Whose the best fighter in Westeros right now?

[Esa1996]

Brienne. She tooled, what, 10 of Renly's Knights including Loras? Rorge, Biter, cutting down multiple suckas at a time. She's top 5 no doubt.

Brienne is at most top 10 of the fighters capable of fighting at the end of ADWD. In an all time list she's somewhere near top 20 or 30 of named characters. She's a bit better than the average knight but not at the top tier.

Barristan Selmy, Strong Belwas, Garlan Tyrell, Gerold Dayne, Areo Hotah, Lyn Corbray and Yohn Royce are all better than Brienne. Bronn, Balon Swann, Victarion, Blackfish and Addam Marbrand are all just as good if not better than Brienne.

[Esa1996]

To the guy a few pages back, who said the only reason that Oberyn won was because he had a spear is a moot point. Best fighter is not strictly skill with a sword; it's any weapon. It was smart on Oberyn's behalf to use a spear, to negate Gregor's reach.

I assume you mean me.

I really think that the only reason Oberyn won was because he knows how to use a spear. If Jaime would fight Gregor he'd fight with a sword and it would be pretty much 50/50. If Jaime fought Oberyn, no matter what Oberyn used as a weapon, I'd give it to Jaime by something like 60/40. Oberyn vs. Gregor is probably around 50/50 too. Notice, Jaime and Oberyn have the same chances of winning Gregor, but Jaime has a higher chance of winning in a fight against Oberyn. Why? Jaime is a better fighter, but Oberyn's skill with a spear just happens to be the perfect tactic against Gregor. It wouldn't be nearly as effective against Jaime etc.

If Jaime and Oberyn were both matched up against Barristan, Sandor, Gregor, Garlan etc. I think Jaime would get more wins, but against Gregor their chances are equal because of Oberyn's superior tactic. Jaime doesn't fight with a spear so he'd have possibly even a harder time to win Gregor than Oberyn.

[Esa1996]

Any of the giants really,Unless you are Donal Noye you have no chance.

Imagine Gaints in Plate Armor wielding VS Greatswords.

The way I read it was that Mag was crawling/going hunched in the tunnel which would really limit his movement making him an easy kill.

[The Prince of Ice]

IIRC it's said that Cregan lost to Aemon in the Bran chapter in which we hear about the duel, but if no one else can remember it then I just remember wrong. Anyway, I never was putting! Aemon ABOVE Cregan, just saying that he was just as good.

Also, no one has mentioned Gwayne Corbray. He fought with Daemon for an hour before losing.

Cregan didnt lose, please provide a quote because im pretty sure your mistaken.

[Korgon The Reaver]

He isn't dead is he and the guy took Dragonstone leading from the front.

People underestimate Loras and most Tyrells,Brienne is good sure but she isn't in the same league as Jaime,Sandor,Barristan,Garlan and Loras.

She's a lot like Dunk the Lunk in that way.

I was speaking figuratively about Loras being "dead". The point is, Brienne "killed" him in their mock duel as she did 12 other knights. Brienne > Loras,,, and it's not even a debate, because they already fought. And she tooled him.

[Morienthar]

The way I read it was that Mag was crawling/going hunched in the tunnel which would really limit his movement making him an easy kill.

Still man the guy has one arm.

I was speaking figuratively about Loras being "dead". The point is, Brienne "killed" him in their mock duel as she did 12 other knights. Brienne > Loras,,, and it's not even a debate, because they already fought. And she tooled him.

She pulled him off his horse after he disarmed her.

[Steinnis]

I assume you mean me.

I really think that the only reason Oberyn won was because he knows how to use a spear. If Jaime would fight Gregor he'd fight with a sword and it would be pretty much 50/50. If Jaime fought Oberyn, no matter what Oberyn used as a weapon, I'd give it to Jaime by something like 60/40. Oberyn vs. Gregor is probably around 50/50 too. Notice, Jaime and Oberyn have the same chances of winning Gregor, but Jaime has a higher chance of winning in a fight against Oberyn. Why? Jaime is a better fighter, but Oberyn's skill with a spear just happens to be the perfect tactic against Gregor. It wouldn't be nearly as effective against Jaime etc.

If Jaime and Oberyn were both matched up against Barristan, Sandor, Gregor, Garlan etc. I think Jaime would get more wins, but against Gregor their chances are equal because of Oberyn's superior tactic. Jaime doesn't fight with a spear so he'd have possibly even a harder time to win Gregor than Oberyn.

I get what you're saying, but at the time I was saying best warrior doesn't neccessarily mean who's the best with a sword, many of the people mentioned use different weapons, Gregor a greatsword, because it's basically like a longsword to him. Oberyn uses a spear, Victarion an axe etc.

Oberyn has a different style than most, I think he would be more comfortable with a spear than a longsword against anyone. But in the case against Gregor a spear was definitely beneficial, as it countered Gregor's reach advantage. But if he were to use a spear against a normal sized man, Oberyn would have the reach advantage.

For the record I'd probably rank Jaime/Barristan ahead of Oberyn, but he's still very much in the mix. (IMO)

[Esa1996]

Cregan didnt lose, please provide a quote because im pretty sure your mistaken.

IIRC it's said that Cregan lost to Aemon in the Bran chapter in which we hear about the duel, but if no one else can remember it then I just remember wrong.

[otherbeef]

Brienne beat Loras and Loras is really only a good jouster, perhaps a good warrior against common soldiers but it is stated by himself, that Garlan is the better sword.

Loras killed 2 of Renlys rainbow guard by himself, performed great deeds at the Battle of the Blackwater, and supposedly went crazy at Dragonstone. He is a good fighter. Besides, being the best rider in the 7 kingdoms factors into being a "fighter". Knights go into battle on horseback, where Loras has the edge over everybody. Garlan being a better sword just means that Garlan is very good too (as evidenced by his own actions).

As for losing to Brienne, nobody goes undefeated in tourneys. It means nothing without bringing up the fact Loras was taken offguard by Brienne's "dirty" tactics in tourney.

[Esa1996]

Oberyn has a different style than most, I think he would be more comfortable with a spear than a longsword against anyone. But in the case against Gregor a spear was definitely beneficial, as it countered Gregor's reach advantage. But if he were to use a spear against a normal sized man, Oberyn would have the reach advantage.

For the record I'd probably rank Jaime/Barristan ahead of Oberyn, but he's still very much in the mix. (IMO)

I just think that using a spear against opponents like Jaime would be a bad idea, as Jaime is way smaller of a target than Gregor and a lot quicker to move inside the spear's "effective ring". Also, Jaime is more skilled than Gregor so he'd have an easier time blocking Oberyn's spear and turning it aside when jumping inside the circle.

And as a last note. I don't think Oberyn is bad. Like I said, against the Mountain he's odds are probably around 50/50 but against others his odds are probably slightly smaller than the Mountain's. As a whole I rank him at "above average" in my system consisting of: way above average, above average, slightly above average, average, slightly below average, below average, way below average. By average I mean the average knight, not the average peasant. With numbers that would be a 6/7. Gregor I'd put at 7/7 In percentages Oberyn'd be better than 71,4% of Westeros knights, and worse than the top 14,3%. Gregor would be better than 85% of Westeros knights and equal to the top 14,2%.

Also, see my signature. I added a few polls with Oberyn in them so we'd see what the average opinion on his skills is.

[Esa1996]

Loras killed 2 of Renlys rainbow guard by himself, performed great deeds at the Battle of the Blackwater, and supposedly went crazy at Dragonstone. He is a good fighter. Besides, being the best rider in the 7 kingdoms factors into being a "fighter". Knights go into battle on horseback, where Loras has the edge over everybody. Garlan being a better sword just means that Garlan is very good too (as evidenced by his own actions).

As for losing to Brienne, nobody goes undefeated in tourneys. It means nothing without bringing up the fact Loras was taken offguard by Brienne's "dirty" tactics in tourney.

Loras killed 2 of Renly's Rainbow guard in a "red rage" -GRRM. Also, the 2 probably weren't anticipating an attack from Loras who was their "sworn brother". They probably didn't want to kill him either.

[Rickeen Baratheon]

Loras killed 2 of Renlys rainbow guard by himself, performed great deeds at the Battle of the Blackwater, and supposedly went crazy at Dragonstone. He is a good fighter. Besides, being the best rider in the 7 kingdoms factors into being a "fighter". Knights go into battle on horseback, where Loras has the edge over everybody. Garlan being a better sword just means that Garlan is very good too (as evidenced by his own actions).

As for losing to Brienne, nobody goes undefeated in tourneys. It means nothing without bringing up the fact Loras was taken offguard by Brienne's "dirty" tactics in tourney.

Lady Lance begs to differ!

[Barty]

I'm going with Lyn Corbray. Young(or atleast still in his prime), has a valyrian steel sword(always an advantage), is reputed to be the most dangerous man in the Vale, has battle experience and has killed one of Aerys' famous seven(though admittedly Lewyn was probably wounded at the time). Also it's in his attitude - Most of the great warriors of westeros seem to be arrogant and over confident(like the wild wolf, Jaime Lannister, Robert Baratheon, Loras Tyrell, DarkStar etc), Lyn Corbray displays the same attitude and confidence these men show.

[enoofu]

Surprised no one is saying Ser Thoros of Myr since he is currently the Brotherhood Without Banners best swordsmen and won many tournaments,

[Corvo Attano]

In descending order, as of the end of DwD:

1. Blackfish

2. Aero Hotah

3. Garlan Tyrell

4. Balon Swann

5. Greatjon Umber (he's still alive, remember)

6. Lyn Corbray

7. Brienne

8. Yohn Royce

9. Meryn Trant

10. Jason Mallister

Surprised no one is saying Ser Thoros of Myr since he is currently the Brotherhood Without Banners best swordsmen and won many tournaments,

It was mentioned once that in one tourney his flaming sword went out and Yohn Royce defeated him easily - Its the sword, not him, that makes him so good.

[The Taxman]

In descending order, as of the end of DwD:

1. Blackfish

2. Aero Hotah

3. Garlan Tyrell

4. Balon Swann

5. Greatjon Umber (he's still alive, remember)

6. Lyn Corbray

7. Brienne

8. Yohn Royce

9. Meryn Trant

10. Jason Mallister

It was mentioned once that in one tourney his flaming sword went out and Yohn Royce defeated him easily - Its the sword, not him, that makes him so good.

What? Who?

No.

Don't remember anywhere in the books depicting anything menacing about these guys.

[Samwell Gamgi]

Tyrion Lannister has slain more than his share of foes. I think that pound for pound, he is the best.

[Corvo Attano]

What? Who?

No.

Don't remember anywhere in the books depicting anything menacing about these guys.

1. The Blackfish was considered a very good fighter by Jaime, and would have been a challenge for him when he [blackfish] was younger, and he fought alongside Barristan in the war of the Ninepenny Kings, so he must be highly skilled to be able to keep up with him.

2. Balon Swann is very skilled (apparently very good with a sword, even better with a mace, and deadly with a bow), has won Tourneys and Melees alike, and is considered to be the only worthy KG as of the end of DwD.

3. Yohn Royce has defeated Thoros of Myr in melees (Thoros being a regular winner of them), is at least as big as The Hound, and despite being old "still looked like he could crush most younger men with his bare hands".

4. Meryn Trant is described as competent many times, and also very sly and cruel. In AFFC, Cersei thinks that she has to find a way of putting him out of action temporarily because there is the possibility that he could defeat her champion if Margaery named him her champion.

5. Jason Mallister is an incredible badass. he slew Rodrik Greyjoy (Balon's eldest son & heir to Pyke) in the Greyjoy rebellion, he killed no less than three Lords fighting for Rhaegar in The Battle of The Trident, and even the likes of Gerold Hightower and Barristan Selmy considered defeating him in a Tourney to be a major achievement.

[Rickeen Baratheon]

Blackfish I always got the impression was a better commander, than fighter; but perhaps in his youth it was different. Jaime did idolise him. Meryn Trant was only good for hitting little girls.

[Northern Nomad]

In descending order, as of the end of DwD:

1. Blackfish

2. Aero Hotah

3. Garlan Tyrell

4. Balon Swann

5. Greatjon Umber (he's still alive, remember)

6. Lyn Corbray

7. Brienne

8. Yohn Royce

9. Meryn Trant

10. Jason Mallister

It was mentioned once that in one tourney his flaming sword went out and Yohn Royce defeated him easily - Its the sword, not him, that makes him so good.

Where is it said that Blackfish is a good fighter? Yeah he led Robb's vanguard, but that does not make him a top tier fighter.