Gawen Westerling's Revenge.

[DarkSister1001]

Actually they are damn close to the Riverlands, anything but central.

But yes, they'd need a protector.

A mere century. Which isn't much in Westeros. Or Europe, for that matter.

I think the Golden Tooth is somewhat between them and the Riverlands but I meant more along the lines of being surrounded by Lannister loyalists.

[Frey Pie]

Damn unlikely. But he may try anyway, turning Edmure and Jeyne into martyrs when shot by 20+ arrows each.

Nymeria actually has the best chances, not being perceived as an attempt to free him.

Oh, the other noble houses do indeed respect them, out of their history.

By the way, these 20+ knights are what they have left after providing men to Tywin's and Jaime's host.

Oh I mean anguy is shown to be incredibly good with a bow. Guess it depends on how many guards are left on them at night time, how many men the brotherhood gave etc. I can't imagine a sneak tactic like you'd see in other fantasys being used.

As said above they should be safe in the west...but Stafford Lannister also left his guard down in the west and was mauled. Could we see this goat path being used again? The BF knows where it is

And I find 20 plus knights to be a credible amount especially given the bulk of men went with gawen into the two Lannister hosts

[Frey Pie]

Jaime assigned 10 archers specifically to Edmure.

I am willing to bet the Westermen know about the path to now, such a weakness would not be ignored.

I doubt they contributed much it is made clear to us multiple times they are weak and poor.

Yes weak and poor and especially so when we see them. But it's hard to get a gauge of numbers. For example the Cerwyns never get a mention as powerful but provide many men to the Starks. Mormonts are shown as poor but also provide a fair number. But yes they are poor in comparison to many

I can't remember the specific passage but will take your word on it. A rescue mission is near impossible but I can still see an attempt being made

As for the goat path I can't remember it being mentioned again so it may still be unnoticed. Regardless where there is one path there are likely more

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Oh I mean anguy is shown to be incredibly good with a bow. Guess it depends on how many guards are left on them at night time, how many men the brotherhood gave etc. I can't imagine a sneak tactic like you'd see in other fantasys being used.

As said above they should be safe in the west...but Stafford Lannister also left his guard down in the west and was mauled. Could we see this goat path being used again? The BF knows where it is

And I find 20 plus knights to be a credible amount especially given the bulk of men went with gawen into the two Lannister hosts

Well, 400 guards is a lot. Edmure would be always guarded by more men than Anguy would reasonably carry arrows. Not counting the almost-immunity of armored men to arrows.

Yes, those two (actually three, Stafford included) would have taken the bulk of the Westerling forces. Maybe up to 90%.

The Crag is about as far west as possible.

...and almost as far north. Have the Riverlands take the northernmost 15% of the Westerlands and they'd be Riverlords.

I am willing to bet the Westermen know about the path to now, such a weakness would not be ignored.

Of course they know. They knew in advance. Just as they knew about the ~10,000 other goat paths offering a very dangerous crossing which required a genius to organize.

Don't take the Westerlands for Mordor. Or the Vale for that matter. They are only ordinary mountain ranges that can be crossed between any two mountains or something like that - for small parties with limited baggage.

Utilizing them for large armies is a logistical nightmare and a high risk, but it can be done by a good commander with a great officer corps.

[Boarsbane]

Either way they are probably mostly dead or scattered since Gawen was with Jaime's host.

If they are complete idiots like Stafford they might ignore it or forget how an army slipped by but men like Tywin, Kevan, and Daven will demand the path found.

[Boarsbane]

Well, 400 guards is a lot. Edmure would be always guarded by more men than Anguy would reasonably carry arrows. Not counting the almost-immunity of armored men to arrows.

Yes, those two (actually three, Stafford included) would have taken the bulk of the Westerling forces. Maybe up to 90%.

...and almost as far north. Have the Riverlands take the northernmost 15% of the Westerlands and they'd be Riverlords.

Of course they know. They knew in advance. Just as they knew about the ~10,000 other goat paths offering a very dangerous crossing which required a genius to organize.

Don't take the Westerlands for Mordor. Or the Vale for that matter. They are only ordinary mountain ranges that can be crossed between any two mountains or something like that - for small parties with limited baggage.

Utilizing them for large armies is a logistical nightmare and a high risk, but it can be done by a good commander with a great officer corps.

If there are so many paths why did it take a magic direwolf to find just 1? And in the Westerlands thousands of year history did they never face a great commander?

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Either way they are probably mostly dead or scattered since Gawen was with Jaime's host.

That applies to every other House as well - the Westerlands are down to ~3,000 men in total.

If there are so many paths why did it take a magic direwolf to find just 1? And in the Westerlands thousands of year history did they never face a great commander?

Please remember that this report is a Lannister PoV. They are damn scared and mystify a great military accomplishment. That's nothing new.

But to put it into perspective: Robb's army on that goat path would stretch maybe a 100-200 km. 6,000 cavalrymen, two remounts each, 4m for each horse, that's already 72 km. Add the baggage train and you're set. Through that country, we're probably talking about 10 km marching per day.

Of course the goat path isn't as long, but for the purpose of reinforcements, the rearguard is three weeks of marching away from the vanguard. Do you realize how dangerous that is? What kind of scouting and anti-scouting that requires?

And how damn impressive feeding and resting everybody on that trail is from a logistical point of view?

The Westermen knew about the goat path, just like they know about all the others. But they couldn't imagine Robb to be such a genius to actually pull it of - and succeed! It's so damn impressive it's basically magic.

As a reference: There is one approach through the Mountains of the Vale - the Bloody Gate. But the small warbands of the clansmen still operate on both sides. You can be damn sure that they don't go through the Bloody Gate.

The difference is the word "small".

[The_Young_Wolf_Reborn]

I am going off the belief that the Crag wouldn't send all their forces to assist in the war. I mean a lord would keep some of his forces at home to defend it in case of an attack of some sorts. For a vassal of his size I am sure he still garrisons some sort of army that either rallied after the war (or remnants from the battles), and forces left to defend Westerling lands.

Also about rescuing Edmure and that, this I guess applies to whomever would try and rescue them. I think that they wouldn't just charge in guns blazing and shit. I am sure they would wait till they guards least expect an attack or wait till an opportunity presents itself.

And is Gawen's son is still alive, I don't think he will be for very long personally I don't believe he would get very far with his supposed wounds, it would be a miracle if he did somehow, I mean that miracle would have to be a Riverlord that recognised him or had the balls to help him.

Idk much about the history of the West, but I don't think they were invaded very often. Or I don't think invaders really looked for goat paths. Greywind was an important piece in discovering the path, but at the same time a lord with time on his hand could have small scouting parties searching for possible goat paths.

[TheCrannogDweller]

...and from then on in the safety of the westerlands.

Stafford Lannister also thought he was safe there. Granted, Prester is a cautious man and unlikely to drop his guard like Stafford, but there still exists the possibility of surprise.

And it doesn't have to be an attack in order to free Jeyne and Edmure - they might just be spirited away during the night. We know that the BWB has already infiltrated Riverrun - it's not that hard to imagine that they might have an agent in Forley's force as well.

Also, we don't know exactly who those 400 men are and where their loyalties lie. After all, Jaqen had a Lannister uniform.

[the conquering bastard 25]

Here's the thing Edmure. And widow want to be taken west. Note JL thinking about Tully being to smug about something especially given he was to spend the rest of ihsi life as a prisoner.

The BF is too smart to pass up an ootunity to have someone on the inside of CR.

As

We are supposed to get a pov at CR and jenye is in the prolouge.

I think the red wedding do over is in cr. Daven is the warden of thewest.

[Siddard Stark]

Well if i remember correctly the Westerlings brought 200 men with them to Riverrun after Robb married Jeyne. Gawen Westerling is also mentioned to be travelling back to The Crag so my question is those 200 men would be loyal to Robb. With Gawen returning to the Westerlands with his family Rollam who was Robb's squire, Jeyne or her younger sister may inform Lord Gawen on how the marriage took place and how their loyalties lie with The KITN and things might change for Lord Gawen.

If Blackfish decides to rescue edmure, Lord Gawen might try to help the Blackfish rescue Edmure and his daughter after learning from his children about the kindness of the Blackfish during the siege of Riverrun and how the Blackfish wouldn't yield Riverrun as he was protecting his queen

[thelittledragonthatcould]

Well if i remember correctly the Westerlings brought 200 men with them to Riverrun after Robb married Jeyne

Less than that.

"Dare I ask how many swords come with your bride, Robb?"

"Fifty. A dozen knights." His voice was glum, as well it might be.

[Boarsbane]

Here's the thing Edmure. And widow want to be taken west. Note JL thinking about Tully being to smug about something especially given he was to spend the rest of ihsi life as a prisoner.

The BF is too smart to pass up an ootunity to have someone on the inside of CR.

As

We are supposed to get a pov at CR and jenye is in the prolouge.

I think the red wedding do over is in cr. Daven is the warden of thewest.

CR is so massive that having someone inside that doesn't know their way around is probably like having no one at all. And that's completely ignoring the fact Edmure will probably be under guard the entire time and won't have free reign of the castle.

[marsyao]

Well if i remember correctly the Westerlings brought 200 men with them to Riverrun after Robb married Jeyne. Gawen Westerling is also mentioned to be travelling back to The Crag so my question is those 200 men would be loyal to Robb. With Gawen returning to the Westerlands with his family Rollam who was Robb's squire, Jeyne or her younger sister may inform Lord Gawen on how the marriage took place and how their loyalties lie with The KITN and things might change for Lord Gawen.

These Westerling men's loyalty first is to their Lord, not to Robb, I wonder why you think otherwise, is it because Robb was so damn cute? Besides, most of them of course was lost in the Red Wedding.

[marsyao]

If Blackfish decides to rescue edmure, Lord Gawen might try to help the Blackfish rescue Edmure and his daughter after learning from his children about the kindness of the Blackfish during the siege of Riverrun and how the Blackfish wouldn't yield Riverrun as he was protecting his queen

Why would Lord Gawen need to "rescue" his daughter? Jeyne was on her way back home

[the conquering bastard 25]

CR is so massive that having someone inside that doesn't know their way around is probably like having no one at all. And that's completely ignoring the fact Edmure will probably be under guard the entire time and won't have free reign of the castle.[/quote

My gut says CR is due !to fall and Edu!ure is key.

[thelittledragonthatcould]

How exactly?

Robb with 6,000 didn't feel he could take it. Balon with his army felt that he couldn't take it. How exactly is Edmure going to be key?

[Ser Charles of Rosehaven]

How exactly?

Robb with 6,000 didn't feel he could take it. Balon with his army felt that he couldn't take it. How exactly is Edmure going to be key?

He will fill it with peasants right?

[The_Young_Wolf_Reborn]

House Westerling loyalty towards House Lannister and CR won't be what is was. And Westerling soldiers as it was already stated are loyal to their lord, though they might be loyal to Robb, loyalty to Gawen comes first.

Also how could Edmure be the key, he has 0 soldiers left since he no longer holds any lands or titles. The BF is 1 man not an army despite his skill etc.

[Mikkel]

House Westerling loyalty towards House Lannister and CR won't be what is was. And Westerling soldiers as it was already stated are loyal to their lord, though they might be loyal to Robb, loyalty to Gawen comes first.

Also how could Edmure be the key, he has 0 soldiers left since he no longer holds any lands or titles. The BF is 1 man not an army despite his skill etc.

Edmure (particularly if he's with Brynden) would still be able to drum up a lot of support from the Riverlands lords, in much the same way that the Stark heir - whoever ends up raising the banner - will be able to muster some force despite Winterfell having, well, fallen.