Whose Chapters Do You Think Contain the Most Symbolism?

[Lyanna Stark]

Oh dear, have I unwittingly created the monster that is an Areo Hotah reread? :lol:

[Blisscraft]

Oh dear, have I unwittingly created the monster that is an Areo Hotah reread? :lol:

Yes, please!

[Little Wing]

Will do, Lummel, thanks for the invite - was just about to ask about joining the re-read, you've read my mind :D Especially the Areo Hotah ones. I hope I didn't miss Damphair's re-read :( (I'm serious) I learned to love them after a re-read :smug:

[Lummel]

You can have a look in the re-read forum and see most of the older rereads. But there seem to be a few of us infected with reread madness so there have been some good ones recently and some more are coming up. Of course the more you reread the more parallels you start to see and the more you want to reread.

I'm tempted to have a look at the first Areo Hotah to get a feel of it again...but from memory you have a man watching a man who is watching children as over ripe blood oranges fall to the ground. Now that's pretty rich to start with.

[Blisscraft]

LW - The rereads are fantastic! Especially, Lummel's and Butterbumps! :bowdown: I am a bit biased though.

[Bushido]

Off the top of my head - the Iron Throne crouching in the darkness like a beast (ominous much?), Tommen complaining about the old black tom cat, presumably Balerion, pestering his kittens (foreshadowing downfall of Lannisters?), the children with the daggers (CotF?)

Children with daggers are particulary striking.

What I had in mind is the way the present is still haunted by past (Kevan's musings) and therofore makes for a very dark future. The way Varys presented himself took me back to the beginnings and everlasting game of thrones,his monologue which is an echo of a small, oppressed people - we often forget how humble Varys is...

And,yes the white raven. I wanted to ingore that for a bit,but really,at this point,where my impressions on Dance are finally settling into coherent sentiment,that'd be... stupid :D

Oh,yes,I loved your take on throne... It has nature of its own,arrogant, ruling shouldn't be taken lightly,and those who venture to rule in right,instead in duty lose their heads.Ominous indeed. On bright note,throne: #TheButlerDidIt

:)

[Lummel]

Oh dear, have I unwittingly created the monster that is an Areo Hotah reread? :lol:

A great monster with the shape of an axe burnt on to its chest roaring for readership!

Will do, Lummel, thanks for the invite - was just about to ask about joining the re-read, you've read my mind :D Especially the Areo Hotah ones. I hope I didn't miss Damphair's re-read :( (I'm serious) I learned to love them after a re-read :smug:

You don't need permission. All you need to do is to reread the chapters and be prepared to exchange ideas.

LW - The rereads are fantastic! Especially, Lummel's and Butterbumps! :bowdown: I am a bit biased though.

Not at all! I find your opinion on this question to be most restrained and understated! :laugh:

[Dr. Pepper]

My favorite chapter with the most symbolism has to be the very first one, when Bran and co find the direwolves. I think about it a lot and come up with some really ridiculous ideas on symbolism mostly because I have several sets of antlers in my home-base apartment and looking at the always gets me thinking.

I think one of the most beautifully written chapters with lots of symbolism is Sansa's snow castle. It's really deliciously haunting in a way. Ragnorak made an excellent thread about it recently though I have searched and can't seem to find it. Hopefully someone can find it because it's well worth checking out while rereading that chapter.

[Lummel]

Do you mean this one Dr.Pepper?

Now I will read it too since you say it's good :)

[Little Wing]

You can have a look in the re-read forum and see most of the older rereads. But there seem to be a few of us infected with reread madness so there have been some good ones recently and some more are coming up. Of course the more you reread the more parallels you start to see and the more you want to reread.

I'm tempted to have a look at the first Areo Hotah to get a feel of it again...but from memory you have a man watching a man who is watching children as over ripe blood oranges fall to the ground. Now that's pretty rich to start with.

Ah, one stands in awe of the genius that is GRRM. The thing that bugs me, although there's a huge fan-base already one has difficulties with finding people in RL who have read the books written so far. Very few even watch the show... :dunno:

Children with daggers are particulary striking.

What I had in mind is the way the present is still haunted by past (Kevan's musings) and therofore makes for a very dark future. The way Varys presented himself took me back to the beginnings and everlasting game of thrones,his monologue which is an echo of a small, oppressed people - we often forget how humble Varys is...

And,yes the white raven. I wanted to ingore that for a bit,but really,at this point,where my impressions on Dance are finally settling into coherent sentiment,that'd be... stupid :D

Oh,yes,I loved your take on throne... It has nature of its own,arrogant, ruling shouldn't be taken lightly,and those who venture to rule in right,instead in duty lose their heads.Ominous indeed. On bright note,throne: #TheButlerDidIt

:)

Thanks, Bushido - I agree about Varys and Kevan, kinda sucks we didn't get him in at least one chapter as a POV.

And since you mentioned the epilogue I think it's fair to say that the prologues and epilogues of the series contain more symbolism then the usual chapters, but not as a rule, of course.

[Dr. Pepper]

Do you mean this one Dr.Pepper?

Now I will read it too since you say it's good :)

Yep, that's the one I meant! Sorta stupid that I never used "Snow Castle" for my search terms. :blushing: I really enjoyed rereading that chapter along with Rag's and others notes.

And yes, Little Wing, the reread threads really discuss a lot of symbolism. Blisscraft is especially noted for her symbolic analysis. The newest reread, the Tyrion one has made it apparent that someone needs to come out and do a food specific reread because wow, the food is all symbolic and it's really amazing. (And I totally wish that I wasn't so busy and could keep up with the Tyrion reread. I need to download the books on my new comp because I could be catching up while I'm sitting here on my layover at the airport)

[-Sansa-]

The chapter of the serpentine.

[Lion of Judah]

Bran's chapters have a lot of symbolism.

[Little Wing]

Bran's chapters have a lot of symbolism.

Yep, especially his last one in Dance... that sickle moon was ominous and meant to allude to druid practices I guess...

The chapter of the serpentine.

Um... Dany?

[Lion of Judah]

Yep, especially his last one in Dance... that sickle moon was ominous and meant to allude to druid practices I guess...

Um... Dany?

Definitely I had to re-read Bran's chapters so many times because of that. Danys chapters have a lot as well but I didn't have to re-read as much as Bran's.

[TheMysteriousOne]

Dany in the HOTU

[LuisDantas]

There is a whole Daenerys chapter with little more than symbolic visions in Qarth in ACOK. It is easily the winner.

[Little Red Riding Hood]

(For me) The most symbolic is the chapter that appears not to be. This one:

The chapter of the serpentine (Sansa) begins:

"Come to the godswood tonight, if you want to go home"

(¿Which fairy tale remains you?) :cool4:

-The chapter, by the way, is full of duality-

...

What do you want?" Sansa demanded.

"Will milady be wanting a bath tonight?"

"A fire, I think . . . I feel a chill." She was shivering, though the day had been hot.

"As you wish."

...

Go to bed....

Then, when Sansa (Little bird/prey) takes the path of the godswood (more exactly:"She flew along the river walk") in the serpentine- she :

She was racing headlong down the serpentine steps when a man lurched out of a hidden doorway. Sansa caromed into him and lost her balance. Iron fingers caught her by the wrist before she could fall, and a deep voice rasped at her. "It's a long roll down the serpentine, little bird. Want to kill us both?" His laughter was rough as a saw on stone. "Maybe you do." The Hound. "No, my lord, pardons, I'd never." Sansa averted her eyes but it was too late, he'd seen her face. "Please, you're hurting me." She tried to wriggle free.

"And what's Joff's little bird doing flying down the serpentine in the black of night?" When she did not answer, he shook her. "Where were you? "

"The g-g-godswood, my lord," she said, not daring to lie. "Praying . . . praying for my father, and

. . . for the king, praying that he'd not be hurt."

"Think I'm so drunk that Id believe that?" He let go his grip on her arm, swaying slightly as he stood, stripes of light and darkness falling across his terrible burnt face. "You look almost a woman . . .

face, teats, and you're taller too, almost . . . ah, you're still a stupid little bird, aren't you? Singing all the songs they taught you . . . sing me a song, why don't you? Go on. Sing to me. Some song about knights and fair maids. You like knights, don't you?"(the duality again , Protector and predator at the same time /True lover/ Sandor)

He was scaring her. "T-true knights, my lord."

"True knights," he mocked. "And I'm no lord, no more than I'm a knight. (...)Do you like wine, little bird? true wine? A flagon of sour red, dark as blood, all a man needs. Or a woman." He laughed, shook his head. "Drunk as a dog, damn me. You come now. Back to your cage, little bird. I'll take you there. Keep you safe for the king." The Hound gave her a push, oddly gentle, and followed her down the steps.

Not only seems a fairy tale with Dontos=LF/Sandor=Hound/Wolf as predators.

Even the song Sandor/Florian (as true lover), and besides like a metaphor of the hidden attraction of Sansa for Sandor ( man of hidden door).

[Little Red Riding Hood]

Not only because seems a fairy tale (Red..-Hound/Wolf).

Even the symbolism are in the song of Florian and Jonquil and in the thoughts of Sansa about the youth of Florían (Sandor is 26-7 years old.) (it suggests that he is the true lover), and too as a trip into the subconscious of Sansa and the reflect of the relationship between Sansa and The Sandor=Wolf/Hound

(protector and predator at the same time) and the hidden feelings of Sansa for him.

Even in the movements of both, the location..:

("caromed into him and lost her balance...... Iron fingers caught her by the wrist before she could fall...."It's a long roll down the serpentine, little bird. Want to kill us both?..to finally follow her down the steps)

It seems to be talking about feelings, playing with the idea of fall (in a very messy way- "long roll down the serpentine") and falling in love, that implies the destruction of both as a separate individuals, to take a only path (of the serpentine) and be toghether.

What a novel !

GRRM Is a awesome writer .. !..

[Little Wing]

Ah, yes - thanks! Didn't make the connection...

It is a bit of a trip, a bit like Alice falling. I love the connections you've made, especially about the Hound being a predator and a protector and about falling into him/falling in love... and falling into all the mess that ensues, as you said. Nice job!