TheSmalljon Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Don't understand why this is up for debate.. Jon would destroy Ramsay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alester Florent Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 The singers will make a nice song of it: The Wolf and The Flayed Man.There'd be something nice, I think, in the millennia-old rivalry between Bolton and Stark being decided by a duel between a bastard scion of each house.Jon would totally kick Ramsay's arse, too. I don't see how there is even room for doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Men in their cups say... Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Yeah when I read the title of this thread I thought it was going to be a discussion of the different forces that each command, maybe some theories about the pink letter (Admiral Akbar voice: Its a trap!), some plot predictions maybe......Ramsay beating Jon in a one v one fight is just ridiculous.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 View that: , imagine Ramsay making every single mistake that these guys point out because he was never trained at all, and remember that Jon had 100 times the training these guys have and a bunch of actual, living teachers in a living art instead of a bunch of old, half-understood books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Snow Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Yeah, this thread is all kinds of wrong. Everyone who discusses Ramsay's ability with a sword does so by pointing out how he doesn't have any. Meanwhile, Jon is something of a prodigy with his blade. Don't think there's even room for arguing the other side of this, to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Eater Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 He was almost ready to lower his blade and call a halt when Emmett feinted low and came in over his shield with a savage forehand slash that caught Jon on the temple. He staggered, his helm and head both ringing from the force of the blow. For half a heartbeat the world beyond his eyeslit was a blur. And then the years were gone, and he was back at Winterfell once more, wearing a quilted leather coat in place of mail and plate. His sword was made of wood, and it was Robb who stood facing him, not Iron Emmett....I thought I had forgotten that. Jon could taste blood in his mouth, from the blow he’d taken.The memory comes from getting his bell rung.Still it doesn't take a blow to the head for Jon to go the way of the Incredible Hulk. We see him throttle Alliser Thorne in ASoS so hard he lifts him off the floor and leaves marks on his neck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Know Face Man Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Jon over Ramsay any day. Mance is one if not the best swordsman North of the WallRamsay is a sick minded little boy with father issues. Cant wait till Jon smacks this dude with a back hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Africanus Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 I would love Nothing more than John and Ramsay (or Mance for that matter) battling to the death, BUT I think Jon could survive only through a cunning manuever A la Jon tackling Mance.Agree or Disagree?And Reasons.Jonny would totally brutalize Ramsay in a standup 1 on 1 fight. This isn't even wishful thinking. Jon was trained since childhood how to weild a weapon and battlefield tactics. He also occainsionally displays great feats of strength. Ramsay inbook isn't discribed as a great warrior, just ferocious, which probably would get him killed against a skilled opponent rather then it would help him.Jon lost against Mance because he didn't realize who he was fighting with. Long before he was LC he thought he could take out Rattleshirt when he was summoned by Mance. And he probably could. Mance however is one of the best warriors of the realm, as the Wildlings didn't name him king just because he could sing so well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lux in Tenebris Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 I always wondered why that blow triggered that memory. He doesn't say that Robb had done the same. Are we suppose to infer that that's what happened?I caught a few things upon AGoT re-read that made it seem like Robb often got the best of Jon in the yard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lux in Tenebris Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Yeah, this thread is all kinds of wrong. Everyone who discusses Ramsay's ability with a sword does so by pointing out how he doesn't have any. Meanwhile, Jon is something of a prodigy with his blade. Don't think there's even room for arguing the other side of this, to be honest.Jon is skilled, but "something of a prodigy" is a stretch.He is no Jaimie Lannister or Barristan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion of Judah Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 How do we know what Ramsey fights like? Could someone quote me?I remember vaguely Roose saying something to Theon in ADWD about Ramsay's fighting style. It was the same convo about how they caught Reek stealing perfume because he naturally smelled so bad. That is the only reason I remember that conversation lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_cam84 Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Jonny would totally brutalize Ramsay in a standup 1 on 1 fight. This isn't even wishful thinking. Jon was trained since childhood how to weild a weapon and battlefield tactics. He also occainsionally displays great feats of strength. Ramsay inbook isn't discribed as a great warrior, just ferocious, which probably would get him killed against a skilled opponent rather then it would help him.Jon lost against Mance because he didn't realize who he was fighting with. Long before he was LC he thought he could take out Rattleshirt when he was summoned by Mance. And he probably could. Mance however is one of the best warriors of the realm, as the Wildlings didn't name him king just because he could sing so well.This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_cam84 Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 I caught a few things upon AGoT re-read that made it seem like Robb often got the best of Jon in the yard.Yea but Jon would be a lot better now. He trains daily at the wall against multiple opponents and he has alot more expierience since then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 I caught a few things upon AGoT re-read that made it seem like Robb often got the best of Jon in the yard. I don't recall that. Not saying it couldn't happen, but I don't remember any scenes or recollections of their battles in the yard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 I caught a few things upon AGoT re-read that made it seem like Robb often got the best of Jon in the yard.That's pretty unlikely, since Jon explicitly states that he is the better sword, while Robb is the better lance. (Game, to Benjen) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R'hllor's Bastard Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 If I was betting I would put my money on Ramsey. Yes Jon is better skilled but he has a sense of honor, which is bad for self survival, especially in contests.Ramsey would cheat somehow, poison Jon before the fight or something.If it was a war situation and Jon was commander of one army and Ramsey the other then Jon would win everytime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pollo Loco Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Still it doesn't take blow to the head for Jon to go the way of the Incredible Hulk. we see him go to throttle Alliser Thorne in ASoS so hard he lifts him off the floor and leaves marks on his neck.wretches out the spear in the ground with the heads without eye sockets easily while the men struggle with the other two in Melisandre's chapter, when he's angry he goes into berzerker/hulk mode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tagganaro Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 yeah, this is crazy talk. Jon would beat Ramsay so easily it would not even be funny. Comparing Mance to Ramsay is, I'm sorry, ridiculous and laughable. Mance was perhaps the best ranger in the NW pre-turncloak (according to Qhorin Halfhand, who himself was "legendary" within the NW), and Mance was able to unite 1000 different wildling tribes together through his own ass-kicking capabilities. On the other hand, Ramsay.....well.....Bueller....anyone. All we have about him is that he's a moron who Roose himself says can get by a little with brute strength but has no training or skill. It's not even remotely comparable with Mance, and likewise Jon. Jon is very well-trained, has stood toe to toe with Mance and Qhorin halfhand, was castle-born, and has been honing his skills for most of the books. Ramsay....well, basically from what we know he's just been raping and killing women and being a moron. He has no castle training, no fighting experience from what we know (besides for attacking unsuspecting opponents and catching them by surprise like Ser Rodrik), no valyrian steel, and no willingness to learn/skill/intelligence. It's not even a question who would win in a straight-up sword fight between Jon and Ramsay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrek Stark Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 Is there any other instances where we see this besides Jons fight with Mance's Glamour?Edit: are we talking single combat? And is Ghost included? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFlayedMan Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 Ah yes. Well, Ramsay has the advantage of not being a wound-ridden corpse, so I'd give him the edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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