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YazzyYaz

Could Melisandre resurrect Jon Snow?

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"Another source I see as evidence to this theory is Mel's vision of Jon in her fire going from man to wolf and back to man again."

I like the theory that you outlined, but this evidence could just be Mel seeing that Jon is a warg, not necessarily him dying and temporarily moving into Ghost until he could be resurrected.

Or it could be just as you said lol.

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The only reason I don't believe Melisandre will bring Jon back from the dead, is because of how Cat was so different from her original Tully/Stark self when she was brought back by Thoros. I know her throat was slit and that's why she doesn't speak(Yes, she said something to Brienne, but it was more of a gurgle than speaking), but she seems to be unforgiving and cold now.

Honestly, I don't agree with the notion that the resurrection 'changed' her. I'd say the constant strings of betrayals and tragedy changed her.

Would you be forgiving if everything you had was taken away from you piece by piece, by enemies known and friends' betrayal? For me, her change in character has nothing to do with magic or resurrection, but the simple fact she has so much to be wroth with.

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I don't want Mel to resurrect Jon. That tells me that Jon is really dead. I don't want an unJon walking about

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The thing is, I seem to remember that Thoros was never sure how he resurrected Dondarrion. He said he never did anything other than the traditional R'hllor funeral rites. Additionally, he was unable to resurrect Catelyn. It was Dondarrion who passed whatever it was that was keeping him alive. I have been thinking about it and I am starting to think that noone is resurrecting anyone. I am starting to think that all the resurrections are some type of side effect of what is going on. That said, I have come to a place where I think it is possible that Jon ends up being resurrected in some manner.

Edited for spelling.

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He's ali-i-i-ive! ;) In need of healing / patching up..no resurrection necessary.

She could , but it won't come to that. ( crossing all appendages )

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I am getting really worried that Bran will resurrect Jon now. Why warn Bran about bringing back the dead if he didn't have the ability.

Of course if bent branch is right, Jon might be the first of many to come back from the dead without anybody specifically resurrecting him. Because his business is unfinished. Dead things in the water... Dead things everywhere!

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I don't think Thoros was unable to resurrect Catelyn - if I remember correctly, it says he refused to because she had been dead too long. That's why Beric did it.

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I think the Cotf's warning to Bran had more to do with the effects of interfering with time and past events ( don't seek to call his spirit back). After all ,Ned's body didn't exist anymore , only his dismembered skeleton..which wasn't even in close proximity to Bran.

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This may be a silly theory, but it seemed to me with the crying and I think, i may be wrong its been a while since i read the book, that they seemed really hesitant, as if they were fighting it, trying not to stab jon, like they were being possessed? controlled? its far fetched i know, i dont think there is any history of possession in the series so im probably way off, but it just seemed that way to me.

Either way I dont think he is dead, from the scene to George making his sly comment about jon being dead, i think its obvious he is alive.

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No, I don't think they are possessed.

I think they are upset that it has come to this point, and would have preferred to have no part in it. They are stuck with Jon as their LC as long as Jon lives, and Jon has turned his back on them, letting his wildling buddy Tormund make decisions about their future without consulting any member of the Night's Watch. I see despair, not possession.

But I think you are right that Jon is not dead. Dead people don't learn from their mistakes.

I think the Cotf's warning to Bran had more to do with the effects of interfering with time and past events ( don't seek to call his spirit back). After all ,Ned's body didn't exist anymore , only his dismembered skeleton..which wasn't even in close proximity to Bran.

Maybe that is just how Bran will see it, too. Bran is in a unique position to find out what happened to Jon, and to interfere in present time. He is emotionally invested enough to try. And thanks to the CotF he knows that it is possible to call people / spirits back from the dead.

I found the CotF warning really annoying. They seem to know more about the undead than anyone else, and they don't share their knowledge with the reader.

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I think Bran reviving Jon would be cool but Melisandre makes more sense. Why say that her powers were stronger at the wall if there was no intended use? Shes gonna resurrect Jon and hes gonna have some weird/cool side effects from it.

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No, I don't think they are possessed.

I think they are upset that it has come to this point, and would have preferred to have no part in it. They are stuck with Jon as their LC as long as Jon lives, and Jon has turned his back on them, letting his wildling buddy Tormund make decisions about their future without consulting any member of the Night's Watch. I see despair, not possession.

But I think you are right that Jon is not dead. Dead people don't learn from their mistakes.

Maybe that is just how Bran will see it, too. Bran is in a unique position to find out what happened to Jon, and to interfere in present time. He is emotionally invested enough to try. And thanks to the CotF he knows that it is possible to call people / spirits back from the dead.

I found the CotF warning really annoying. They seem to know more about the undead than anyone else, and they don't share their knowledge with the reader.

What is the warning?

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Many in these boards have made the connection between Jon and AA. I personally have not made up my mind as to who will fulfill the prophecy but I am convinced that it will be the climax of the series so I am happy to wait for George.

As to Jon's death and resurrection.

When the kiss of fire is given it is my understanding that it is Rh'llor who decides whether the person is deserving of life again, not the giver of the kiss. So regardless of Mel's actions it may be completely out of her hands.

But during my research on Azor Ahai (ebooks make searching so nice) I came across a very intriguing passage in a Tyrion chapter when is he in Volantis and still under the guard of Haldon Halfmaester.

There is a Red Priest preaching in the square about the AA prophesy. He is specifically talking about Dany but he references the AA prophesy and says the following:

"She is Azor Ahai reborn... and her triumph over darkness will bring a summer that will never end... death itself will bend it's knee, and all those who die fighting in her cause will be reborn..."

This is the only reference I've found that says that those dying in her[AA] cause will be reborn. This would lead me to believe that anyone that dies fighting against the Others has the possibility of being reborn after death, presumably at Rh'llor's discretion.

The 'rebirth' of Cat and Beric could be the will of Rh'llor because they ultimately will have some influence on the ear against the Others.

What do you think the interpretation of "her[AA] cause" is??

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Her fight against the darkness is "her cause" obviously. The Red priests believe that Rh'llor is in an age old battle against the Great Other, Fire vs. Ice. So her cause will eventually be to fight the Others. My theory of Azor Ahai and The Prince who was Promised goes something like this: so a woods witch, presumably the ghost of high heart, tells Aegon V that the Prince who was Promised will be born of the line of his son Jaeherys' children Aerys and Rhaelle. Rhaegar thinks it is him at first but then believes the prophesy refers to his son and "his song will be the song of ice and fire." So if you want to believe R+L=J, then Jon Snow could be Azor Ahai. My theory is that Azor Ahain is not the Last Hero without his sword lightbringer that fights off the Others. He needs Nissa Nissa to forge this sword, Nissa Nissa being Daenerys who he will fall in love with but will have to sacrifice in order to defeat the Others. This will be Daenerys' treason for love. They are two sides of the same coin is what I'm trying to get at you can't have Azor Ahain or Lightbringer without Nissa Nissa. Since Jon and Dany might both be descendants of Aerys' line the woods witch would be right. The whole prophesy says that a warrior will draw from the fire a burning sword. I have thought that this might refer to something other than an actual sword. It might refer to Daenerys and her dragons, or to Jon accepting fire magic as a weapon against the Others which is often referred to as a sword without a hilt. In the end I see one of them having to sacrifice themselves to empower the other and save the world, thus fulfilling the Azor Ahai prophesy.

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I agree that you can't have Azor Ahai and Lightbringer without Nissa Nissa. It is her soul that finally binds itself to the sword and makes it Lightbringer.

I like the idea of Dany being Nissa Nissa Reborn (NNR) but I also would like GRRM to turn the tables and have NNR be a man.

Dany = AAR & Mormont = NNR

Dany = AAR & Jon = NNR

Dany = AAR & Tyrion = NNR

Arya = AAR & Gendry = NNR (crackpot)

ETA: sorry to get off topic.

Jon being 'reborn' (thus fulfilling the prophecy) could refer to his rebirth after death by stabbing or it could also have a fundamentalist Christian-esque meaning of being a "Born Again Rh'llorist" accepting the red god as the one true god.

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I don't think the prophecy, in any of it's utterances, will be fulfilled precisely. But religions are particularly adept at twisting, or reinterpreting whatever actually does happen to suit their dogma.

and I can't see Jon becoming an adherent of R'Hllor... please...

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One thing that I wonder is that anyone who has be "resurrected" by a red priest, comes back changed (and not in a very good way). I have to assume that if Jon wargs into Ghost, this somehow will preserve his "sanity" and consciousness before returning to his body, if (as some have stated), he is really dead.

I do like one post that I read about John getting stuck in Ghost and having to learn how to get back into his own (living) body. I do keep asking myself why we got the prologue we did if it wasn't meant to impact a main POV character.

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Melisandre will breathe the breath of fire into Jon Snow, because it's in her religion to do so. The reason we haven't heard more about this Custom probably is to not kill the foreshadowing, but Thoros of Myr makes it clear to Arya that it's a custom that is to be performed quite often, since he's done it hundreds of times.

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Jon is clearly not going to died, or not going to stay dead for long.

I, and many oders, believe the theory about Lianna and Rhaegar. So, he would have a major hole to play yet.

For me the question is how his "reborn" will afect him.

The red eyes and the trust between Ghost and ||Mel are no simple coincidence. If jon is the blood of the dragon he is destinated to unite with fire. Not ice. Maybe this backstabbing is the way to kill the boy and make the man, built by fire and blood be born...

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