Sansa and Tyrion predictions

[Lyanna Stark]

That doesn't change the fact Sansa doesnt want anything to do with Casterley Rock and the fact Tyrion is hated.

:agree:

In fact, how about looking at what Sansa actually felt about the marriage?

When told who she is going to marry Tyrion (since this was sprung on her at the last moment, too, for extra bonus.) She blurts out "No!" then this:

"My claim, she thought sickened" and then says to Cersei "You can't make me" and tries to run away.

Does this look like someone who is jockeying for Casterly Rock via Tyrion? No.

And then on being offered Lancel she thinks "I don't want any Lannister". Again no wish to have Casterly Rock.

Regarding her wedding, this is how it is described:

Thankfully nobody seemed to notice that she was crying as she stood there, wrapped in her father's colours; or if they did, they pretended not to.

Still no wish for Casterly Rock or anything that indicates that she might fancy Tyrion.

She then thinks Tyrion is extremely ugly "He is uglier than the Hound"

Then the crowning moment, when Sansa forces herself to look at him, since the Septa told her all men are beautiful and Sansa thinks: This is not right, this is not fair, how have I sinned that the gods would do this to me, how?

So unless Sansa goes through a complete personality transplant, it's just not going to happen.

1. She didn't want to go to the Rock because she was waiting for Joff's wedding. Who would not want the biggest gold mines in Westeros?

She doesn't want to go to the Rock, no, but where do you get it from that she was "waiting for Joff's wedding"? It doesn't say that anywhere, so you are making this up.

2. What i said to Martell, different dynasty different laws. Tyrion and Sansa could be heros for killing Joff the Mad

What do the Martells have to do with a Stark-Lannister alliance? Nothing.

3. She got wolf blood in her, revenge is always on everybodys mind. Do you not think Sansa is the young and beautiful?

Her youth and beauty has nothing to do with wishing for revenge. She has not once professed a wish to kill Cersei. Arya has, not Sansa.

5. He was off on some things, but when Sansa got beat (crosbow scene) and Tyrion had her sleeping in the red keep Tyrion saw through her lie but acknowledged it was a good move. And Sansa is kinda stupid compared to the rest, its not her fault she is a pre teen girl with no training, yet she shall be a teenager with LF training soon.

Wut? No, Sansa lies and says she does not want to sleep in the Hands Tower since it has ghosts, but that is a lie, yet Tyrion thinks it's what she really thinks. She fools him. We also disagree with Sansa being stupid, but Tyrion and most of the people in Kings Landing certainly think so.

P.S. Sansa also thought once Tyrion is so ugly its fascinating, hard to look away

No she doesn't. Read the quote from the actual book above.

This is not right, this is not fair, how have I sinned that the gods would do this to me, how?

[Gingerly Grumkin]

If Sansa would want to get away from LF and Harry the Heir because they're dicks, what would she do with Tyrion, who's been getting more and more dickish as the series has gone on? Sansa also doesn't have to want to play the game even if she's learning about it; she wants a home, not a kingdom.

In any case, Sansa and Tyrion growing old happily together strikes me as either wishful thinking or horribly cliche (or both).

I dont know if they will stay together, I doubt it. But it would be a awsome political move for both. And Sansa can want or not want till her hearts desire. Winterfell is de Starked and half burnt. She is the heir to the Tullys and the Starks while being married to a Lannister and soon to be engaged to a Arryn. Like she has a choice if she wants to play AGOT. lol.

[Christina Ceriddwynn]

By "legitimize," I mean bang. Hahahahahaha. But Tyrion has deff shown Sansa serious kindness, and when given the opportunity to marry Lancel, she stayed with Tyrion.

The choice was like choosing between syphilis or gonorrhea......they are both Lannisters.

Tyrion scared the %$$# out of her when he hopped up on her bed naked! YIKES!

The Hound may scare Sansa...but does Sandor??? He is the one she keeps fantasizing about kissing

[Gingerly Grumkin]

@Lyanna

My favorite Sansa quote about what she wants "I dont want someone strong and brave, I want him!"

Kids grow up

[Christina Ceriddwynn]

ETA. The Hound scares Sansa every time they meat...

hehehehe....he said MEAT....not meet......Freudian slip??? LOL does Sansa want the Hounds meat??????????

:wub:

[Gingerly Grumkin]

hehehehe....he said MEAT....not meet......Freudian slip??? LOL does Sansa want the Hounds meat??????????

:wub:

:D . LOL!!!

[a free shadow]

That doesn't change the fact Sansa doesnt want anything to do with Casterley Rock and the fact Tyrion is hated.

I only answered your statement that Tyrion has no chance of getting Casterly Rock. If you don't think it is important, don't bring this up :lol:

If you want to argue point by point, we can do it, but you can't answer one fact by turning the argument into the different direction :dunno: Staying on the same point, I can only repeat that if Tyrion comes back with Daenerys, his perspectives are bright enough.

[Gingerly Grumkin]

She doesn't want to go to the Rock, no, but where do you get it from that she was "waiting for Joff's wedding"? It doesn't say that anywhere, so you are making this up.

What do the Martells have to do with a Stark-Lannister alliance? Nothing.

Her youth and beauty has nothing to do with wishing for revenge. She has not once professed a wish to kill Cersei. Arya has, not Sansa.

Wut? No, Sansa lies and says she does not want to sleep in the Hands Tower since it has ghosts, but that is a lie, yet Tyrion thinks it's what she really thinks. She fools him. We also disagree with Sansa being stupid, but Tyrion and most of the people in Kings Landing certainly think so.

No she doesn't. Read the quote from the actual book above.

This is not right, this is not fair, how have I sinned that the gods would do this to me, how?

1. I'm not making that up (and i need a re-read ;) ) Dontos said your going home during Joff's wedding, she can't miss that could she?

2. lol ElizaMartell, she's on the forum, lol, but... different dynasty different laws

3*sigh* the young and beautiful is Cersei's prophecy

5. hmmm... I think he knew it was a lie

PS (i guess) its a quote before they got married, i think the same quote as #5, ill check when i get home

[dtones520]

Everyone of Sansa's pretty little dreamboys have all been total dickwads or couldn't care less about Sansa.

Joffrey-need I say more?

Loras- Gay, pompous, the one nice thing he did in Sansas eyes as give him the rose at the tourney and he doesn't remember it at all.

Harry the Heir- sounds like another one of her dreamboys. Great bloodline, he is a knight, etc. But he sounds like a giant doucher.

Don't forget, she is already married to Tyrion. So, he, likely, needs to die for her not to be married. But he has also been the only man that has been truly kind to her. The only man who doesn't care about her bloodline and using her as some sort of political gain.

As for him being a Lannister, well, he can't help that. He is the only adult Lannister who hasn't done anything to hurt house Stark. Jaime, Cersei, Tywin, Joffrey, all did horrible things to the Starks. Tyrion made the saddle for Bran, returned Ned's bones (would have returned Ice if possible), truly showed remorse for the murders of her family members, etc.

What I think Sansa is learning is that looks, name, pomp don't matter. What matters is spending the rest of your life with someone who is going to be kind to you, especially in this world, matters more than anything.

Btw, I'm not saying Tyrion is perfect, but in this discussion he is the only one,outside of her family, that doesn't treat her like their little puppet.

[ElizaMartell]

I only answered your statement that Tyrion has no chance of getting Casterly Rock. If you don't think it is important, don't bring this up :lol:

I will bring it up because you seem convinced that Sansa will somehow be happy staying in the Westerlands with Tyrion when everything shown showsd she wants to go back to Winterfell

If you want to argue point by point, we can do it, but you can't answer one fact by turning the argument into the different direction :dunno: Staying on the same point, I can only repeat that if Tyrion comes back with Daenerys, his perspectives are bright enough.

I am answering the facts you simply choose to ignore it. Tyrion whether he comes back with Dany or the Second Sons isn't going to be welcomed open armed to take Casterley Rock. You can try to bury this fact but that's the truth of the situation. There's not a magic wand that will suddenly make Tyrion acceptable once he gets home.

What I think Sansa is learning is that looks, name, pomp don't matter. What matters is spending the rest of your life with someone who is going to be kind to you, especially in this world, matters more than anything.

Sansa has learned not to be fooled by pretty facesd back in CoK that doesn't change the fact she doesn't want Tyrion no matter how 'kind' he is. He's a Lannister and she doesn't want to be a Lannister. Simple. Furthermore, Tyrion married her for Winterfell. How can you ignore that will proliferating how much of a nice guy he is? Its simply a lie to say he didn't want anything from her.

[BabyMeraxes]

Loras- Gay, pompous, the one nice thing he did in Sansas eyes as give him the rose at the tourney and he doesn't remember it at all.

HAHAHAHAHAHA. Loras Tyrell - True Bitch.

[cuendillar]

I really can't see it as a functional marriage in any way, but once Sansa's learned a bit about the Game it can make for a strong political alliance. Noone will think much of a married couple spending time alone together - that's sort of expected. They might even come up with ploys like always taking contradictory standpoints in public - in order to give their words way more weight when they agree. I had hoped Tyrion would take pity on her and start teaching her about politics on his own accord, but that just wasn't in the cards back then.

[Christina Ceriddwynn]

Don't forget, she is already married to Tyrion. So, he, likely, needs to die for her not to be married. But he has also been the only man that has been truly kind to her. The only man who doesn't care about her bloodline and using her as some sort of political gain.

hmm......he certainly cares about her LOOKS. he DOES definitely care about her bloodline and her claim. He all but had a wet dream when thinking about what he could claim if he married her. Marrying her was all about political gain! His other option was Lollys.

Tyrion has no claim of his own. He inherits nothing. He needs the inheritance of a claim a bride can present.

[Gingerly Grumkin]

Tyrion has no claim of his own. He inherits nothing. He needs the inheritance of a claim a bride can present.

Warden of the west and Lord of Casterley Rock is a little more than nothing

[Lady Kraken]

Okay, I like Tyrion and all, but I just couldn't let this go...

Don't forget, she is already married to Tyrion. So, he, likely, needs to die for her not to be married.

No, he doesn't need to die. The marriage was never consummated (not to mention she was forced into it in the first place) so it can be set aside by a Council of the Faith or a High Septon.

But he has also been the only man that has been truly kind to her. The only man who doesn't care about her bloodline and using her as some sort of political gain.

No offense, but is this a joke? He cares a whole lot about her bloodline. He would not have thought twice about marrying her if Tywin hadn't suggested it. He doesn't love her and very, very rarely shows any interest in who she is as a human being.

And to quote from the book...

"Tyrion Lannister, Lord Protector of Winterfell. The prospect gave him a queer chill."

Seems like he's perfectly aware of the political gain. And if not for gain, why did he marry her then? Because she's pretty and (on the surface) tractable? What else does he even know about her? Nothing.

As for him being a Lannister, well, he can't help that. He is the only adult Lannister who hasn't done anything to hurt house Stark. Jaime, Cersei, Tywin, Joffrey, all did horrible things to the Starks. Tyrion made the saddle for Bran, returned Ned's bones (would have returned Ice if possible), truly showed remorse for the murders of her family members, etc.

Truly showed remorse? He may not have celebrated their deaths like some of his family, but read the chapter where Tywin tells Tyrion about the Red Wedding. His reaction is very cold, and it's clear his allegiances are to the Lannisters, not to the Starks. Lancel didn't directly hurt her family, but she didn't want to marry him either. Who wants to marry into the family that killed yours? No one. Sansa Stark will never be happy as Sansa Lannister, and I can't blame her for that.

Btw, I'm not saying Tyrion is perfect, but in this discussion he is the only one,outside of her family, that doesn't treat her like their little puppet.

False. I may not be on board with the Sandor/Sansa romance, but he seems to be the one who has never treated her like a puppet or expressed interest in her political value, not Tyrion. Also, the Hound seems to be the ugly, anti-knight to Sansa's prior "pretty boys" not Tyrion, but I suppose that's just the way I personally have interpreted GRRM's writing. But, you know, she's dreaming about kissing one of them, and it's not Tyrion.

Edit:

In my opinion, if they end up together in the end, it will be for political reasons, not for love. It's not what either of them wants, but how the chips fall at the end of all this may call for a political alliance between the two, who knows? I am curious what GRRM will do with the marriage.

[a free shadow]

I will bring it up because you seem convinced that Sansa will somehow be happy staying in the Westerlands with Tyrion when everything shown showsd she wants to go back to Winterfell

Your assumptions are going miles long. I never even hinted about Sansa being happy or unhappy here or there. The general talk was about what Tyrion has to offer. Wether Sansa wants it, is the next step in this discussion. And I am simply going step by step instead of getting sucked into these wretched arguments that go round and round.

I am answering the facts you simply choose to ignore it. Tyrion whether he comes back with Dany or the Second Sons isn't going to be welcomed open armed to take Casterley Rock. You can try to bury this fact but that's the truth of the situation. There's not a magic wand that will suddenly make Tyrion acceptable once he gets home.

Why would I try to bury it? It is you who left this subject and went off into different direction. You haven't brought it up clearly. And I am more than happy to admit that it is a good point. Still not powerful enough to beat dragons. Smallfolk would not care who Tyrion killed and lords would fear.

[ElizaMartell]

Your assumptions are going miles long. I never even hinted about Sansa being happy or unhappy here or there. The general talk was about what Tyrion has to offer. Wether Sansa wants it, is the next step in this discussion. And I am simply going step by step instead of getting sucked into these wretched arguments that go round and round.

What assumptions? I'm stating a fact but you are free to ignore it. What Tyrion has to offer, Sansa does not want.

Why would I try to bury it? It is you who left this subject and went off into different direction. You haven't brought it up clearly. And I am more than happy to admit that it is a good point. Still not powerful enough to beat dragons. Smallfolk would not care who Tyrion killed and lords would fear.

This has nothing to do with small folk. Look at the Lannisters and Lanniport and the bannermen of the Westernlands. Do you honestly believe they will be in any shape be loyal to Tyrion because you assume he'll get Dragons?

[Gingerly Grumkin]

Smallfolk will never love Tyrion, in fact no one will love Tyrion (short of Shagga, Timmit, and Jon Snow), but that doesn't matter much. But is it written in stone that Sansa can't be queen or lady of both the North and the West (or East, or Riverlands)? She is def gonna rebuild Winterfell, ASOS clearly foreshadowed it (with LF's help *shudder*) And if she owns a dragon she can fly back and forth from her lands. She hardly has to see Tyrion if she doesn't wants to and can have an affair with the hound

[a free shadow]

What assumptions? I'm stating a fact but you are free to ignore it. What Tyrion has to offer, Sansa does not want.

Assumptions that I am "convinced that

Sansa will somehow be happy staying in the Westerlands with Tyrion when everything shown showsd she wants to go back to Winterfell". Where did you get that from? It is beyond me.

This has nothing to do with small folk. Look at the Lannisters and Lanniport and the bannermen of the Westernlands. Do you honestly believe they will be in any shape be loyal to Tyrion because you assume he'll get Dragons?

Of course they will. Or they will be crushed.

[Gingerly Grumkin]

What assumptions? I'm stating a fact but you are free to ignore it. What Tyrion has to offer, Sansa does not want.

What Tyrion has to offer is peace, sticking to your vows and revenge. Another way to put that is Family, Duty, Honor. The daughter and spitting image of Cat better want that.

This has nothing to do with small folk. Look at the Lannisters and Lanniport and the bannermen of the Westernlands. Do you honestly believe they will be in any shape be loyal to Tyrion because you assume he'll get Dragons?

Why not? Tyrion is still cool with some of them. Who's left anyway? Cersei, Tommen and Myrcella, lol. Lancel and Jaime swore to never be a lord. Kevan's kid is real young, Tyget is missing (prob Tyrion's threat), the Frey's are cursed and then you got the rightful Lord, son of Tywin, friend (mayhaps) of Dany&Dragons.