Sandor V.16

[clover]

Damn right!

But I wonder how he went from one extreme to the other so quick. How did he keep it together the entire fight with Beric with fire everywhere and his shield on fire and him?

Well, this is where I am with this right now.

How the hell was he so contained during the whole fight when he could have died or burned even more, but he cries when it is over even despite the relief that he was freed and won his life back?

I just read it recently so I am still digesting, but if someone threw fire, a rat, or a roach at me right now I would react in an instant and cry and run and be distracted like all hell. Beric would have slashed my ass and have been done with it already.

Same thing with the Blackwater...he went in there with men,,,there was fire, The worst kind. Fire that doesn't extinguish but he goes in anyway and something tells him its enough and he reacts later.

So interesting...

And that is a good point. For everything he does follow through with, he is also the King of Empty Threats sometimes too.

[Yvonesan]

Am I alone in thinking that Sandor's ManlyTears™ were more a result of the Immolation Blues than any other psychological stress? Dude has serious issues with fire. He's *scared* of it. If Beric slayage occured via only hack 'n slash, sans flames, with maybe only some cuts rather than burns, I think we would have been witness to another instance of the Hound's raspin' laugh.

Couldn't agree more. Sandor has serious psychological issues with fire (understandably) and I bet that in the very instance his arm was burnt, all his childhood trauma came right back to him. I love it when GRRM writes this stuff... but we still have to imagine some of what he's going through since we never get Sandor's personal POV and thoughts. My heart goes out to him and his ManlyTears™. He needs some love in these moments.

Clover, do you think it's survival instinct that carries him through the horror and makes him focus on nothing but survival until the immediate threat is over? That would explain his delayed reactions to fire around him and probably emphasizes the feeling he then experiences since the realization of how much danger there is would suddenly come to him late? It's good to think that his instinct is to survive if this is the case. He isn't really ready to die even after everything he's been through and even though he says he is to Arya later on.

[clover]

The words sound like a child in distress. The contrast with his words and his entire demeanor prior to the pleading and crying is amazing.

But he snapped back quick when Arya turned the knife on him. I guess once they tended to his arm...

It was like a switch being turned on.

That quick. And even Arya's response, which was disturbing but funny in a way. When she commented that he was crying like a baby.

[MaryaStone]

I know right? It's very terrible.

Seriously, I don't know why I can't just dismiss Victarion for being the terrible, terrible guy that he is. Is there a Vic Addicts Anonymous support group? LIke, I need to get on a 12 step program or something, transition to somebody who's an evil badass but slightly less hardcore than Victarion.

I'm as crazy about the kraken as you are, I'm afraid. I should feel ashamed. :blushing:

But don't worry, Littlespider, because ....

We'll always have the Hound! :drunk:

Now, play it again, Sam :P

[littlespider]

Am I alone in thinking that Sandor's ManlyTears™ were more a result of the Immolation Blues than any other psychological stress? Dude has serious issues with fire. He's *scared* of it. If Beric slayage occured via only hack 'n slash, sans flames, with maybe only some cuts rather than burns, I think we would have been witness to another instance of the Hound's raspin' laugh.

I think you're spot on here, R&R, and you should patent the term Immolation Blues as it is priceless. It is remarkable how Arya observes the fight and realizes he's crying "like a baby" -- almost like he's reduced to an infantile state. This occurs when he's been burned for the second time. I'm not a trauma expert (thankfully!) but for some reason I am thinking that PTSD cases, especially complex ones, have episodes like this or meltdowns (no pun intended) when something triggers the memory of original trauma. Anyone know about this? So here it's not just an original trauma that's been triggered, but is actually being recreated to a certain extent.

Hmm, seems to me that there would be a couple of places where this might apply to my man Reek as well.

I'm liking Vladimir Kulich, Rapsie. He's got a good look. I would add Mads Mikkelsen to the Victarion mash-up as well:

One-Eye proves he can do barbarian well, though his look in Clash of the Titans sort of fits Victarion better.

[clover]

That is the rub of it.

For all the awesome qualities, he seems to have the Achille's Heel.

Fire. The only thing he fears and it seemed like he did snap back into something from before...Jesus...I wonder if his pleading was similar to what he said when he was little and Gregor did that to him.

[Lemon Cake]

Am I alone in thinking that Sandor's ManlyTears™ were more a result of the Immolation Blues than any other psychological stress? Dude has serious issues with fire. He's *scared* of it.

I think you're spot on here, R&R, and you should patent the term Immolation Blues as it is priceless. It is remarkable how Arya observes the fight and realizes he's crying "like a baby" -- almost like he's reduced to an infantile state. This occurs when he's been burned for the second time. I'm not a trauma expert (thankfully!) but for some reason I am thinking that PTSD cases, especially complex ones, have episodes like this or meltdowns (no pun intended) when something triggers the memory of original trauma. Anyone know about this? So here it's not just an original trauma that's been triggered, but is actually being recreated to a certain extent.

...My heart just broke a little. :(

[Verboten]

Well if he's used to reacting to traumatic situations with violence then it could be a way for him to focus on something other than the fire for the fight.

Also this avatar? 100% SANDOR APPROVED :thumbsup:

[FacelessGirl]

Well if he's used to reacting to traumatic situations with violence then it could be a way for him to focus on something other than the fire for the fight.

Also this avatar? 100% SANDOR APPROVED :thumbsup:

:lmao: :thumbsup:

[clover]

Yeah, he is doing something or focusing elsewhere because he is functioning and then some part about the fire gets to him later and he breaks.

I still can't get over the trial with Beric and how many references to fire and burning there is and it is not until Beric is down that he cries.

But he rallied something within himself. I don't have the book with me, but it says something about the final blow. How he raised the sword and used all of his strength.

Almost like it really took all he had and then he breaks down afterwards.

[littlespider]

Also this avatar? 100% SANDOR APPROVED :thumbsup:

GENIUS!!! I was going to try to link the "Sandor approves" gif but am too lazy to look for it.

...My heart just broke a little. :(

Don't be too sad, Lemoncake. I propose an elaborate argument as to why you should not be:

P 1: in folklore and bucketloads of indo-european stories, shit tends to happen in sets of 3.

P 2: the third time something happens, the pattern changes.

P 3: Sandor has been burned twice already.

P 4: So he's due to fight fire a third time. (I am discounting the Blackwater because he wasn't technically burned and, uh, it doesn't fit with my theory. Yes, that's it.)

P 5: Pattern has to change the third time, yes?

Conclusion: he is due to encounter fire again, and triumph this time. How will it happen? Another poster put it much better than me:

So we are looking for a brave man.

So we are looking for a man who is afraid of fire.

Need I say more?

[Ashen Shugar]

So after he gets his arm burnt(smoke) he cries(salt) and cries like a baby(new born/reborn soul). hmm..

[1234567]

@Littlespider and Fearsome Fred

Just to add to your quotes above: "One fool asked if it was dragonsbreath".

[Villemo]

ROTFL - do you ever look at "suddenlysandor" at Twitter? His last twitt is "Remember that time I openly sobbed in front of the Brotherhood Without Banners? ...................FORGET THAT TIME."

Made my day, especially for our recent discussions:D

(BTW I love all FakeWesteros accounts on Twitter. These guys make a damn good work :D

[Ednawolf]

I need to get a Twitter account so that I can subscribe to suddenlysandor. Random sandorisms would make my day.

I don't have a problem at all with Sandor needing to have a good cry now and then.

[Lemon Cake]

I follow @suddenlysandor on twitter as well. There's some pretty amusing exchanges between him and @Lady_Sansa. Sadly, I've never seen any between him and @Arya_SheWolf, though.

And obviously, yes, I do follow a lot of the fake Westeros accounts. Ser Loras's is my favorite. He's made some classic tweets.

[littlespider]

Just to add to your quotes above: "One fool asked if it was dragonsbreath".

Interesting. I'd forgotten that.

Rhaegal, we hardly knew ye.

[Ednawolf]

GENIUS!!! I was going to try to link the "Sandor approves" gif but am too lazy to look for it.

Don't be too sad, Lemoncake. I propose an elaborate argument as to why you should not be:

P 1: in folklore and bucketloads of indo-european stories, shit tends to happen in sets of 3.

P 2: the third time something happens, the pattern changes.

P 3: Sandor has been burned twice already.

P 4: So he's due to fight fire a third time. (I am discounting the Blackwater because he wasn't technically burned and, uh, it doesn't fit with my theory. Yes, that's it.)

P 5: Pattern has to change the third time, yes?

Conclusion: he is due to encounter fire again, and triumph this time. How will it happen? Another poster put it much better than me:

So we are looking for a man who is afraid of fire.

Need I say more?

I agree. I also think that both Tyrion and Sansa will be present when the 3rd fire fight occurs as they both have observed his fear of fire.

[Lemon Cake]

I agree. I also think that both Tyrion and Sansa will be present when the 3rd fire fight occurs as they both have observed his fear of fire.

Arya has too, so if we're going with this idea, that reinforces littlespider's theory that the Hound and the She-Wolf will meet again! :)

[Villemo]

I follow @suddenlysandor on twitter as well. There's some pretty amusing exchanges between him and @Lady_Sansa. Sadly, I've never seen any between him and @Arya_SheWolf, though.

And obviously, yes, I do follow a lot of the fake Westeros accounts. Ser Loras's is my favorite. He's made some classic tweets.

I haven't any twitter acount and - in general- i dont like microblogging (IMO it's too short and generally too boring), but for FakeWesteros i make an exception. Interactions between these characters are great, I just have to admire their skills.

And I like reading Loras too (these beautiful pink flowers... :rofl: )