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Lyanna Stark

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About Lyanna Stark

  • Rank
    My spite was sharp as broken glass
  • Birthday 07/02/1976

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  • Gender
  • Location
    IKEA Empire
  • Interests
    Just for the record, I would like to crush some rumours and state once and for all: no, I don't drink left over wine in the morning. At that time of day I prefer my alcohol clear.

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  1. Lyanna Stark

    The Diversity Pipeline

    Id' say it varies by gender, not sex, since it is a strong social component, not something to do with a biological function, but apart from nomenclature, I'd say there is definitely a stronger social incentive for women not to enter CS. And as various anecdotes from just about every woman in engineering can tell you, even in feminazi bastion of IKEA-land, you WILL encounter problems when both female and in tech/engineering. Interestingly, I was at a hen night not long ago with people I didn't know apart from the impending bridge, all women, all in construction/engineering/IT/biotech, and a LOT of what we discussed was our various experiences of having to deal with prejudice. Not one of them said "wow, I have never encountered anything like that", instead we all recognised eachother's experiences, lots of "rolleyes" at the stupid we have had to endure, how we all had to fight to be trusted and listened to, and that this is ongoing, it is not something of the past. However, as @Lily Valley pointed out, this is far easier to deal with in areas where you reach critical mass. Once you do, the work places and organisations generally become better places for women to be in, both because you aren't the Token Girl (which is tiresome as ALL HELL) and listening and valuing women's contributions will be something people will have to get used to. I can't understand why you think it a mystery that women avoid spaces which is extremely male dominated. How do you think it feels to be the only woman in a huge group of men? How do you think people generally treat you? Do you think there will be no bias in how all the men look at this one woman's contributions at all?
  2. Lyanna Stark

    The Diversity Pipeline

    Eh, I disagree with this. While there are *some* who are certainly self taught, even in my local geschäft where formal education is EXTREMELY rare (GIS programmers) you will find that the people who go into Open Source are generally already engineers, have a science related education, or are researchers in climate/geology etc. And sure, there ARE women here too, but then they also have similar backgrounds. If you are a tech luddite, you are NOT going to sit down on a bench and just teach yourself enough to get a coding job. In addition to this, since you are pointing out this is a "lonely" environment, should you have got over the first hurdles, started up Open Source, then as a woman, you generally have more social obligations, women are rarely as socially isolated as the "geek men" since it is simply not the Done Thing. Not to mention should you try and combine this, from a middle class/working class environment, as a woman, and try and tell your friends you spend 20 hrs a week learning Open Source programming, 90% of them would think you mad or worse, deluded. In fact, one of my good friends in high school (daughter of a lorry driver and the school kitchen assistant) went to Uni to study physics and math (and this isnt even "computers" but something that could, theoretically, mean she could become a teacher, even tho she ended up as environmental engineer at Volvo) and her parents and relatives had ENORMOUS issues with this. It took them YEARS to accept that she'd go for something so unfeminine and not a real job, and why didn't she do something proper, like become a nurse. Our Math/Phycics teacher told her "I dont think that is a good idea, you are probably not clever enough for Maths". Had she decided to spend hours and hours in her room learning programming? That would have been completely unacceptable. Things are likely somewhat better today, but why fight and uphill battle when you can have smooth sailing? Nobody will question your sanity if you are both a woman and studying to become a lawyer. But a computer programmer? With peers almost only weird introverted men with no fashion sense who might also overlap with Gamer Gaters? If women do this, it is *despite* the uphill slog. As for the woman self taught programmer getting through the door? Kalbear nailed it. She will be places dead last, after male programmers with education, female programmers with education and self taught female programmers. The most insidious form of sexism I still encounter in the workplace is exactly this: the subtle devaluation of my abilities, that I get questioned more than male co-workers on similar issues, that a second opinion must be found when I recommend a solution. In almost all cases, this is unconscious behaviour, and I imagine, would be denied had I pointed it out. Yet it is there all the same. Regarding pretending to be a man, no thanks. I want to be able to be me, without being ashamed of being female. I do not want to hide the fact that I am a woman. I shouldn't have to, and it shouldn't be a perk that I *can*. If I was gay, should it be a perk to "pass" as straight? In other types of jobs hiding that you are a woman isn't even something that would enter people's minds. If it offers similar money then why wouldn't women pick that type of career instead?
  3. Lyanna Stark

    The Diversity Pipeline

    @karaddin Well put! And yes, I am at a loss how this is a mystery.
  4. Lyanna Stark

    The Diversity Pipeline

    Nah, this conflates a couple of things. Firstly, it conflates being equal in practicality with being culturally equal. If the Scandinavian societies was this ultra-feminist bastion, then we'd see it reflected all across society, i.e. in that men are more often becoming nurses and women programmers, in that our culture consumption (TV, magazines, movies, fashion etc) would become significantly more feminist (go into any retail store and check the kiddie clothes section and tell me it wasn't more unisex some 25 years ago), it would mean significantly lower rates of sexual assault/rape than other Western countries, etc etc and these things? Just aren't happening. Instead we are SUPER busy patting ourselves on the back for being ultra-feminist. Good going, us. We are great at telling ourselves how great we are. Heh. Secondly, lets have a look at what happens to women who show interest in computers, tech etc. and actually do things like venture out on the internet to hang out with the boys in the gaming, tech etc. places. HEAPS of abuse, cyberstalking, gamer gate etc. Mmmm, nope, not spotting any reason why women would go "Actually, I'm not sure hanging out with engineers all day long and then in my spare time would be a constructive use of my time". As I hate life, I have done this a lot, but it's...effort. Thirdly, in a social context, women hang out with other women, and from a peer pressure perspective, it is FAR easier to get some understanding for wanting to become a doctor, a biologist or a lawyer than a computer scientist. Becoming an engineer is often perceived as being "really boring" by many, and it includes "a lot of maths" which women are told over and over again that we are bad at. Spatial reasoning, maths? Why, women are bad at it, according to pop-sci. While our lady brains may be smaller and more deficient, we can also read, and comprehend, and since evopsych tells us we suck at this, why go against the flow? In other areas, we are told we aren't deficient. Not to mention teachers often undervalue women's capability, so the thesis that women just aren't that clever gets enhanced through this bias. Fourthly, since men still aren't stepping in to become preschool teachers, nurses and care workers, women fill the roles. Feminism in so far at it deals with "women becoming equal to men" i.e. stepping into male jobs, is one thing, but it hasn't taken into account that men in that case needs to step into women's jobs. Fifthly (is this even a word?) if women then succeed in academia, you have other issues rearing their ugly heads. But we're equal, right, right? Ultra-feminist bastion, was it? Cool. I mean, I am sure there are other reasons too, but this is off the top of my head. EDIT: I mean speaking for myself, anecdotally, after some 15 odd years in IT-related fields, in both private and public sector, I think things have definitely become better, undoubtedly so. Personally, the only thing that really offends me often is that as a woman employee, it is clear to me my conclusions are far more likely to end up in the "we need a second opinion [from a man]" category than if it came from directly from a man. Now, this has also got better, since in my late 20s, I hate to present them via a man (as in, I'd give them to a co-worker who knew what was going on, and he'd present them to the project), while now I can generally push things through easier. On the other hand I am also both older and a freaking ENTJ so I am not that easy to overlook. Without my pushiness I think I would very easily have dropped out and done something else that took less effort, tbh, but I am a dumbass and more stubborn than a mule. EDIT2: Work experience also from two countries, the UK and the Feminist IKEA-land Bastion of ABBA.
  5. Lyanna Stark

    UK Politics: Post-May Edition

    There are quite a few EU countries who never adopted the Euro though, so that the Euro has severe issues isn't the same as dismissing the EU-membership as a whole. Are you sure that the trade-deals and legislation aren't far more prohibitive, long term, than cost? After all, all numbers I have seen on this seem to indicate that the toll free union, free movement of goods, services and people, plus harmonised regulations are *huge* and could cause enormous issues for the UK should there be a "no deal" solution. The Scandinavian countries are quite anxious that the UK is leaving, since from what I understand, it was seen that the UK was often a more natural ally on many issues, and worked as a counterweight to France/Germany domination. Especially from the non-Euro countries, it seemed that they felt they had more oomph with the UK in their corner as well.
  6. Lyanna Stark

    Do real friendships happen on this forum?

    Ofc. Eurovision is IMPORTANT! And the pink mast, ofc ofc. These are musts. I love that if you google "yiff flap" the first hit that comes up used to be a discussion with people whose names I was very familiar with from here. Good job Ranlanders!
  7. Lyanna Stark

    UK Politics: Post-May Edition

    Speaking of Brexit, I found this translated article from a Swiss newspaper pretty depressing to read. Thoughts? Personally I find Brexit more depressing and saddening than anything else.
  8. Lyanna Stark

    US voter data leak (~200 million records)

    Yes indeed, and how this is not at all unproblematic. Not in the least because legislators are often woefully uninformed about how technology actually works, leaving them behind when technological solutions rush a head, unregulated.
  9. Lyanna Stark

    Towerblock on Fire in West London

    And more politicians suffer from foot in mouth disease apparently. "Lets get ourselves a hanging". I love the non apology as well "This doesn't make me a bad man" and "I am sorry some people took offense", as if the people who found it bloody offensive are at fault??
  10. Lyanna Stark

    Twin Peaks - Double R Diner Now Open!

    Episode 7 was classic Lynch tho. So much unsettling atmosphere, corridors, people walking in corridors that were just worrisome and very, very unsettling. Good stuff.
  11. Lyanna Stark

    US voter data leak (~200 million records)

    Ouch, and no shit is this bad, or "troubling" as this person puts it. Especially considering a. how easy it was to access (I mean, WTF?) and b. how big data analysis of this type is used to specifically target certain demographics to essentially dupe them.
  12. Lyanna Stark

    Towerblock on Fire in West London

    Considering the prices of housing in London, that basically means "a rent somewhat more approaching affordable", especially for people in non high-paying jobs (even though it seems to me, people in the lower half of the earning spectrum are generally supposed to not be seen, heard or make any demands what so ever on anything. :/ ) @williamjm Oh good grief, how can these people live with themselves after having ignored the advice since 2010? How can they sleep at night?? Fireproofing buildings to save lives should be a complete non-issue to prioritise.
  13. Lyanna Stark

    Towerblock on Fire in West London

    Sounds like it will go down like a lead balloon. Ouch.
  14. Lyanna Stark

    UK Politics: Post-May Edition

    On a different note, while a UK resident, I was always surprised and dismayed at the low UK voter turnout, especially among younger people, but perhaps that is about to change? Can Labour sustain the enthusiasm and succeed the next time around, and will this actually work?
  15. Lyanna Stark

    Towerblock on Fire in West London

    That's....shocking, yes. And speaks to how poorly functional the local council must be. To not go into a crisis organisation and request aid from government authorities until several days have passed is baffling to me. As far as I know, that's standard procedure and every local council has a crisis organisation pre-organised and a crisis plan, which in case of emergencies can be put immediately into action. Generally these things are tested and practice run every year or every other year, to make sure everything is in place when needed.