Does Ben Know About Jon?

[Muggle]

A Game of Thrones Chapter 6

“He and Robb are close,” Ned said. “I had hoped …” “He cannot stay here,” Catelyn said, cutting him off. “He is your son, not mine. I will not have him.” It was hard, she knew, but no less the truth. Ned would do the boy no kindness by leaving him here at Winterfell. The look Ned gave her was anguished. “You know I cannot take him south. There will be no place for him at court. A boy with a bastard’s name … you know what they will say of him. He will be shunned.” Catelyn armored her heart against the mute appeal in her husband’s eyes. “They say your friend Robert has fathered a dozen bastards himself.” “And none of them has ever been seen at court !” Ned blazed. “The Lannister woman has seen to that. How can you be so damnably cruel, Catelyn? He is only a boy. He—”

His fury was on him. He might have said more, and worse, but Maester Luwin cut in. “Another solution presents itself,” he said, his voice quiet. “Your brother Benjen came to me about Jon a few days ago. It seems the boy aspires to take the black.” Ned looked shocked. “He asked to join the Night’s Watch?” Catelyn said nothing. Let Ned work it out in his own mind; her voice would not be welcome now . Yet gladly would she have kissed the maester just then. His was the perfect solution. Benjen Stark was a Sworn Brother. Jon would be a son to him, the child he would never have. And in time theboy would take the oath as well. He would father no sons who might someday contest with Catelyn’s own grandchildren for Winterfell. Maester Luwin said, “There is great honor in service on the Wall, my lord.” “And even a bastard may rise high in the Night’s Watch,” Ned reflected. Still, his voice was troubled. “Jon is so young. If he asked this when he was a man grown, that would be one thing, but a boy of fourteen …” “A hard sacrifice,” Maester Luwin agreed. “Yet these are hard times, my lord. His road is no crueler than yours or your lady’s.” Catelyn thought of the three children she must lose. It was not easy keeping silent then. Ned turned away from them to gaze out the window, his long face silent and thoughtful. Finally he sighed, and turned back. “Very well,” he said to Maester Luwin. “I suppose it is for the best. I will speak to Ben.” “When shall we tell Jon?” the maester asked. “When I must. Preparations must be made. It will be a fortnight before we are ready to depart. I would sooner let Jon enjoy these last few days. Summer will end soon enough, and childhood as well. When the time comes, I will tell him myself.”

What is Ned thinking about so hard here? Is it as it seems sending a boy he has come to love as a son to the nights watch so early? Why would this trouble him its extremely common for base born Starks and 2nd 3rd, even 4th born sons of the Stark line to join the NW.

Or is he thinking about how he is about to send a true heir of the Seven Kingdoms to the watch. About how he is forcing Jon to give up his claim to the throne un aware. Also is he considering telling Ben about Jon's Birth?

Was Ned ever planning on telling Jon his true birth?

Did Ned take this opportunity to tell Ben the truth? His own brother that he could trust. So that way Ben could relay this truth to Jon. Seeing he knew he was leaving for KL for many years decades even. And he knew he was going into danger with the whole Lannister situation ?

Also What i would give if Ned was to finish this sentence. In his anger i wonder how far he would of gone. I really wonder what he was gona say

[shiola]

There is a small chance Benjen knows. I think he is the only person Ned would have told. However, I also don't see any motivation for Ned to have ever told Benjen.

[Blutraven]

If one other person in Westeros knows about Jon's parentage, it's Benjen Stark.

At that point in the books, Jon's only 14, never been with a woman, never fought in a battle, sending him to the Wall would force him to give all of those up and Ned does love Jon as one of his own sons.

Lyanna also made Ned promise, presumably, to keep him safe and raise him as one of his own, sending him to the Wall when the Others might be returning isn't really keeping him safe.

I think that Ned would only tell Jon about his true parentage on his death bed, as he's been so adamant in not telling anyone else. Also, Jon isn't the true heir to the 7K, Robert took the throne from the Targaryens ending their line of succession.

[Ghost's Shadow]

Ah, the daily 'does Benjen know who Jon's parents are?' thread.

[Muggle]

If one other person in Westeros knows about Jon's parentage, it's Benjen Stark.

At that point in the books, Jon's only 14, never been with a woman, never fought in a battle, sending him to the Wall would force him to give all of those up and Ned does love Jon as one of his own sons.

Lyanna also made Ned promise, presumably, to keep him safe and raise him as one of his own, sending him to the Wall when the Others might be returning isn't really keeping him safe.

I think that Ned would only tell Jon about his true parentage on his death bed, as he's been so adamant in not telling anyone else. Also, Jon isn't the true heir to the 7K, Robert took the throne from the Targaryens ending their line of succession.

In no absolute way does Ned believe in the Others.

I meant to use a not the in my sentence. "Or is he thinking about how he is about to send a true heir of the Seven Kingdoms to the watch"

Also i think Howl Reed knows the truth some what.

I feel Ben is an extremely important person in the story to simply just vanish from the story. I hope he makes a return If any one tells Jon of his parents i think it should be Ben

Ah, the daily 'does Benjen know who Jon's parents are?' thread.

Hey thank you for this excellent insight and thank you for your contribution to this thread

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

The only reason he might have told Benjen is because Lyanna was his sister too. And he deserves to know what happened to her.

[Petyr Patter]

Lyanna was Benjen's sister as well. Eddard might have kept a big secret from Catelyn, who certainly never loved for Lyanna even if she knew her from some Tourney or function. However, Benjen however, certainly would demand to know the circumstances of Lyanna's death and kidnapping. And Eddard would have told him.

Now, if Jon isn't Lyanna's son and is actually a bastard of Ned's, I wouldn't count on him knowing.

[Muggle]

The only reason he might have told Benjen is because Lyanna was his sister too. And he deserves to know what happened to her.

Thats a nice one, I haven't considered that honestly its really good.

I think Ben would relish in the idea knowing his sister was not kidnapped and raped over and over. But she ran away with a secret lover to be happy. Seeing the horrible end Brandon and his Father was dealt.

[jenerationx]

Personal feeling here is that I don't think Ned ever told a soul about Jon, including Benjen. Regardless of his thoughts during this moment (maybe he is thinking about what a wasted life for a young boy that would be, maybe he's thinking how ironic it would be for the son of the former heir to the Iron Throne to live out the rest of his days at the Wall, or maybe something else), nothing to me indicates that he would need or want to tell Ben about the truth of Jon's birth at this point. He wants to talk to Ben because Ben is First Ranger and it would make sense to at least inform him of the decision -- Ben's not going to take Jon without Ned's leave.

Ned brought a ton of tension and friction into his marriage for years and years without spilling the beans to the one person imho he should have and could have told, his wife. Telling Catelyn would not only have eased the household tension, but it would have been better for Jon himself, because Catelyn wouldn't have resented him as much. If Ned didn't tell Catelyn, he's not going to tell anyone, and certainly not at this point in time under those circumstances. My $0.02.

[jenerationx]

The only reason he might have told Benjen is because Lyanna was his sister too. And he deserves to know what happened to her.

Thats a nice one, I haven't considered that honestly its really good.

I think Ben would relish in the idea knowing his sister was not kidnapped and raped over and over. But she ran away with a secret lover to be happy. Seeing the horrible end Brandon and his Father was dealt.

If that were true, he would have told him years ago. So he let Ben suffer through thinking such things for 14+ years and then somehow the decision to let Jon join the NW is what makes him decide to ease Ben's mind about that? I don't buy it.

[the Sword of the Prevening]

Its possible, but would Benjen want Jon to join the NW if he knew the true parentage. Of course Ben would like as many good swords on the wall as possible, but the main reason for Jon joining is he feels out of place in Winterfell, spurned because he is a bastard. If Ben knows thats not true, wouldn't there be honor in telling Jon not to join. I mean the vows are only for life.

[Muggle]

If that were true, he would have told him years ago. So he let Ben suffer through thinking such things for 14+ years and then somehow the decision to let Jon join the NW is what makes him decide to ease Ben's mind about that? I don't buy it.

He could of told ben years ago if that situation is likely. I just never really thought of it and really liked the idea

Family is important to the Starks i can see Ben keeping this secret for his sister

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

If that were true, he would have told him years ago. So he let Ben suffer through thinking such things for 14+ years and then somehow the decision to let Jon join the NW is what makes him decide to ease Ben's mind about that? I don't buy it.

I never said that. If he told him, it was the moment he came back from Dorne with Lyanna's bones.

[Muggle]

Its possible, but would Benjen want Jon to join the NW if he knew the true parentage. Of course Ben would like as many good swords on the wall as possible, but the main reason for Jon joining is he feels out of place in Winterfell, spurned because he is a bastard. If Ben knows thats not true, wouldn't there be honor in telling Jon not to join. I mean the vows are only for life.

Ben could of taken him to help protect him from Robert. At this time Viserys has a better claim then Jon and i dont think the 7 Kindgoms would take kindly to a targ bastard, Also Ned harboring a targ heir would be considered treason. and to help protect House Stark i can see ben taking jon easily also

[Franz95]

Brandon heard that Lyanna had been kidnapped by Rhaegar on his way to Riverrun for the wedding. If Rickard was making for Riverrun too and Ned was in the Vale then Benjen was the Stark in Winterfell.... so it's all about, "was Lyanna willing to go away with Rhaegar?". If she was she might have even told her little brother (we know they were close, they played with swords together). And Benjen joined the watch right after the Rebellion, when Ned only had one son so his place in the line of succession was not lost yet, did he have something to hide?

He does know maybe. Maybe he's even the one to tell Jon if they ever meet again.

[jenerationx]

I never said that. If he told him, it was the moment he came back from Dorne with Lyanna's bones.

Since the OP was about the specific scene detailed in the first post, I assumed that was what you meant, I couldn't read your mind that you meant some earlier time! :) If that's the case, then agreed... IF Ned told Benjen at any point, it would have been earlier on.

[Northbound]

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[Dr. Pepper]

I think it's probably that Benjen knew. Benjen was around when the whole Lyanna/Rhaegar fiasco was going on and he helped facilitate it.

More importantly, I think Benjen abandoning Jon at the wall, his abuse, as well as previously making Jon cry indicates that he is insensitive towards Jon's plight as a bastard. He enjoys rubbing it in and I don't think he ever had any indication to tell Jon about his true parentage.

[ladytiger]

I think there's a strong possibility that Benjen knows that Jon is Lyanna's son. Ben and Lyanna were very close growing up and he probably knew that she left with Rhaegar willingly and was falling in love with him rather than being kidnapped. There's some theories that Benjen may have joined the Night's Watch because he felt guilt over knowing where Lyanna was/may have aided her in escaping to run off with Rhaegar. Even if Ned never told Benjen, he could've put two and two together and figured 'Hey, Ned is the honorable one and would never whore around. Now he's showing up with a baby who looks like a Stark? Very out of character for my brother. Unless the baby isn't his...." Very possible that Ben figured it out without Ned saying a word to him. Although, I think that Ned would tell his brother about what went down at the Tower of Joy.

It would also explain Ben telling Jon in both the books and the show to wait a few years/wait to gain some life experience before joining the Watch. The words were along the lines of how Jon has never had sex with a woman, never had children, etc. and is too young to know what the vows mean. Benjen was kind of dissuading him from joining so soon. It could be because of the wights and Others but I think Ben knows more about Jon than what casual show watchers would know...and he said "you don't understand what you'd be giving up," which could have several implied meanings.

[Martini Sigil]

If Jon is not Ned's bastard, and is who most of us think he is... then *someone* still alive in the books has to have that knowledge... If the knowlege of Jon's true parentage died with Ned, then so dos that plotline....

Benjen would make the most sense.