Roose's Fate

[Black Wolf Smith]

All Boltons deserve death, while some Freys were loyal.

It would be best if Boltons died violently during ASOIAF and Freys drastically reduced in power and numbers - to eventually die out.

While not to argue with your point. Late Lord Frey ( and his family) broke Guest rights, therefore will be punished by the Gods( or CoTF if you will). I really believe that before the end on the Story, that Lord Frey will not have a male heir left.

I also believe that not all the bad guys will get punished/wiped out. Ramsey will have to die( no doubt about it) and that leaves Roose. I know a lot of people think he also broke Guest Rights, but he did not. It wasn't his castle (and for that matter we don't know that he took food from the Freys) and was not supose to be there.

[The Sunset King]

I posted this in another thread, but your highlighting the Curse of Harrenhal just emphasises it for me:

Ramsay will kill Roose, in an unpredictable way during a tense moment. Probably after Ramsay loses the Battle of Ice against Stannis, he runs back to Winterfel. Roose is feeling the pressure at this point (I previously wouldn't have thought that possible for a cool cat like Roose, but his adverse reaction to the deteriorating situation in ADWD changed that perception) and berates Ramsay for his ineptitude (and actually making it back to the castle alive - "why didn't you just die out there like I intended Bastard?") and Ramsay snaps and stabs/hacks/bludgeons/strangles him to death. Now, Ramsay is in charge of the defence of Winterfell and its garrison - Stannis stomps in like a boss and puts all the Bolton men to the sword. Poetic justice for Ramsay's sacking of Winterfell.

This is certainly a very strong possibility. The way that Ramsay signed the letter, proclaiming himself the "Lord of Winterfell" and using the phrase "trueborn" suspiciously sound like he is now proclaiming his pretensions to assume Roose's role. Both Boltons seem virtually certain to die in TWOW, and Roose may well already be dead.

If one thinks about dualities I think that Martin has drawn extreme ice and extreme fire as two sides of mental illness we know well

Fire - paranoid schizophrenia - an excess of emotion and fiery rages - the dragon takes over the mind of the warged targ - Arys, Viserys, Aerion

Ice - psychopathic behavior - lack of emotion or warmth. Perhaps the inner soul or mind leaves the body - the reverse of a warg. Reese and Ramsay Bolton are classic psychopaths. The Cleghanes (both) come close

Now some Targs have a fiery spirit without being insane just as some Northmen may be reserved but are not pathologically lacking in empathy.

This very interesting. LF would seem to fit more on the Ice side of such a dichotomy. He appears to be a psychopath and definitely is completely devoid of any trace of empathy. Euron as well.

[Dimadick]

proclaiming himself the "Lord of Winterfell" and using the phrase "trueborn" suspiciously sound like he is now proclaiming his pretensions to assume Roose's role.

Not really. The whole marriage with "Arya Stark" was for the purpose of declaring Ramsay Bolton as Lord of Winterfell. We learned this from Rhaegar Frey. And already following his victory in Moat Cailin, Ramsay signs his letters as "Ramsay Bolton, Lord of Winterfell". This is part of his titles.

While Roose is the Warden of the North, he makes no pretensions to Winterfell. Ramsay uses a title previously used by Eddard Stark (Lord of Winterfell), Robb Stark (Lord of Winterfell), Bran Stark (Prince of Winterfell), and Theon Greyjoy (Prince of Winterfell).

[Melpomene]

I'm on board with the possibility of Ramsay killing Roose.

Wouldn't put it past him. Roose is aware that his current unborn baby is at high risk of being doomed at the hands of Ramsay, easily implying that if he isn't perturbed at kinslaying his sibling than getting rid of dad shouldn't be a problem.

And for all the obvious other clues; Ramsay likes to torture and kill anything with a heartbeat, with a temper/competitive nature to boot.

It would be sort of ironic. Roose commited a demeaning and harsh rape that created Ramsay, and in turn Ramsay destroys and demeans Roose.

[alienarea]

Maybe one of the spearwives kills Roose? They seem to be fierce supporters of House Stark, and with the confusion following Theon's and Jeyne's escape and the death of at least some of them they might have gotten close to Roose.

Could this have been Mance's ploy all the way? With Roose gone there is a power vacuum in the north which he might have planned to use for his own purposes. We don't know what he planned for the wildlings once they crossed the wall and who was his father. House Rayder? With a red lyre on black ground: We play for you

[VaramyrSixchins]

I'm liking the Harrenhal curse line of thinking, but I'm not sold that the pink letter means Roose is dead. I'm reading the pink letter as a combo of the Boltons swallowing Stannis/Manderly/Umber misinformation and a last-ditch effort to cow/blackmail Jon into keeping silent "about Arya". The goading, sneering, tone of the letter, written from a supposed position of power, to me seems designed to intimidate Jon, a man who didn't react when his father, brothers, and sisters were killed/married off to enemies and psychopaths. A blackmail attempt, essentially. You tell about Arya, we'll tell about Mance. This seems to me, anyway, to indicate Roose is very much alive and making calculations. Indeed, the fact that Jon never mentions that he's seen Ramsay's writing before when he's listing to Tormund the reasons the letter is legit suggests that Roose may have even dictated the pink letter.

[Black Crow]

I'm not at all inclined to write off Roose Bolton. Ramsay is certainly mad, bad and very dangerous to know, but Roose thinks, and speaking for myself I have him fingered for the Red Wedding; the Freys were just his tools.

[Bronze_Yohn_Royce]

Honestly the bit where Roose talks about his Frey wife and how he is starting to become endeared to her made me equally endeared to him. interesting how far a little compassion can go in changing one's mind.

[Belandra Waters]

Honestly the bit where Roose talks about his Frey wife and how he is starting to become endeared to her made me equally endeared to him. interesting how far a little compassion can go in changing one's mind.

Lady Walda is a Frey, and she has a fertile feel to her. I have become oddly fond of my fat little wife. The two before her never made a sound in bed, but this one squeals and shudders. I find that quite endearing.

And this just gave me the creeps. Funny how it can be interpreted so differently!

[Bronze_Yohn_Royce]

And this just gave me the creeps. Funny how it can be interpreted so differently!

Fair enough haha. I think it was more of the fact that he had a human moment that let us see a different side of Roose for once. Also the fact that he's not completely insane (i.e. Ramsay) was a relief after so many terrifying Reek chapters.

[Black Crow]

Indeed, far from seeing Roose murdered by Ramsay, I can easily see it being the other way round with Roose heaving a big sigh, muttering "stupid boy" - and shaking his head as he sticks something big and pointy into somewhere important.

[the Scorpion Knight]

Indeed, far from seeing Roose murdered by Ramsay, I can easily see it being the other way round with Roose heaving a big sigh, muttering "stupid boy" - and shaking his head as he sticks something big and pointy into somewhere important.

i see the letter himself as an evidence that roose ismost likely dead

[The Great Walrus]

Also I don't buy into the "Ghosts of winterfell" it is just a dude in a cloak killing people. Nobody (Sorry Yohn) truly believes that Bronze Yohn's magic armor is real, so why the GOW? Nothing indicates that they are real apart from an insane, seriously messed up guy.

Whats this about Bronze Yohn's magic armor?

[Black Crow]

Its ancient armour incised with ancient runes, but of course being ancient nobody can read them. Its supposed that they are magical runes but for all that anybody really knows they could be the ancient equivalent of made in Taiwan.

[The Sunset King]

Not really. The whole marriage with "Arya Stark" was for the purpose of declaring Ramsay Bolton as Lord of Winterfell. We learned this from Rhaegar Frey. And already following his victory in Moat Cailin, Ramsay signs his letters as "Ramsay Bolton, Lord of Winterfell". This is part of his titles.

While Roose is the Warden of the North, he makes no pretensions to Winterfell. Ramsay uses a title previously used by Eddard Stark (Lord of Winterfell), Robb Stark (Lord of Winterfell), Bran Stark (Prince of Winterfell), and Theon Greyjoy (Prince of Winterfell).

Interesting points. Since he has a multiple precedents for doing this, he may just be signing that way again in the pink letter.

However, the issue of the details pertaining to the letter's writting and delivery remain. It does not seem like the type of thing that Roose would want exiting Winterfell, so (if Roose is still alive) most likely he either failed to prevent it/was unaware of it being sent off.