Hotpie Targaryen Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Well it was only like one chapter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Maiden Fair Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I wholeheartedly agree with this.I agree, but I also agree with others who said that introducing characters just for the purpose of filling a quota isn't in GrrM's writing style. I would like to see a strong female character who has total ownership of her sexuality and has avoided the culture in Westeros that all women need a man to be worth anything, as so few women in his story have the courage to fight the status quo... but adding someone new who distracts from the narrative just as a placeholder wouldn't be much of a win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krystalis Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Lol it was just one chapter XD I almost forgot he even had one tbh. And it was mighty boring imo <_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I agree, but I also agree with others who said that introducing characters just for the purpose of filling a quota isn't in GrrM's writing style. I would like to see a strong female character who has total ownership of her sexuality and has avoided the culture in Westeros that all women need a man to be worth anything, as so few women in his story have the courage to fight the status quo... but adding someone new who distracts from the narrative just as a placeholder wouldn't be much of a win. Like Talisa? :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Lol it was just one chapter XD I almost forgot he even had one tbh. And it was mighty boring imo <_< It was TWO chapters. TWO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aemond's Eye Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I hurts me personally when people forgets JonCon... he needs more love :(I now feel guilty for remembering the Blackfish but forgetting the Red Beard.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Maiden Fair Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Like Talisa? :lol:Well, you see what getting involved with these Westerosi men got her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotpie Targaryen Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I agree, but I also agree with others who said that introducing characters just for the purpose of filling a quota isn't in GrrM's writing style. I would like to see a strong female character who has total ownership of her sexuality and has avoided the culture in Westeros that all women need a man to be worth anything, as so few women in his story have the courage to fight the status quo... but adding someone new who distracts from the narrative just as a placeholder wouldn't be much of a win.Like Dany? Or Arya? Or Cersei? Or Brienne? Or Arianne? Or Catelyn? Or Asha? I mean...pretty much everyone but Sansa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuitableTr​ain8 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 not everone can be gay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Maiden Fair Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Like Dany? Or Arya? Or Cersei? Or Brienne? Or Arianne? Or Catelyn? Or Asha? I mean...pretty much everyone but Sansa.I was specifically referring to one who threw that cultural imperitive away and chose a female partner, which I would think might be pretty taboo in Westeros, because for the most part women aren't really given a choice if they marry or not. Dany married against her will, Cersei married against her will, so did Cat, and Asha is technically married as well.Writing gay men was somewhat less tricky, because the men have most of the power in Westeros and could have this written off because they're great warriors or leaders or have something to offer the realm as valuable as an advantageous marriage. The women, other than the Sand Snakes as mentioned below, have marriage as their main currency for power. In Westeros, a character who did not follow this path, especially a highborn one, might face a lot of backlash from family and kingdom for choosing to heed their heart and persue a lesbian relationship instead of doing the one thing women are expected to do: make a good political marriage for their family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aemond's Eye Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I agree, but I also agree with others who said that introducing characters just for the purpose of filling a quota isn't in GrrM's writing style. I would like to see a strong female character who has total ownership of her sexuality and has avoided the culture in Westeros that all women need a man to be worth anything, as so few women in his story have the courage to fight the status quo... but adding someone new who distracts from the narrative just as a placeholder wouldn't be much of a win.Couldn't that describe the Sand Snakes? We haven't seen much of them, but the elder ones don't seem dependent on men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Sansa Stark Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I think things like these ("We need more gays", "We need more black characters" etc.) are just nonsense. I think ASOIAF is already pretty open to homosexuals and homosexuality for a middle-aged series. (This may sound wrong, but I mean it in the best way.) Dorne has absolutely no problem with it, the Tyrells's precious son is gay, and Westeros almost had a gay king, even. To me, it's just like those (mostly) feminist whining about GRRM being mysogynistic or something like it. But then there's this girlcrush of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I think things like these ("We need more gays", "We need more black characters" etc.) "We need more latinos" And we were given Pascal... : D /dances salsa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Sansa Stark Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 "We need more latinos" And we were given Pascal... : D /dances salsa. And yet people were complaining that he was too white. I mean, why. :( Sexy viper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj4iy Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 And yet people were complaining that he was too white. I mean, why. :( Sexy viper. ...he wasn't at all white. Ugh, people just want to find fault with everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bastard of Summer Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I wasn't so sure Satin was gay. In the sense that he preferred men. I just thought that was what he was made to do because he grew up in a brothel. I might have missed it in the pages of it being said he was gay. Was it explicitly said? Either way I don't mind the gay characters. I thought Oberyn was pretty much a sexual predator. I don't mean in the paedo-sense, but in the "I'll have sex with anyone, anywhere, anytime, I'll double team a father/son father/daughter duo because I'm so sexy they won't be able to reject me because I so fuckin hot sense" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aemond's Eye Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 And yet people were complaining that he was too white. I mean, why. :( Sexy viper.I still don't get why anyone thought that. I got a Spanish vibe from Dorne, and Martin himself said he imagined the Dornish as Mediterranean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Maiden Fair Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I think things like these ("We need more gays", "We need more black characters" etc.) are just nonsense. I think ASOIAF is already pretty open to homosexuals and homosexuality for a middle-aged series. (This may sound wrong, but I mean it in the best way.) Dorne has absolutely no problem with it, the Tyrells's precious son is gay, and Westeros almost had a gay king, even. To me, it's just like those (mostly) feminist whining about GRRM being mysogynistic or something like it. But then there's this girlcrush of me.I understand why Westeros has to be male-driven. It is an accurate model of society at the time. If I hated the way the story is built, I don't think I'd find it as interesting to discuss it. Definitely not an angry feminist. I just think reading about someone who goes against pretty much the whole culture there would be neat. That said, I don't think George owes it to anyone to represent them. I guess the tone is hard to convey in this medium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I wasn't so sure Satin was gay. In the sense that he preferred men. I just thought that was what he was made to do because he grew up in a brothel. I might have missed it in the pages of it being said he was gay. Was it explicitly said? Either way I don't mind the gay characters. I thought Oberyn was pretty much a sexual predator. I don't mean in the paedo-sense, but in the "I'll have sex with anyone, anywhere, anytime, I'll double team a father/son father/daughter duo because I'm so sexy they won't be able to reject me because I so fuckin hot sense" There is no explicit reference to Satin being gay. Only him having certain characteristics that in Westeros are considered feminine (but not nowadays). He could be thought as a metrosexual but alas... many metrosexual are thought being gay even today. About Oberyn, I don't think he's different from many other noble men with certain freedoms. He didn't need to get married and have children like Doran, and he travelled a lot. Besides, he's 42 and he has 8 daughters, 4 of them are with the same woman who he loves. As Elia is around 16, I'd say that he has been together with Ellaria for that time and hasn't had any other woman except for the occasional adventure she's completely aware of. Compare him with Robert who was 36 and had 16 bastards. And yet people were complaining that he was too white. I mean, why. :( Sexy viper. We come in many colours =( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bastard of Summer Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 OT but when I read Sallahdor Saan in the books, I pictured him a a smarmy French guy. :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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