British accents

[Greyjoy67]

Not to a Scot it isn't. Although the actor has a strong Scotish accent, the character he plays has a northern English accent.

Yeah, Scot here. Robb Stark has a northern English accent, regardless of the actor that plays him. Same goes for the Old Bear, Jon Snow, Ned Stark, Robert Baratheon, the Greatjon and Theon Greyjoy. The north of England seems to associate with the North in Westeros. Why? Because their quite 'gruff' accents I suppose, but still understandable.

Catalyn has a more southern English accent, although some of the actress' Irish...isms, seem to pop out occasionally. Bran, Rickon Sansa and Arya all have quite strong southern English accents, which is a bit of a contrast to Robb's. E.g. pronunciations of bath or castle would differ. Northerners say "Baaaaaaath", whereas southerners say "Barthhh".

The celtic accents - I did detect a bit of a Welsh accent from a couple of the Vale knights, although they're not strong. For Americans etc, just type in Welsh rugby videos on youtube and hear some of the commentary, and you'll get an idea of Welsh accents! And the only Irish accent I've really heard is Davos'. Scottish-wise, I can't think of anyone detectable. Hopefully they give one character/region our accent somewhere along the line

Most characters in the show, generally have southern English accents though - Varys, Cersei, Tyrion (to an extent), Jaime (although some words come out funny...), Barristan, Lancel, Renly, Stannis (need to hear more), Daenerys, Viserys, Littlefinger etc...

As for the question from the OP, I would say that regional accents are fine to pass as "Westeros accents" for the show, but you need to be consistent. They've associated the Starks and their allies with Northern England, and the more southern kingdoms with Southern England, but that's the only real discernible thing I noticed.

[MinDonner]

Here's a fun fact - the princess in Krull was actually English, but they decided to overdub her with an American voice so that it wouldn't confuse the US audiences. :lol:

[williamjm]

I'm writing a piece for the website on why all of the characters in Game of Thrones, and many other TV and film adaptations of fantasy literature, speak with modern-day British accents - even if, as in the case of GoT, some of the actors playing them are American.

Since the main part of the setting is clearly heavily based on medieval Britain, almost all the main actors are British or Irish and it is largely filmed in Northern Ireland it seems the obvious choice, why wouldn't they use a British accent? I don't think there's any reason why fantasy has to use British accents and I don't see anything wrong with a fantasy adaptation potentially using American accents, but if it is set in a medieval Britain or in fantasy equivalent of medieval Britain then it seems reasonable for British accents to be used.

'Highlander' is probably one of the most popular pre-LoTR medieval fantasy movies (though it is also half-urban fantasy), and, while most of the actors appearing in the "past" segments were British, the villain, supposedly a Russian, had an American accent and I don't think anybody minded: he's one of the more popular villains from the genre

I think Highlander is a good example that incongruous accents don't put most people off a film. I don't know if Christopher Lambert (who is French) was attempting a Scottish accent but he certainly didn't get anywhere near one, although his accent did work better for the present-day scenes - after Connor had spent centuries wandering around Europe and America it did make sense he wouldn't have much of a Scottish accent. Sean Connery did a very good Scottish accent, of course, but he was playing a Spanish-Egyptian swordsman.

I realise this is off-topic, but what do you Brits thinks of the accents in the show? English is not my native language, so I really can't tell, but do Peter Dinklage and Nikolaj Coster Waldau, for instance, have a good accent?

It's not too bad, but sometimes Dinkage's accent does wander across the Atlantic a bit.

Beyond the Wall is like Scotland can be during winter - it can get awful up there.

Scotland doesn't really get all that much snow. I grew up in the Scottish Highlands, and if we ever got the amount of snow they get North of the Wall we wouldn't survive very long.

[Dolorous Eddie]

They are indeed regional British accents, at least in part. The majority of the actors portraying Southern characters seem to have a very "standard"/ "neutral" English accent- I'm afraid I don't know what the precise terminology is, if anyone can correct me.

I believe it's "received pronunciation" or BBC English. It's what they try to teach us at the British Council. Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Received_Pronunciation

Very interesting post, btw. I wonder if all those regional variations you mentioned were deliberate. It doesn't make a difference to me, since I can't tell one accent from the other unless they're very distinctive (like Scottish or Irish accents), but it's nice they went to all that trouble, heehee.

[boojam]

It goes back a long ways... I understand it was done in Kubrick's 1960 Spartacus to differentiate the patrician Romans from the plebeian slaves.

The major roles were Laurence Olivier , Charles Laughton and Peter Ustinov, all of whom were great,, Ustinov won an Oscar.

There were two odd men out, John Dall as Marcus Publius Glabrus, and why they picked John Gavin for a young

Julius Caesar beats me, it's a small role but they did not even pick a actor who looked like Caesar, but that's happened before.

For Jean Simmons they had a clever ploy she was a slave from Britannia.

The slaves were all Americans , I don't think any hidden meaning was implied.

Kirk Douglas , an otherwise good actor seemed preoccupied being the producer.

Tony Curtis seemed miscast even tho he gave it a good go.

This film benefited from one of the best movie scores of all time by Alex North.

[Lord Tywin]

The British accents lend a certain gravitas to the roles requiring it, and humorous characters or those more rough around the edges fit in just fine with the rest of a cast with roles of a more serious nature. The British accents are the most versatile, in my opinion.

Fantasy or historical movies do tend to feature British accents. I don't know how that started, but I would guess it's because many of the best actors back in the day film was in its infancy were classically trained. Shakespeare spoken with an American accent just sounds wrong, possibly because The Bard had particular inflections in mind when he wrote. Elizabethan drama has had an enormous influence on tv & film, especially historical or fantasy fiction.

I mean, take Star Wars, an (if not THE) iconic fantasy film. Aside from the lowly stormtroopers, the villains have a degree of dignity, and speak with one accent or another found the British Isles. Grand Moff Tarkin, the Emperor, General Veers (played by GoT's own Julian Glover), Count Dooku, Captain/Admiral Piett - all played by classically-trained actors, and all some of the best-delivered roles in the series. Darth Vader's voice was delivered by an American, although James Earl Jones uses a vaguely English, possibly transatlantic, accent in the role. Hell, the most dignified of the rebels/good guys, Obi Wan Kenobi & Mon Mothma, have English accents. With the exception of C-3P0, who was created as a sort of English butler, most of the other rebels speak with North American accents (or don't speak at all, like R2 & Chewbacca), and they're kind of campy & goofy. They're not haughty or aristocratic but rather more of an Everyman.

Then there are movies like Gladiator or the aforementioned Spartacus. There's really no reason why Ancient Romans need to speak with a British accent, but in the movies they do. I myself prefer it. That aside, would Gladiator be credible with actors speaking "American?" Who knows. But I think a film like that is most comparable to Westeros since it involves a time & place where no one spoke English of any kind, as well as a setting that's clearly pre-modern.

Lord of the Rings has been talked about. Did anyone mention that The Shire is loosely based on rural England (just look at the name: SHIRE)? And American English wouldn't work in an Arthurian movie like Excalibur or First Knight for obvious reasons. Come to think of it, Richard Gere sounds dreadfully out of place with his American accent in FK. Same with Kevin Costner in Prince of Thieves!

[Lord Tywin]

By the way, is Dinklage using a sort of Welsh accent in the show? The occasionally rolled "L's" and "R's" reminded me of Welsh English, although I'm not very familiar with it.

[boojam]

By the way, is Dinklage using a sort of Welsh accent in the show? The occasionally rolled "L's" and "R's" reminded me of Welsh English, although I'm not very familiar with it.

Dinklage is interesting because he has a natural , well maybe cultivated , distinguished speaking voice, he does seem to let an ever so slight British accent sort of 'slide in', ... and like of all fine actors he has a refined sense of elocution.

Charles Dance is another like Peter, his elocution will rivet you to your seat!

He is one of those Royal Shakespeare Company actors , some alumni list!

So many good UK actors, a heritage of Shakespeare?

So many of this generation seem to have taken the baton from Laurence Olivier's generation.

[bigmeuprudeboy]

its a combination of setting (medieval Britain/Europe), the fact that most of Fantasy's better source material is British written (apart from GOT obviously) and the fact that casting wise its usually British or Irish actors involved

[bigmeuprudeboy]

By the way, is Dinklage using a sort of Welsh accent in the show? The occasionally rolled "L's" and "R's" reminded me of Welsh English, although I'm not very familiar with it.

Definitely not no..Dinklage is American and is therefore an American doing a passable English accent...the rolled "L's" and "R's"are just his actual accent coming through

[bigmeuprudeboy]

I disagree. There was no real correlation between regions of Westeros and accents in the TV series imo. Robb Stark's accent is clearly Scottish as is that of several other characters from the North such as Jorah Mormont, but Ned, Jon, Sansa, Arya and Bran are all clearly English accents. Syrio from Braavos has a Spanish/Italian accent, but Illyrio from Pentos has a clearly English accent.

yes there is

the Northmen speak in Northern ENGLISH accents and the further south the characters are from the more southern English they sound

good to see you've done your homework beofre making such a comment :dunce:

[Joffrey Lannister Squared]

Definitely not no..Dinklage is American and is therefore an American doing a passable English accent...the rolled "L's" and "R's"are just his actual accent coming through

To me, at times he sounds like he is speaking with a very posh Scottish accent. It reminds me of Richard Wilson (One Foot in the grave, Merlin etc.)

[lanky316]

I knew Dinklage reminded me of someone when he speaks in GoT and I think you've nailed it there with Richard Wilson. It's not perfect but that's sometimes the closest feel I get when I listen to him.

[theMountainGoat]

The story that bwheeler was working on is now up on the BBC news website.

Take a bow IndependentGeorge - your comment made it into the story :cheers:

[Anthony Kaye]

For anyone interested in different British accents, try Youtube. One of your contributors thought "Northern" English sounded Scottish. Well, I'm from Yorkshire (up North) and it jolly well doesn't!-although obviously the closer you get to the border the more Scottish it sounds

Across-the-ponders should try Youtubing Manchester, Bristol , Birmingham, Newcastle, etc. accents. They all speak English-of a sort.

[boojam]

The story that bwheeler was working on is now up on the BBC news website.

Take a bow IndependentGeorge - your comment made it into the story :cheers:

An interesting article. I think it's a phenomena , for discussion, that first started, as I have mentioned, with the 1960 Spartacus.... tho films had been placing American actors in films with 'UK' accents (is there a unified name that includes English, Scottish, Irish , Welsh accents? I doubt the Scotch and Irish consider they speak 'regional English'!)

Long ago, and well not so long ago, there have been some really bad tries, poor ol Kevin Costner.

On the other hand , over many many years now it has been noted how good British actors are doing American accents.

Times have changed, now a magician like Meryl Streep does not come along very often but lately have noticed Robert John Downey, Jr. doing a fine job as Sherlock Holmes. I am not going looking right now but I am sure I could find a number of good American actors who can do English accents.

It's funny to note that a long time complaint about even good American actors , and it may not have been their fault, was how they could not distinguish between Southern US accents. It various across the South , maybe more than any other region of America. Texans used to be really irked with actors speaking deep south and then when that was corrected the difference between East Texas and West Texas. All that has seemingly changed... smarter actors and directors I think.

Tho now through homogenization (and TV broadcasters) the flat Midwestern accent dominates, you hear New Englanders to deep Southerners speaking it.

I remember reading once that the American English spoken today is more like the British English spoken in the 18th century... and that British English evolved more since America broke away.

I can't give a good reference for this.

So that means the characters should, possibly, be speaking American English to give it that medieval flavor!

Of course real 13th and 14th century English would be indecipherable to both British and American viewers.

[boojam]

For anyone interested in different British accents, try Youtube. One of your contributors thought "Northern" English sounded Scottish. Well, I'm from Yorkshire (up North) and it jolly well doesn't!-although obviously the closer you get to the border the more Scottish it sounds

Across-the-ponders should try Youtubing Manchester, Bristol , Birmingham, Newcastle, etc. accents. They all speak English-of a sort.

If anyone has a copy of the special edition DVD of Dr. Strangelove... there is a little segment with that genius Peter Sellers. Geroge C. Scott and Sellers did little promos for the film, which were never used, of them speaking of the film by phone to some imaginary person about the film.

Seller talks about his American accent in the film, Sellers had an out of this world ear for accents, he discusses British accents, shifting into them, sliding down from North to South, the variation is astounding. He even notes that he could do President Muffley by using a particular British accent I have never heard of, and I don't think he was pulling our leg.

[Wyrm]

Native northern brit here, the accents all sound pretty spot on to me, as for the Northern English / Scottish crossover, it doesn't stretch the imagination too far to suggest that different members of the same family would have accents from different sides of the border.

What our American friends might be surprised to realise given the relatively small size of our country is that accents over here can vary greatly from town to town, and I mean towns that are no more than 20 mins away from each other by car. Probably due to the fact that these accents developed in age when people didn't travel that much (no cars or trains) - for example look at the difference between the Liverpool, Manchester, Bolton and Blackburn accents..

As far as the "American English is truer to middle ages English than British English" - that may be true as far as the differences in spelling various words goes, but I can pretty much guarantee that they didn't SOUND anything like the American accent, which probably thanks to Hollywood and all the imported TV series we get over just sounds way too modern or "Action Movie" to ever sound like it belongs in a Medieval / Fantasy setting, at least to my ears!

(is there a unified name that includes English, Scottish, Irish , Welsh accents? I doubt the Scotch and Irish consider they speak 'regional English'!)

That would be "British". "Great Britain" covers England, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales.

Oh, and Robert Downey Jr's accent is passable, as is Peter Dinklage's, but you can tell they're having to think about what they're saying. Mike Myers and Gillian Anderson for example sound pretty much perfect.. but they do have British heritage!

[bwheeler]

Thanks to everyone who contributed to the debate on British accents. The story is doing great business on the site.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17554816

I wish we could have used more of your comments. I had no idea there were so many nuances in the way accents are used in GoT.

Brian Wheeler

[Ser_not_appearing_yet]

The answer to this initial question is far simpler than this thread implies.

Our accents are just better.

In addition, American accents should really count as regional English dialects, as well as Australian, Kiwi etc. They all fall under our umbrella. In that sense, I have no problem with these accents appearing in fantasy type shows, but they should be unusual, kept in the background etc. Where they belong.

Also, goddamn you Westeros.org for helping a BBC journalist. Curse you all I say!