lakin1013

11 hours ago, DMC said:

9/10, and this time a hard 9.  They're doing a great job showing how you can understand virtually every main character's motivations and even behavior

Except Daemon's motivation remains cloaked, at least to me.   Are we to consider that he is simply a drunk and a fool who likes sex - but not at the last second?  Was this his plan in that we already know he 'likes' Rh and he wanted to force Viserys to let him marry her, after deflowering her?  Does he lurve her?

The show has made him clear - violent, driven, hedonistic, and smart (iffy on the smart).  So what was in this whole 'let's do the town and then kiss' for him? Other posters have implied that Daemon did have sex with Rh  but we do see Little Miss Princess, revved up, stomp home and do the deed with the first available guy.

What was Daemon's motivation here?

5 hours ago, The hairy bear said:

 

I think it's a good think that the sex scene between Rhaenyra and Cole wasn't "set up". Because that's exactly how it went. Rhaenyra didn't sleep with Cole because there had been sexual tension with him for years, or because he was her soulmate. She just fucked him because he was the closest male available.

Cole is just a one-night stand.

I understood, as a viewer, that Daemon got her all 'revved' up then backed away.  [I still am not certain why.]  But Rh, ready to play, went and found the first suitable replacement she could have her way with. 

Just now, zajaz said:

The writers said that he could not go further because deep down he knew that what he was doing was wrong.

Daemon has a sense of right and wrong?  I am astounded  :-) 

ty for sharing.

Help, please!!  I cannot process what I think of this ep until I am certain about something, or at least less confused.  It seemed very clear to me that Rh was more than willing to participate fully in a union with Daemon, and publicly no less.  He pulled away, and left her there.  Did he suddenly (a)get incest issues, or was this (b)some political plan on his part, or (c)does he care for her (and not wish to spoil her virtue)?  If some spoiler thing is in place here, feel free to tell me.  

The non-spoilers section is not open so I could not post there. 

A 4.  The crab face eating squabble had no point?  No point at all?  And all those poorly equipped crab face eating followers of the crab boss dude had no overriding mission statement?  So did crab face eating boss have leprosy and that is why he was cranky, or just allergic to shell fish?

Viserys.  Whine, whine, wine. This episode was like Days of Whine and Roses for Viserys. The man just got on my nerves for all his neediness and taking up all the air around him.  Finally, he was too drunk (or maybe ill) to kill the poor stag.  Hated that scene.

Rh - girl is a bitch.  I like her.

Daemon - Dude has issues.  

I end with a question and I promise I have seen every ep and read all the GOT books.  Who was riding the dragon while Damon was singlehandedly killing the crab face family?  GOT told us only Targs can ride dragons.  Does Valeryian blood work same so it was Laenor?  When did he get lessons?  Or does his family have their very own set of dragons?  ty in advance  :-)

17 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I was surprised to see this, but it may be due to how HBO Max crashed during the premiere:

https://variety.com/2022/tv/news/house-of-the-dragon-episode-2-ratings-viewers-1235352102/

I do wonder if HOTD has a slightly older audience than GOT did, simply because the online community feels much less robust this time.

Why do you feel that the audience is older?  I think it may not be because so many people got into GoT late, had not read the books, and when they watched they were behind and confused.  Now, younger viewers may flock to get in on the ground floor, so to speak, and not comment publicly because of how some early GoT posters were responded to.  I saw many innocents post innocent questions about Got (like why is his last name Snow) and they got the -- read the book or don't you know -- or are you kidding? type of response.  Perhaps the once burned type of thing....

I gave it a 7. I had no expectations.  GOT ended poorly and I will even own up to -- great,GRRM has found another way to not finish GOT (leaving the room, walking backwards :-)  The tournament was bloody but the childbirth seemed worse to me.  When the 'doctor' straddled her and had the knife in his ungloved hand, I cringed.  I liked when Rh found Daemon sitting on the iron throne, but they seemed to 'get' each other.  V has an oozing wound that will not close - we will see that again.

Oddly, that is all I remember and I watched it late yesterday.   I will lower the grade to a 6.  

V and his dudes - What is the deal with the big marbles on the coasters????

I gave the episode a 6. There was just too much narrative that we had to plod through.  When they show us, instead of tell us, we get the wonderful scene of V walking in the garden with a 12 year old girl who was a candidate to be his wife. The way they filmed it, we could only see him first walking, with foliage in the way, then we see the small child and it is incongruous.  And it helps that he rolls his eyes later about the idea of it. I also like how the show seems to be revealing a secret relationship or understanding between Daemon and Rh.  They seem to get along in some fashion and to respect each other.  Which of course, was shown at the dragon egg toss off.  

The rest was pretty talky. 

10 hours ago, Ser Not Appearing said:

I'm sitting here stewing on why I felt like it was undesirable for them to do the marriage announcement that way.

. It's not in character, I don't think, for him to suddenly go for a wildcard without seeking affirmations from others ... especially his daughter who's best friends he's going to marry and whose reaction he was much worried about. Not to mention that he not only didn't avoid conflict but couldn't have reasonably expected to avoid conflict simply by not discussing it. In fact he's very well aware of how it will go over because it was even discussed how Corlys is a better ally than enemy. Nothing about the action is consistent with the rest of the episode.

 

Viserys had to know how Rhaenrya would feel about her best friend marrying her father.  Also, the show nudges us in the direction of both of them trying to open better dialogue between them.  His actions seem to increase the hurt she will feel by doing the announcement in public.  All they had to do was add one line or two, at the dinner table scene, that would show V trying to tell her.  That would have made it more in character, as the guy does seem to love his daughter. Or despite his love for her, the show is hitting us over the head again, about the value of females. 

On 5/22/2019 at 4:43 PM, Astrotherapist said:

why Jon had to follow through with his sentence when it was given to placate Greyworm who quickly sailed away.  I would have liked to see a duel between those two at some point in this episode.  

Tyrion (I think it was Tyrion) while sentencing Jon to his punishment at Castle Black, says that there always has to be a place for bastards and broken men.  Jon is neither a bastard nor broken. Why does Jon have to return to Castle Black and be considered a bastard and/or broken. *

 *I preferred Jon, who never wanted to be king, to return to the North where it seemed he was happiest.  But I wanted it to be his choice, not a punishment by his peers, whose lives he saved.  

8 minutes ago, Wsc48 said:

Because they would've had to fight the respawning capable unsullied army. 

You mean the totally beat-up, tired, and on their 3rd war unsullied?  What if the council said we will gather up ALL of our forces and your men will die?

1 hour ago, mermer said:

Now, I just hope for GRRM not to finish the books as they are perfect in my head.

This is such an interesting comment.  I have hungered for the books for so long that I never considered not wanting it/them.   I have the story in my head now married to the imperfect HBO conclusion.  With a few tweaks, I can come away with perfection and I don't need Martin at all.

For example, my perfect ending was Jon in the North, free.  I just would have preferred it be Jon's choosing, and not because the council had to make Greyworm happy (why did the council have to make Greyworm happy???)   But all I have to do is take all of Martin's books, tweak the HBO show, and I come away with a perfect series. 

Wonder if Martin's sales will suffer from the HBO product, or by others believing they have the ending?

5. The actors and the technical professionals did a great job.  The story, that is a different matter.  If I understand the decisions of the ?council? the Starks rule everything.  Sansa rules the North, Jon will rule the far north free folk, Mance 2.0, and Bran rules everything else. And the council sat there and said ok. 

If this is the finale, then why do I still have questions:

1. The death symbol with Ned Umber - what does that mean?

2. The CoTF symbols in the cave - what does that mean?

3. Wherever else we have seen that symbol (Battle of the Bastards, maybe), WHAT does it mean?

4. The direwolves - what is their importance to the story, and why warging?

5. What about Mel's azur ahai/Prince that was Promised?  What does that mean?

6. Who is Lightbringer?  (if not in the show, I apologize for this one)

7. I have no problem with Jon's ending, in fact I wanted it to happen, but NOT under disgrace.   The actions of Jon let the very council sit there and become.  He, and he alone, killed Dany, then wept with the dragon.  Why is he being punished, why did his brother and sisters allow that?

8. Why did Tyrion twist Jon's arm to kill Dany, then when Jon asks if he has done the right thing, Tyrion says ask me in 10 years.  WHA?

9. Why did Dany say she wanted to free all the men, women, and children from tyranny, after killing every man, woman, and child in Kings Landing?

10. When did Bran become a sarcastic smurker?  That's why I came?  What, he can see the future and put his family repeatedly at risk of death so he could be King?  Branbot wins the big game????

It has taken me this long to decide about this episode. After it ended, I wanted to give it a zero.  It was a spectacle that became a boring spectacle.  I remembered a movie Kit made called Pompei.  I have never seen the whole thing but I did see the part about all the deaths while he was running away from the city, trying to live. In the middle of the GoT spectacle, D&D could easily have used footage from that movie, it would have fit perfectly.

However, there are other elements to making an episode beyond making characters walk and talk in new ways.  The filming was great, the CGI looked real, the lighting was good, and the music, as always, was good.v  

But many of the characters were ruined.  Why wasn't Cersei killed in some interesting way.  Nobody deserves it more than her (well, at least before this episode). First of all, we don't even know if she is dead, but she and Jaime embrace and she whines that she doesn't want to die.  TOO BAD, lady.  You have harmed and used and manipulated others pretty regularly.  Maybe her contract stipulated a heroes death.  

Jaime fell off his redemption arc to be a hateful person, again.  Oh well. 

Tyrion lies to Dany, again, in order to save his hateful sister, and brother.

Poor Sandor, who harbored hate to his brother for years, found out the hard way that his brother had been dead for years.

Greyworm went rigidly crazy, killing everything, yet retaining his excellent posture.

That leaves Jon, carrying the the sin of waiting to long to stop somebody close to him, and Arya, who gets caught in the horror. 

5. I give it a 5.  

On 3/22/2019 at 11:19 PM, Joey Crows said:

 

Srry  -  I found the venn diagram but could not get it to copy

http://www.dorkly.com/post/79234/which-actors-are-in-harry-potter-game-of-thrones-or-doctor-who

12 hours ago, SansaJonRule said:

I'm pissed off at Sansa for telling Jon's secret. But I'm even more pissed off at Tyrion for telling Varys! He still wants Dany to be queen, so why would he tell? And what is with him having so much faith in both Cersei and Dany? He doesn't believe Cersei isn't a monster? And it's an advisor's job to worry about his monarch's state of mind? Does anyone else feel like he just doesn't want to admit he was wrong?

Last season, Tyrion went in to talk to Cersei while everyone else waited outside.  We never saw all of that 'talk'.  I think Tyrion made a deal for himself with his sister.  He is not above that, Tyrion is a survivor and a Lannister.   So, even if Cersei is a monster (and there is little doubt there) Tyrion might not be above saving her life too.

Personally, I think Tyrion told Varys because he, Tyrion, is worried about Dany too.  Not enough to do anything about it yet, but he does have his doubts.  It was interesting to hear Varys say that a Targaryen/Stark might actually be a great combination to rule (or something like that).

1 hour ago, Greywolf2375 said:

I For me it's not great entertainment anymore - but I have also invested time into the show since 2007 when GRRM announced it was coming to HBO, so I am going to spend another 3 hours to see how they close out the story and then wait for him to eventually finish the books.

This pretty much sums it up for me.  There is no book I can turn to, and I want to see how it ends, so that means that I watch two show developers struggle to draw all the strings together.  Even if I know that Martin pointed them in the right direction, D&D will not provide the rich depth of the book.  Instead of having a steak dinner, I am grabbing McDonalds.  

3 hours ago, Mr Smith said:

 

 

 - Jon not mentioning the incest. I liked that it was unsaid before, but I felt like it needed to be said this time. Also it would have emphasised how far apart Jon and Dany are on why his parentage bothers them.

 

But he did, he showed us.  I think there is some writing rule about 'show us, don't tell us.'  So, there was no long-winded discussion about incest.  But we did see Jon begin to kiss her,  move her against the table, and then pull away, and walk away across the room.  It was enough to tell us that Jon can no longer be 'with' his aunt, and Dany seems to have no problem with incest. 

5 hours ago, Kajjo said:

I believe it to be a misunderstanding that the last 8 years were just about the Nightking. We had eight years of suspension, entertainment and speculation about intrigues, plots, battles, relationsships. Game of Thrones is about emotions and many parallel threads, all of them interesting and everyone can have their preferences.

 

The thread about the NK has permeated the past several seasons.  I believe you do it a disservice by blithely brushing it off.  People built theories about who the NK was, what he wanted, why he existed, and how to kill him.  The NK theories branched off the CoTF theories, 3-eRaven, what Bran was, what he sees, who was Craster, why don't the wights die, and what did Hardhome mean.  Sure there was other material, but this was a thread with magic, and overtones, and fantasy.  Smart people like puzzles and this was a good puzzle. 

Smart people spent time with this puzzle because Martin was a good writer, and meant the words he said and used.  D&D decided to abandon the puzzle theorists in favor of fighting and spectacle. It was like a punch to the stomach.  All the air went out, and folks wondered -- is that all there is (cue Peggy Lee).   Yes, unless there is some super-duper twist, that is all there is.  D&D left it on the cutting floor, if it indeed made it to film.  They don't care about the prophecies.  There once was a bad cold dude and now he is dead.

Now back to fighting meanie Cersei and her pirate boyfriend. 50% of the final season is over.  

The lighting of the Dothraki arakhs was tremendous.  +
The killing of NK with no explanation, no why, no reason?   -

Theon defending Bran and reclaiming himself.  +
Bran zooming out to somewhere was WHY?   -

Ser Jorah was a brave man who died defending the woman he loved +
Jon getting pinned down by Viserion.  -

Arya becoming all she can be  +
Sansa nothing but a coward.  Could she not have taken a few minutes ever day for some sword skills?  -

The music was great.  +
Did they have no money left for lighting -

Did Ghost live? 
D&D give the BIG ENDING of the series to CERSEI -

I am going with a 5.

I am so disappointed! The myth of the NK, which powered so much mystery, is over.  Dude is dead.  I intend to use 'Rant and Rave", but WHERE did Bran go, and did he have to go now?  Maybe he went to the Avengers movie, cuz that must be better.  Like others have said, Theon had an honorable death, as did Jorah.  Other than that, I am not certain who died because it was so dark.  

The music was beautiful, the lighting horrible.  The plot - I am not certain what the plot was.  I cannot apply a number rating yet, because surely there was something good that I missed.

Also  - Sansa and Tyrion are such cowards.  He at least can use an excuse, but Sansa has nothing, I am really disliking her right about now.  What about the north, indeed.  

Did the episode move the story forward, give us new details>   0

Did the episode give us Jaime knighting Brienne?  +6

Did the episode give us more time with GreyWorm and Missendei?  -4

Did the episode give us Jon telling Dany, and in his own words, as if he had already incorporated this new knowledge into himself?  +6

Did the episode give us thoughtful discussions among various character pairings, again?  +1

Did the ep try to pass off some white husky as the incredible Ghost?  -3

Did we have Pod singing as our heroes thought about the war +2

8

7.  It was the first episode of the final season and it pretty much did what it was supposed to do.  It reminded us of characters we like and do not like, and it showed character circles, like Tyrion, Varys, and Davos.  Bran is alone.  Jon belongs to 2 different groups and is torn.  The coming scenes look good.

What I did not like-

Bronn's scenes were entirely unnecessary, designed to fill the naked girl quota.

Cersei and Euron are very annoying.  She is insane and he loves himself.  Wonder who is going to win the mirror, mirror contest?

WHERE IS GHOST?

Having read all the posts seeming to imply that only stupid idiots would like this episode, alas, I liked this episode.  As a book reader, it comes nowhere close.  But there is no book.  There is this show and I really liked what happened.  I actually would give it a 9 but since it is the last one, I gave it the only 10 this season.  Characters acted pretty much as they should.  I liked LF being outed, but I wish Sansa had killed him.  As I think of it, has Sansa killed anyone????  I liked all 3 Starks at the meeting hall.  Knowing that Cersei was acting in concert with Euron, without Jaime's knowledge, pretty much tells us the baby is Euron's (if there is a baby at all).  Jaime leaving on his own let us hope that he is finding his own way to rightness.  Jon didn't lie because he just doesn't, Ned 2.0 doesn't lie. Theon's attempts to reclaim himself were appreciated and I hope he saves Yara.  Jon and Dany was pretty well done.  The filming was not so tight that we had to see every expression but we did get Jon's face with Bran was telling us that we were looking at the true claimant to the throne.  

The one moment that gave me pause was Tyrion outside the hall in the boat, knowing (I guess) that Jon and Dany were together.  Was he sad because he loves Dany or was he happy that his 'secret' plan (jon and dany marrying) is working out or was it something else entirely?

10.

I know this is ridiculous, but I feel so sorry for Jon.  He soooo loves and admires Ned and we know that soon he is going to discover that all that he believes is untrue.