Would any of the POVs commit suicide?

[thewingedwolf]

The FM see death as a gift but it doesn't mean that they see it as one to themselves. Jaqen didn't want to kill himself.

Jaqen was (and still is) on a mission. Arya's arc is revenge for those who have wronged her and her family. I often think of Arya as a ronin samurai, one who must avenge the wrongs done to her master (or in this case her family) but will ultimately sacrifice herself after the revenge is complete.

[ARYa_Nym]

Jaqen was (and still is) on a mission. Arya's arc is revenge for those who have wronged her and her family. I often think of Arya as a ronin samurai, one who must avenge the wrongs done to her master (or in this case her family) but will ultimately sacrifice herself after the revenge is complete.

I don't see that as the primary focus of her arc. It's the hunted vs. the hunter. This is why the FM can still relate to her despite it being against revenge.

For example, once Joffrey was dead her reaction was what did it matter? She moved on.

[thewingedwolf]

à

I don't see that as the primary focus of her arc. It's the hunted vs. the hunter. This is why the FM can still relate to her despite it being against revenge.

For example, once Joffrey was dead her reaction was what did it matter? She moved on.

Interesting thought. I always figured she moved on from Joffrey's death because there so many more on her list she needed to "attend to". However, I believe that Arya is "using" the FM to get training and become a better assassin to ultimately fulfill her revenge (that is why she buried Needle and did not get rid of it, it is the tool of her vengeance, the last thing from her past).

Edit: Since her father's execution, Arya has spent all her time being someone else, either to survive or to get what she wants, therefore, being "No one" is just another step in that direction, in my opinion.

[ARYa_Nym]

à

Interesting thought. I always figured she moved on from Joffrey's death because there so many more on her list she needed to "attend to". However, I believe that Arya is "using" the FM to get training and become a better assassin to ultimately fulfill her revenge (that is why she buried Needle and did not get rid of it, it is the tool of her vengeance, the last thing from her past).

She barely thinks about those on her list. They're an afterthought and she makes no plans on how to kill them.

She wanted to learn the FM ways first while in Harrenhal. When she was the hunted. The FM help her become the hunter. She wanted to learn how to protect herself.

Assassins didn't resort to suicide IRL unless it was necessary.

The assassin group was indeed feared enough that these threats were sometimes taken seriously, as in the case when Saladin, the Muslim Sultan of Egypt and Syria, made an alliance with the rebel sect to avoid more attempts on his life. In the heat of battle however, under no circumstances did they commit suicide unless completely necessary, preferring to be killed by their captors.

[grand old duke of stark]

I see suicide as the product of despair leading to self-destruction. I do't see sacrificing oneself, especially for a cause, as suicide. Within that narrower definition I agree about JonCon. And if fAegon dies, JonCon won't want to live. And Jaime, if he is the Valonqhar, probably won't want to live after killing Cersei. Several of you have mentioned Theon. Might Jorah do it if he lives to see Dany happily married? Although I don't think Stannis would commit suicide, nonetheless he has a conflicted, brooding side that might tempt him if/when things go terribly wrong.

[Cyvasse Khal]

Depending on whether Ramsay makes it through the battle, and if Theon can't escape. Then surely Theon.

[thewingedwolf]

She barely thinks about those on her list. They're an afterthought and she makes no plans on how to kill them.

She wanted to learn the FM ways first while in Harrenhal. When she was the hunted. The FM help her become the hunter. She wanted to learn how to protect herself.

Assassins didn't resort to suicide IRL unless it was necessary.

I have seen this definition of assassins before but I do not think the FM fall into that category, but that is another thread for another time.

[ARYa_Nym]

I have seen this definition of assassins before but I do not think the FM fall into that category, but that is another thread for another time.

The FM are a combo of them and the ones in the Council of Ten.

The one I posted are the original assassins. They are similar to the FM in that they were regarded by some as a cult so they had a religious background and they also had their assassins train in other aspects than killing to make them more efficient at their job. Like the FM they operate in daytime and they did not want to harm people other than their targets. They also used poison as well.

Anyways, we already have an example like I said of a FM who did not want to commit suicide.

ETA: With both I would say that they feel that they need to continue their god's work. They seem themselves as the instruments their god uses to implement his message.

[thewingedwolf]

The FM are a combo of them and the ones in the Council of Ten.

The one I posted are the original assassins. They are similar to the FM in that they were regarded by some as a cult so they had a religious background and they also had their assassins train in other aspects than killing to make them more efficient at their job. Like the FM they operate in daytime and they did not want to harm people other than their targets. They also used poison as well.

Anyways, we already have an example like I said of a FM who did not want to commit suicide.

ETA: With both I would say that they feel that they need to continue their god's work. They seem themselves as the instruments their god uses to implement his message.

I am far too tired to continue this argument with you but thank you for a very interesting discussion. I will gladly pick this up with you tomorrow when my brain is once again capable of formulating a coherent argument.

[ARYa_Nym]

Ok. I would say committing suicide after the mission is done is more akin to a terrorist group.

[thewingedwolf]

Ok. I would say committing suicide after the mission is done is more akin to a terrorist group.

I think I may have misphrased what I meant. As I said, I will pick this up tomorrow. Thank you again, it was both a pleasure and an education.

[House Ross]

Sansa.

I foresee her hopes and dreams being crushed once again, resulting in her jumping out the Moon Door. What would be really great is if she somehow framed LF for it. Priceless.

[ARYa_Nym]

I think I may have misphrased what I meant. As I said, I will pick this up tomorrow. Thank you again, it was both a pleasure and an education.

Sure, no problem.

[franko99]

I'm surprised no one mention a fanatic like Mel or Aeron. I can totally see Melisandre giving herself "for the greater good" if she think the sacrifice is necessary to fight the others.

[Arcanon]

Mel dies using her magic to bring AAR back to life while knowing it will kill her =P.... Seriously though I hope not, I love mel she's one of my fav characters....well in my top 10 anyway

Maybe Stannis after all he will break before he bends... Also hope to god that doesn't happen

Otherwise maybe Jon Con as already been suggested....Maybe Aegon if he learns he's actually a blackfyre that'd be a brutal and interesting one

I think if it were to happen though, it'd be through one of those "You have to sacrifice life to make life sort of things" So most likely it'll be someone doing it to save someone else

[djc27]

Cersei ala cleopatra I could see happening

[JP Dayne]

I thought for a while Samsa would off herself

But them she showed how much of a weakling and a coward she is to us readers

[Overlord of Skagos]

Brienne seems highly likely to commit suicide, she has pretty much failed in every mission she was given, the society rejects her in general, she is probably going to betray the one person who get her (Jaime),she has no life/mission of her own,just living for other's dreams and needs. She might give up on it all when she breaks.

[V Targaryen]

Arys Oakheart's death always kind of struck me as a "suicide by cop" sort of thing. But I guess it depends on who you talk to.

Brienne would be one I'd lean towards, she has failed both Cat and Jaime. That would hurt anyone. Theon also considers it. If he doesn't die trying to set things right (either by sacrifice to the Weirwood or trying to kill Ramsay for instance), I wouldn't be surprised if he kills himself.

[Thendel]

Arys' death was definitely suicide by Hotah. If he actually cared about protecting Myrcella, he'd have stayed at her side, not charge into the reach of Hotah's ashen wife and leave her to be maimed by some avantgarde emo.