13th Warrior Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Will Theon be able to redeem himself in the Eyes of the Starks? or for that matter his own family? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Greenhood Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 If D&D wills it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daske Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Yes, at least to Sansa. Arya, not so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayura Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Using Tywin Lannister's words: "when your enemies defy you, you must serve them steel and fire. When they go to their knees, however, you must help them back to their feet. Elsewise no man will ever bend the knee to you". So I assume the Starks can forgive, but they will never forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireDoodle Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 1 hour ago, Daske said: Yes, at least to Sansa. Arya, not so much. This. Sansa appears to, mostly, already have. I would think Jon too. Bran and Rickon - who knows what would have happened had Theon found them.....so maybe not. Arya???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
239JMFL34109 Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Who do we count as a stark? sansa maybe bran and rickon no arya Never. his family? would you want to with that family? maybe his sister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INCBlackbird Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 2 hours ago, DireDoodle said: This. Sansa appears to, mostly, already have. I would think Jon too. Bran and Rickon - who knows what would have happened had Theon found them.....so maybe not. Arya???? had he found them, he wouldn't have had to kill any kids cause he's have already proven that they weren't able to escape him and not look weak in front of his men. on the subject of the thread, I think he can for some of them. Sansa's already forgiven him I think, Bran could possibly forgive him depending on whether or not they meet again and what takes place... or maybe he finds out about what Theon did for Sansa and forgives him. rickon and Arya I don't know. The old Jon would probably forgive him, not sure how much Jon will have changed after he comes back from the dead though, so not sure. And i'm pretty sure Robb has forgiven him from beyond the grave considering what he just did for Sansa! Then again.... I don't think Theon needs the Stark's forgiveness.... i'm sure he wants it and he certainly feels guilty. but in my humble opinion, he doesn't need to feel guilty... he didn't owe them anything. And if you ask me, at this point Theon is a fucking saint... it goes beyond heroism... he was gonna give himself up to Ramsay again to save Sansa.... that is worth sainthood! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireDoodle Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 9 minutes ago, INCBlackbird said: had he found them, he wouldn't have had to kill any kids cause he's have already proven that they weren't able to escape him and not look weak in front of his men. on the subject of the thread, I think he can for some of them. Sansa's already forgiven him I think, Bran could possibly forgive him depending on whether or not they meet again and what takes place... or maybe he finds out about what Theon did for Sansa and forgives him. rickon and Arya I don't know. The old Jon would probably forgive him, not sure how much Jon will have changed after he comes back from the dead though, so not sure. And i'm pretty sure Robb has forgiven him from beyond the grave considering what he just did for Sansa! lol. It's as if this thread were custom made for you. And btw, I agree for the most part with the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bran the Shipper Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 In the show Sansa has forgiven Theon, and in the books Spoiler I interpret the events in his chapters to indicate that Bran has come to forgive him. I don't see Jon or Arya ever forgiving him, since neither seemed to like him much to begin with (Jon especially). Rickon has trouble forgiving his parents for abandoning him so there is little to no chance he could forgive someone who intentionally harmed him. I don't see his Greyjoy family ever accepting him, he has too much Stark in him by this point. Asha might feel sorry for him but that would be as far as it goes, and I'm not sure she would even go that far. More likely she thinks he deserves what he got because he didn't listen to her advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
episodenone Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 I can't see how or why they would ever forgive him. If anything - whatever Stark ever is in a position to do so should do no more than thank Theon for helping Sansa get free of the Boltons -- and then chop his head off with a dull blade. That is the only justice Theon deserves from a Stark. And I cannot see Balon ever looking at his son as anything but a useless relic he's rather erase from existence. If Asha somehow is leading the Greyjoy's -- her best bet would be to turn Theon over to the Stark's and let them mete out the very fate I stated above. As for Sansa forgiving him on the show -- no. Remember her talking to LF about learning the game -- well she did - and used Theon to get free only when cornered with an arrow to her face. Then with hounds chasing her to rip her face off. I believe it's entirely possible that Brienne will learn of his treachery and demand to kill Theon -- and hopefully we'll see Sansa say it is she who deems him guilty thus she who should seal his fate -- and we see her lop that ungrateful turncoat's head off. And as Theon -- not as Reek. Of course I am talking about the show - not the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INCBlackbird Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 3 hours ago, episodenone said: I can't see how or why they would ever forgive him. If anything - whatever Stark ever is in a position to do so should do no more than thank Theon for helping Sansa get free of the Boltons -- and then chop his head off with a dull blade. That is the only justice Theon deserves from a Stark. And I cannot see Balon ever looking at his son as anything but a useless relic he's rather erase from existence. If Asha somehow is leading the Greyjoy's -- her best bet would be to turn Theon over to the Stark's and let them mete out the very fate I stated above. As for Sansa forgiving him on the show -- no. Remember her talking to LF about learning the game -- well she did - and used Theon to get free only when cornered with an arrow to her face. Then with hounds chasing her to rip her face off. I believe it's entirely possible that Brienne will learn of his treachery and demand to kill Theon -- and hopefully we'll see Sansa say it is she who deems him guilty thus she who should seal his fate -- and we see her lop that ungrateful turncoat's head off. And as Theon -- not as Reek. Of course I am talking about the show - not the books. If that is what Sansa's doing she's gone full psycho tbh, but since she hasn't and the entire beauty of her character is that she has empathy for everyone (inculding the people who abused her) that is not what she's doing. apparently it also bares repeating that Theon was a hostage of the Starks so he didn't owe them anything... also, what are you talking about "ungrateful turncoat"? what should Theon be greatful for? I think in this case Sansa should be grateful to Theon, he sacrificed himself to try and save her! and with sacrifice I don't even mean his life, he was gonna return to Ramsay, after escaping.... that's a fate worse then death.... way worse.... seriously though, Theon should be sainted.... henceforth I'll be refering to him as saint Theon.... btw, I'm pretty sure Brienne knows what Theon did already... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maid So Fair Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Hasn't he already? He's just helped rescue Sansa from Ramsay, which should be enough to erase his previous sins such as they are. Sansa certainly seems to have forgiven him, he's already been more than amply 'punished' by Ramsay, and you would have to be completely unreasonable and hell-bent on pointless revenge for not showing mercy to a person who helped keep your sister alive. @INCBlackbird there's only one saint character on the show and it's Shireen Tyrion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Writhen Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 I don't see it happening, overall. He did murder people, even if it was somewhat at Ramsay's behest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edd Tollett's One Vote Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 2 hours ago, INCBlackbird said: If that is what Sansa's doing she's gone full psycho tbh, but since she hasn't and the entire beauty of her character is that she has empathy for everyone (inculding the people who abused her) that is not what she's doing. apparently it also bares repeating that Theon was a hostage of the Starks so he didn't owe them anything... also, what are you talking about "ungrateful turncoat"? what should Theon be greatful for? I think in this case Sansa should be grateful to Theon, he sacrificed himself to try and save her! and with sacrifice I don't even mean his life, he was gonna return to Ramsay, after escaping.... that's a fate worse then death.... way worse.... seriously though, Theon should be sainted.... henceforth I'll be refering to him as saint Theon.... btw, I'm pretty sure Brienne knows what Theon did already... Well, you could argue that he owed Robb some loyalty - both technically as his bannerman and personally since they were friends. He may have been Ned's hostage, but Robb and him seemed genuinely close (show and book wise). All that said, Sansa chopping off Theon's head after he saved her would be some crazy shit. She wouldn't have been able to cross a river without him (apparently). He's definitely earned his forgiveness from her, and should be forgiven - or pardoned for his crimes if you'd prefer, since in Westeros what he did was a crime - by all the other Starks, not just because he saved Sansa, but he honestly suffered a fate worse than death at Ramsay's hands, so punishing him further would be heartless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies are coming Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 It's not just heartless. It's stupid. Who's going to help you in the future if you decapitate those who helped you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter's Cold Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 He'd better not be around when Sansa meets up with Jon or Arya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireDoodle Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 1 hour ago, Winter's Cold said: He'd better not be around when Sansa meets up with Jon or Arya. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter's Cold Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 33 minutes ago, DireDoodle said: Why? Neither would forgive him for capturing Winterfell, executing Rodrik Cassel and killing two innocent children. Sansa may be able to ignore his past actions because he saved her life. Arya and Jon however have no reasons to do so. Arya would find a time to covertly assassinate him. Jon would chop off his head. That's why it's best for him to not be anywhere within their general vicinity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireDoodle Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 11 minutes ago, Winter's Cold said: Neither would forgive him for capturing Winterfell, executing Rodrik Cassel and killing two innocent children. Sansa may be able to ignore his past actions because he saved her life. Arya and Jon however have no reasons to do so. Arya would find a time to covertly assassinate him. Jon would chop off his head. That's why it's best for him to not be anywhere within their general vicinity. Good points. Maybe. I think Robb would chop off his head for sure. Not so sure about Jon (basing that off previously alive Jon). Arya?? Hell, anyone not already on her list.....who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maid So Fair Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 3 hours ago, Winter's Cold said: Neither would forgive him for capturing Winterfell, executing Rodrik Cassel and killing two innocent children. Sansa may be able to ignore his past actions because he saved her life. Arya and Jon however have no reasons to do so. Arya would find a time to covertly assassinate him. Jon would chop off his head. That's why it's best for him to not be anywhere within their general vicinity. Jon was perfectly willing to work along with Janos Slynt,who was responsible for Ned's death, until the latter blew his opportunity by undermining his authority. In fact, Jon's entire arc was about finding ways to work with a bunch of murderers and rapists (and people who killed his NW brothers) in order to save the realm from ice zombies. He sent ravens to the Lannisters and the Boltons asking for assistance and he declined Stannis offer which was a prime opportunity to get Ramsay back. He is willimg to work with Mance, a NW traitor whois directly responsible for the death of a number of people at Castle Black to rescue Arya. Jon has never been an unreasonable or unmerciful person, rather the contrary, and even before he was tabbed to death (and presumably brought back) he had higher concerns. He's not the kind of person to demand Theon's head. And Arya has never had Theon on her list so should be open to suggestions by her sister. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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