, I didn't read the rest of the article) a single metre bar located in Sevres, France.

[Papirolle]

Also, Bakker mentioned demonic Ciphrang as opposed to angelic Ciphrang in the interview. Is this a distinction we already knew about? And only demonic Ciphrang can be summoned with the Daimos...and demons lie.

He also writes about the Outside "...those rare souls who walk its ways and return never seem to agree on the nature of what they have seen". I'm guessing this means that Inri Sejenus and Fane both have been to the Outside before Kellhus and tried to reform their religion according to what they saw there. However, they interpreted the Outside differently and came to two different conclusions. It looks like Fane is the one who came closest to the truth though.

Perhaps Kellhus, due to his uber-intellect, actually has managed to see the Outside for what it really is and will reform Eärwa accordingly and thus saving humanity (or at least give them proper guidance on how to avoid damnation).

[Papirolle]

sciborg, check out the wiki article on metre(m). Bakker's Wutteat analogy was referring to when humans decided the modern precision measurement of the metre and the standard for metres worldwide was (perhaps is, I didn't read the rest of the article) a single metre bar located in Sevres, France.

Yes, originally the definition of a meter was the length of that metal bar. They made copies of it and sent to universities throughout Europe I believe. However copies can become corrupt so they had to rely on that original bar staying pristine. It was (is?) kept in vaccuum so that it wouldn't be affected by weather or outside tampering.

Wutteät is like that metal bar. All Wracu were created in his likeness; copies of him, but Wutteät himself is not a Wracu. At least that's how I interpreted it.

[Curethan]

(side crackpot, can't remember if I mentioned it, but I wonder if Moenghus conditioned Conphas, specifically with how to beat the Scylvendi, wasn't Conphas a prisoner of the Padirajah many years before PON?)

It seems likely cuz Mallahet was working with Skaurus during negotiations with Xerius. And it works with the timeline of the TFT. He probably planted the idea, inception stylee. On my reread I noticed Moe did a lot of dream touching people. I think it was his best cish trick.

[BakkerFan]

He also writes about the Outside "...those rare souls who walk its ways and return never seem to agree on the nature of what they have seen". I'm guessing this means that Inri Sejenus and Fane both have been to the Outside before Kellhus and tried to reform their religion according to what they saw there. However, they interpreted the Outside differently and came to two different conclusions. It looks like Fane is the one who came closest to the truth though.

Perhaps Kellhus, due to his uber-intellect, actually has managed to see the Outside for what it really is and will reform Eärwa accordingly and thus saving humanity (or at least give them proper guidance on how to avoid damnation).

Very interesting observation. I hadn't considered that Inri Sejenus and Fane may have both walked the Outside. I do agree that Fane is closer to the truth. I wonder how he learned of the unholiness of the Tusk. Did he somehow stumbled upon the Inchoiroi's involvement in its creation?

[The Imp's Advocate]

Now I'm trying to think back in the TJE if anything was revealed with Mimara and her Judging Eye. I think the only people she saw were damned, but I can't be sure without a re-read.

She sees her reflection as pure and holy in WLW.

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

Lots to digest here. Nice to see such direct confirmation of the Inchie-Tusk theory as well as a repudiation of an idea that had seemed almost ironclad - that of local damnation.

I wonder if we can take the latter to mean that the "correct" belief can change or not. He didn't rule it out.

[Nerdanel]

That was quite a bit of new information, some of it surprising. (I totally didn't expect that magical ability could be grafted with Tekne.) It turns out I was right about the non-locality of damnation and the universality of metaphysics, whatever they may be.

By the way the Scylvendi are my top suggestion for a 100% damned human ethnic group, with them worshiping the No-God and all.

[BakkerFan]

She sees her reflection as pure and holy in WLW.

Ah yeah, now I remember a bit more. Wasn't there something about crowns and halos or something? Anyone remember this passage?

Now this makes me wonder if people who see the halos about Kellus are in fact glimpsing a part of the Judging Eye?

If Fane was correct, or at least closer to correct than anyone else, it seems to me that Meppa's significance just got bigger.

Absolutely. He basically is the one guy in the book who understands the "other side" (i.e. non-Inrithi) viewpoint from a "technical" level (i.e. everything past the "gods are demons" business). Well, I'd bet Kellus does, but he's not talking. Man I wish that conversation he had with the Mother of Birth in WLW was longer.

[Tears of Lys]

Absolutely. He basically is the one guy in the book who understands the "other side" (i.e. non-Inrithi) viewpoint from a "technical" level (i.e. everything past the "gods are demons" business). Well, I'd bet Kellus does, but he's not talking. Man I wish that conversation he had with the Mother of Birth in WLW was longer.

Not to mention his conversation with Seswatha when he had to convince Akka to teach him the Gnosis. Hope we get to find out what went on there eventually.

Fascinating Part 2, by the way. I wouldn't be surprised if what he said there makes its way into a "What has come before" in The Unholy Consult. It read like part of his books.

[lokisnow]

Maybe I'm mistaking your meaning, but it seems like you're suggesting that non-cognitive and passion are mutually exclusive. Is that what you're saying? Because I don't think that they should be. It seems like passion can have meaning, it's just not designed or affixed the same way that it is with the Gnosis or the Analogies or what have you.

No not at all. I'm saying we've been thinking of the Psukhe under the more limited frame of "needs lots of passion" where Bakker is fairly clearly stating that passion is one aspect of many possible ways non-cognitive meaning can manifest. I"m also saying that I think grasping non-cognitive meaning would track with Dunyain goals of becoming the Uncondtioned and Grasping the Absolute. And that would suggest that Moenghus was not so weak in the water as Kellhus stated he was.

That was quite a bit of new information, some of it surprising. (I totally didn't expect that magical ability could be grafted with Tekne.) It turns out I was right about the non-locality of damnation and the universality of metaphysics, whatever they may be.

By the way the Scylvendi are my top suggestion for a 100% damned human ethnic group, with them worshiping the No-God and all.

Welcome Back! We've missed you in the WLW threads.

[BakkerFan]

Not to mention his conversation with Seswatha when he had to convince Akka to teach him the Gnosis. Hope we get to find out what went on there eventually.

Fascinating Part 2, by the way. I wouldn't be surprised if what he said there makes its way into a "What has come before" in The Unholy Consult. It read like part of his books.

I was actually thinking of the conversation between Meppa and the Mother of Birth. The way I worded the sentence was a bit confusing, admittedly.

That said, I WOULD like to know what was exchanged between Kellus and Seswatha in TTT. Hopefully that discussion does make it's way in TUC, but I'm kinda doubting it for some reason (*please* prove me wrong Bakker!). Perhaps we can arrange for another Q&A? :)

[Curethan]

Double-posting to just say....

:grouphug:

We all got a shout-out on the blog! Let's hug it out.

I actually recall when I made an unintentionally crass post on the three seas forum when I said something to the effect of "this forum sucks...go to westeros.org..." I got some backlash, but I had totally misrepresented my feelings. I was never saying that the people at three seas sucked....I was just saying that it was too vacant of a place and that there wasn't enough discussion....

I know that Curethan (The First of His Name) and Callan S. probably remember this....

Yeh, three seas faltered when RSB stopped posting there, and ultimately died from pornspambots (uncanny parallels to inchies :P).

They took most of the rest, eventually it was like hanging around a graveyard.

*Removes hat*

eta;

starting the sweeps on which culture wins the belief lottery, and I'm betting on Zeum. Fanim lovers stand over there ->

Any takers for Inrithism, various cults, the old North's Kineuric(sp?) church or the new empire's Kehlusism?

[Screaming Turkey Reborn]

Bakker's blog makes me like his work even more.

[Papirolle]

I think it's going to turn out that the First Holy War was the worst thing that could have happened to the Three Seas. The killing of (almost) all the Cishaurim first and foremost. But also the repression of Fanimry, which seems more and more like it's a Good Thing.

I also bet that Kellhus has realized this (after the fact) and regrets the way things turned out at the end of TTT.

This would be really interesting to read about.

[pat5150]

Scott is pretty happy with the way the second part of our interview has been received by fans. . . :)

Patrick