Heresy 181

[Black Crow]

Black Crow, your quote above, "Blood built it, blood stopped the building of it, and blood will bring it down. Black will be its fall." would fit with the idea that blood is needed for ice magic, that blood built the icy Wall, and that Jon's black burning sword will defeat the icy Others.

Don't know about a fiery sword, but as I say the curse seems to sum up the Wall perfectly.

As to its fall, if blood is going to bring it down it needn't necessarily be literal; if by whatever means Bran the Builder was indeed involved in building it, perhaps it was his blood; the Nights King [or his overthrow] which stopped the building of it; and now Jon Snow, who is likewise of his blood, may bring about its fall.

[LmL]

There are actually three different foreshadowings of Jon having something to do with taking down the Wall, an event which seems connected to the fall of the new Long Night. One of these days I need to put them together in a post. Naturally, I think some meteors will be involved, but that's beside the point, as they would only be a mechanism. The important thing is that that Wall is coming down, a new LN is coming, and Jon will somehow be right in the middle of it. 

[Black Crow]

Don't know about meteors, but I've certainly felt for a long time [indeed it was one of the founding tenets of Heresy] that far from being a disaster the fall of the Wall may be necessary and might take a Son of Winterfell to accomplish it 

[Lady Dyanna]

Lady Dyanna, does Pretty Pig have a Star Wars analogy thread? Or were you talking about her Marvel-ous thread?

The Marvelous thread. I'm working on one comparing Anakin to Jon, but there is so much Star Wars Cannon that it's taking forever to sort through it all. I resorted to starting just watching the movies last night.

[e1kabong]

 

The Marvelous thread. I'm working on one comparing Anakin to Jon, but there is so much Star Wars Cannon that it's taking forever to sort through it all. I resorted to starting just watching the movies last night.

Here's something to help out. I looked up some things regarding the similarities between the Jedi and the Watch. Here's the Watch's Creed along with corresponding pieces from the Jedi tenets:

Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.

I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children.

A Jedi must not, however, explore the realm of marriage. To love another is dangerous yet acceptable if treated with care, but attaching oneself to another life in the bonds of matrimony cannot be allowed.

I shall wear no crowns and win no glory.

Ruling power and financial wealth are not permitted for a Jedi...A Jedi does not fight for adventure or glory. A Jedi fights for the survival of civilization and the survival of the people within it.

I shall live and die at my post.

All Jedi are to respect the decisions of the Jedi High Council... Centralized leadership is important, and this council... was chosen... to make these decisions for the Order. Jedi may disagree with the High Council but they must never openly oppose it.

I am the sword in the darkness. I am the watcher on the walls. I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realms of men.

Jedi are the guardians of peace, justice, and order in the galaxy... When the galaxy is split, a Jedi will side with the Republic, even if there are disagreements with the Republic’s leadership, as we defend the people of the Republic. To rebel against this tenet is to create disorder and chaos...A Jedi is to protect the weak and defenseless.

I pledge my life and honor to the Night's Watch, for this night and all the nights to come.

A Jedi must put the need of the community over the needs of individuals...Your importance lies in your devotion...

A lot of intriguing similarities. Something else that is kind of amazing is that the birth of the modern Jedi Order began with a conflict about political corruption within the original order. A Jedi founded a monastery amongst an alien race, intermingling with them and training them in the Force. It was in conflict with that monastery when the order was split. Sounds an awful lot like a parallel to the Night's King. The icing on the cake, though? The person who founded that monastery to cause the split was Matthew Skywalker...a possible descendant of Anakin in the same way that the Night's King is a possible ancestor of Jon Snow. 

[Melifeather]

There are actually three different foreshadowings of Jon having something to do with taking down the Wall, an event which seems connected to the fall of the new Long Night. One of these days I need to put them together in a post. Naturally, I think some meteors will be involved, but that's beside the point, as they would only be a mechanism. The important thing is that that Wall is coming down, a new LN is coming, and Jon will somehow be right in the middle of it. 

 

I still think the meteors ended the Long Night. I've been re-reading your essays, but it'll be awhile before I'll have an organized critique with supporting text. A large piece of your foundation rests upon the assumption that Azor Ahai was a historical evil person that killed his wife, but I think the story is strictly celestial in nature and passed down in the oral tradition by the survivors to describe what they witnessed. Yes a meteor shower with large enough pieces could theoretically cause a darkness, but not long enough to qualify as the Long Night. Even an eruption from a super volcano would only cause modest "winters" of anywhere from 2-6 years while the Long Night was said to last a whole generation. If the Long Night already lasted a whole generation before being wiped out by falling moon chunks, then another couple years of darkness before a return to normal would be a small price to pay to end said winter.

If you still assert that the meteors caused the Long Night, then what ended it?

 

[LmL]

 

I still think the meteors ended the Long Night. I've been re-reading your essays, but it'll be awhile before I'll have an organized critique with supporting text. A large piece of your foundation rests upon the assumption that Azor Ahai was a historical evil person that killed his wife, but I think the story is strictly celestial in nature and passed down in the oral tradition by the survivors to describe what they witnessed. Yes a meteor shower with large enough pieces could theoretically cause a darkness, but not long enough to qualify as the Long Night. Even an eruption from a super volcano would only cause modest "winters" of anywhere from 2-6 years while the Long Night was said to last a whole generation. If the Long Night already lasted a whole generation before being wiped out by falling moon chunks, then another couple years of darkness before a return to normal would be a small price to pay to end said winter.

If you still assert that the meteors caused the Long Night, then what ended it?

 

Hey FC. I'm of the opinion that the idea that the LN "lasted a generation"  in the context of folklore could really mean anything more than a couple years up to a couple decades. Honestly it only takes a couple years of a nuclear winter type scenario for all the crops to die, for food stores to run out, and for total anarchy and mass starvation to take hold. I think 6-12 years is probably a good estimate, and that's in the window for a volcanic / nuclear winter scenario brought on by a comet or meteor strike.

Plus... magic. The LN was not just a meteor disaster just as the Doom wasn't just a volcanic explosion. When you consider magic was involved, the LN could have listed as long as Martin wanted. 

I absolutely think the cracking of the moon caused the LN, yes. It's not "an assumption," by any stretch - it's one of my textually best-supported ideas, I would claim. Consider  this simple fact: when Azor Ahai forged Lightbringer, he broke the moon. It's right in the story, without any external corroboration - the forging of LB cracked the moon, and AA is the one who did it. The Qarthine tale picks up the story to tell us what happened when the moon cracked - dragons poured forth. Obviously if a moon cracked or was impacted in some way, what would pour forth would be meteorites. The only two things which can create a nuclear winter type scenario (besides a nuclear bomb)  are very massive volcanoes and comet or meteor impacts. We are being told about a moon cracking and about meteors falling to the earth, and about a prolonged darkness.  If we are being given a mechanism which can cause such a darkness – the meteors – it seems counterintuitive to think that they didn't in fact cause the darkness. 

In my opinion, cracking the moon makes you the bad guy. In my opinion, stabbing your wife to create a magic sword also makes you the bad guy.  

Then there's all the evidence which points to the bloodstone emperor being the same person as Azor Ahai, and we know what that guy was about.  Dark arts, torture, necromancy, enslavement, the black meteorite, starry wisdom cult, etc. The Bloodstone E was also said to be the one who caused the LN, just as I am claiming AA did. 

And then there's all the various things which represent Lightbringer and Azor Ahai reborn, all the things which are a child of the sun and moon in some way. All of these things are associated with shadow and burning blood. I touched on this in my first podcast, and will develope it further in the next one which I hope to put out tonight, actually. I could go on and on about various reasons for thinking what I do about AA, but I don't want to completely destroy the thread here. My podcasts have my current best version of my ideas - when I turn essays into podcasts I basically end up rewriting them, and hopefully strengthening them. Those are things I would suggest examining if you want to talk meteors and stuff with me. 

Just to be clear, I do the the NW as meteor symbols - we agree on that - but I just don't think that means what you think it means. 

ETA: for the most part, I do not know how the LN was ended. I have a feeling the LH was a sacrifice in some way, that the original NW was undead (I'm sure of this actually), and that the NK / NQ tale has something to do with this. I don't think the NK story really happened after the LN, but during. I tend to think I have found clues that the LH was the son of AA, and that he worked to right the wrongs of his father to some extent. Perhaps the LH is the NK, or perhaps AA is the NK... I'm just really not sure. But not having an answer about what fixed the LN doesn't make me feel any less confident about my conclusions about its cause. What cured it is the bigger mystery, it's the thing Martin probably doesn't want to give away, because that would give us major clues about how the books will end. I think he wants us to know more about the cause, because then it allows us to speculate and make reasonably educated guesses about the endgame of the main story and the original LN both. 

[LmL]

Consider this: if the NW was all armed with dragon steel - flaming swords made from AA's black meteorite, proto-Valyrian steel - then what they would be doing is making lemonade from lemons, more or less. The black meteorites fell to the earth and fucked everything up - but then, someone found a way to turn the evil of the meteors against the evil of the Others, cancelling out all the bad juju or something. I think that's the arc of Lightbringer I may be seeing - a dread, evil black sword, the one which brought the darkness, but one that was somehow sanctified or broken and reforged, and then put to good use. Think about it - AA broke the moon. He made a sword from the moon meteor. This is the corpse of the moon goddess, defiled and burnt and made into a weapon of evil blood magic. Is that the end of the line for the poor old moon goddess? How about some kind of silver lining, some sort of vindication for her? Perhaps there was a way to "fix" LB so it could be used for good. There are a lot of clues about swords being broken in interesting places, and we know the LH's sword broke, and that he received some kind of mysterious aid from the cotf, and then was also said to have eventually wielded dragon steel against the Others. Perhaps the cotf helped reforge the sword, and the defiled moon goddess rocks got to serve a purpose after all.  

Full disclosure the cotf helping the LH reforge a sword is an idea I heard on Radio Westeros.

I also need to figure out how the creation of the Others relates to the LN disaster. Were they created as a reaction to evil fire magic? Is there a black meteor in the heart of winter providing necromantic energy that raises the wights? Is there a black meteor stuck in the hypothetical ice moon, providing the necromantic energy blah blah blah... Is there a moon meteor on the Isle of Faces, perhaps used to create the Others? Remember that the BSE practiced necromancy with his black stone - there may be a connection. Asshai is all greasy black stone, and the entire area is magically poisoned or something. But it's also a source of energy, as proven by all the magicians who go there to learn and practice. 

[LmL]

Don't know about meteors, but I've certainly felt for a long time [indeed it was one of the founding tenets of Heresy] that far from being a disaster the fall of the Wall may be necessary and might take a Son of Winterfell to accomplish it 

Let me ask you: what would the potential positive effects of the Wall coming down be? I'm really curious about this idea. 

[Scorpion92]

Let me ask you: what would the potential positive effects of the Wall coming down be? I'm really curious about this idea. 

For some odd reason I think that when the Wall comes down and the White Walkers invade with the dead army, Jon and Bran will be in the middle of it. House Stark will remind the North why they are called Kings of Winter. I think Bran using blood magic will get the wights under control and turn them into Stark weapon like Coldhands is controlled by Bloodraven. Telltale's Game of Thrones episode 10 gave an intriguing idea of how Bran can accomplish that via Forrester bastard.

With the dead army under Bran's control, I do not think it will be too hard for Jon to subdue and make some pact with White Walkers on equal ground. Whereas Robb Stark was crowned as King in the North, his heir, Jon Stark, will be crowned as King of Winter and march south to face Dany, dragons and southern kingdoms.

But I don't know, just an intuition.

[e1kabong]

Let me ask you: what would the potential positive effects of the Wall coming down be? I'm really curious about this idea. 

Speaking for my own opinions, Jon is totally going to bring down the wall. I don't think there will be positive effects.

It fits his role in both my historic favorite super-theory (Rangarok theory says he is Surtr the Black, destined to break the Bifrost Bridge and kill Freyr with a flaming sword) and my new pet Darth Snow theory, wherein Jon would take the role of Anakin Skywalker, who destroys the Jedi Order (see also: Night's Watch). 

[LmL]

That's all terrific speculation guys... very entertaining. I like all of these ideas... he's already 3/4's of the way finished with destroying the watch, although he did it in part by forcing them to modernize in an intelligent way (letting the wildlings through). But that doesn't matter for the sake of establishing the similar pattern or plot arc, of course. I also have found clues that the King of Winter has undead armies to serve him. There's some good ones in the AGOT chapter where Robert comes to WF. So I like that, turning the wights against the Others, very interesting. That makes the idea of Bloodraven or Bran controlling the wights more palatable.

Just for the record, I feel very certain that Bloodraven is not controlling Coldhands, but rather that CH is an undead / resurrected skinchanger or greenseer. He's actually a model for the original NW, who were all undead (hypothesis) and for Jon's resurrected self. A skinchanger can take back over his own wighted or ressurceted corpse, in theory, if his soul is stored in his animal familiar, and I think this explains why CH appears to be a wight except that he 1.) doesn't have blue eye / isn't controlled by the Others, 2.) appears to have his own consciousness / his own soul, and 3.) acts like a powerful skinchanger or greenseer, communicating with the ravens and controlling the elk. This last is telling - animals are always terrified of wight smell, but the elk lets him ride and obeys his commands when they separate. Why is that? Is BR skinchanging the elk and CH and the ravens? I don't think so - I think CH is doing that himself. I think when a skinchanger or greenseer resurrects in this manner, they retain their magical abilities. Think about it - we can't have resurrected Jon with no magical abilities can we? No! 

Also, Jon might end up a little different than CH if fire magic is involved, although that's purely speculative of course. Perhaps Jon will be "Hothands."

[Melifeather]

Consider this: if the NW was all armed with dragon steel - flaming swords made from AA's black meteorite, proto-Valyrian steel - then what they would be doing is making lemonade from lemons, more or less. The black meteorites fell to the earth and fucked everything up - but then, someone found a way to turn the evil of the meteors against the evil of the Others, cancelling out all the bad juju or something. I think that's the arc of Lightbringer I may be seeing - a dread, evil black sword, the one which brought the darkness, but one that was somehow sanctified or broken and reforged, and then put to good use. Think about it - AA broke the moon. He made a sword from the moon meteor. This is the corpse of the moon goddess, defiled and burnt and made into a weapon of evil blood magic. Is that the end of the line for the poor old moon goddess? How about some kind of silver lining, some sort of vindication for her? Perhaps there was a way to "fix" LB so it could be used for good. There are a lot of clues about swords being broken in interesting places, and we know the LH's sword broke, and that he received some kind of mysterious aid from the cotf, and then was also said to have eventually wielded dragon steel against the Others. Perhaps the cotf helped reforge the sword, and the defiled moon goddess rocks got to serve a purpose after all.  

Full disclosure the cotf helping the LH reforge a sword is an idea I heard on Radio Westeros.

I also need to figure out how the creation of the Others relates to the LN disaster. Were they created as a reaction to evil fire magic? Is there a black meteor in the heart of winter providing necromantic energy that raises the wights? Is there a black meteor stuck in the hypothetical ice moon, providing the necromantic energy blah blah blah... Is there a moon meteor on the Isle of Faces, perhaps used to create the Others? Remember that the BSE practiced necromancy with his black stone - there may be a connection. Asshai is all greasy black stone, and the entire area is magically poisoned or something. But it's also a source of energy, as proven by all the magicians who go there to learn and practice. 

Whoa Nellie! lol, I mean LmL! I didn't mean to side track the current discussion! I am not prepared to defend my position as of yet and won't be for some time, but I will say that I agree with much of your explanation of symbolism, including everything about the comet striking the moon, etc, etc...just begging to differ about when the Long Night occurred and why it all happened. =) 

[Melifeather]

That's all terrific speculation guys... very entertaining. I like all of these ideas... he's already 3/4's of the way finished with destroying the watch, although he did it in part by forcing them to modernize in an intelligent way (letting the wildlings through). But that doesn't matter for the sake of establishing the similar pattern or plot arc, of course. I also have found clues that the King of Winter has undead armies to serve him. There's some good ones in the AGOT chapter where Robert comes to WF. So I like that, turning the wights against the Others, very interesting. That makes the idea of Bloodraven or Bran controlling the wights more palatable.

Just for the record, I feel very certain that Bloodraven is not controlling Coldhands, but rather that CH is an undead / resurrected skinchanger or greenseer. He's actually a model for the original NW, who were all undead (hypothesis) and for Jon's resurrected self. A skinchanger can take back over his own wighted or ressurceted corpse, in theory, if his soul is stored in his animal familiar, and I think this explains why CH appears to be a wight except that he 1.) doesn't have blue eye / isn't controlled by the Others, 2.) appears to have his own consciousness / his own soul, and 3.) acts like a powerful skinchanger or greenseer, communicating with the ravens and controlling the elk. This last is telling - animals are always terrified of wight smell, but the elk lets him ride and obeys his commands when they separate. Why is that? Is BR skinchanging the elk and CH and the ravens? I don't think so - I think CH is doing that himself. I think when a skinchanger or greenseer resurrects in this manner, they retain their magical abilities. Think about it - we can't have resurrected Jon with no magical abilities can we? No! 

Also, Jon might end up a little different than CH if fire magic is involved, although that's purely speculative of course. Perhaps Jon will be "Hothands."

To the bolded above...if Varamyr's POV is meant to be our instruction manual for skinchangers, then skinchangers cannot leave their familiars after their own physical bodies die. They live out a second life in their host body. They become part of their host and even fade into the background. After Orell's body died, he was stuck in his eagle. We know this because Varamyr could feel Orell's hatred for Jon whenever he was in the eagle. And shortly after Varamyr's body died, his spirit was floating free and moving with the wind. His only remaining connection was to One Eye. 

[LmL]

Whoa Nellie! lol, I mean LmL! I didn't mean to side track the current discussion! I am not prepared to defend my position as of yet and won't be for some time, but I will say that I agree with much of your explanation of symbolism, including everything about the comet striking the moon, etc, etc...just begging to differ about when the Long Night occurred and why it all happened. =) 

Well hey, I've been looking at things a certain way for a while now, so by all means, I'm happy to see you continue to explore a different configuration of interpretations or whatever - it's totally possible I have 90% of my symbolism approximately correct but have missed some big picture idea which totally changes the whole thing. One oversight or misinterpretation can affect the way one sees everything else. I'm glad other people who understand the basic body of evidence I'm looking at are exploring different options, because maybe you'll catch the thing I am missing. 

I look forward to your post whenever it comes, and I'm expecting lots of quotes from TWOIAF.  All good theories have a healthy dose of TWOIAF.    

[Melifeather]

Well hey, I've been looking at things a certain way for a while now, so by all means, I'm happy to see you continue to explore a different configuration of interpretations or whatever - it's totally possible I have 90% of my symbolism approximately correct but have missed some big picture idea which totally changes the whole thing. One oversight or misinterpretation can affect the way one sees everything else. I'm glad other people who understand the basic body of evidence I'm looking at are exploring different options, because maybe you'll catch the thing I am missing. 

I look forward to your post whenever it comes, and in expecting lots of quotes from TWOIAF.

To the bolded above....that part. may not. happen. =)

[Melifeather]

I don't have a solid theory as to what Coldhands is, but the very fact that he rides an elk suggests that he may be a green man. 

   “Was he green?” Bran wanted to know. “Did he have antlers?”

   The fat man was confused. “The elk?”

   “Coldhands,” said Bran impatiently. “The green men ride on elks, Old Nan used to say. Sometimes they have antlers too.”

   “He wasn’t a green man. He wore blacks, like a brother of the Watch, but he was pale as a wight, with hands so cold that at first I was afraid. The wights have blue eyes, though, and they don’t have tongues, or they’ve forgotten how to use them.” The fat man turned to Jojen. “He’ll be waiting. We should go. Do you have anything warmer to wear? The Black Gate is cold, and the other side of the Wall is even colder. You—”

 

 

 

[LmL]

 

To the bolded above...if Varamyr's POV is meant to be our instruction manual for skinchangers, then skinchangers cannot leave their familiars after their own physical bodies die. They live out a second life in their host body. They become part of their host and even fade into the background. After Orell's body died, he was stuck in his eagle. We know this because Varamyr could feel Orell's hatred for Jon whenever he was in the eagle. And shortly after Varamyr's body died, his spirit was floating free and moving with the wind. His only remaining connection was to One Eye. 

Well, the fact that we were told that it takes a little while for the skinchanger to merge with the animal familiar makes me think that if someone were to find a way to force the spirit - both animal and human, as they would be merging - out of the animal, and if one were to have a resurrected corpse handy, preferably that of the dead skinchanger, I imagine you might be able to move the merged soul back over to the human. We might have been given a clue about how force a soul out of an animal when Mel burned the eagle the Varamyr was skinchanging out of the sky. I predict that Ghost's wolf body will have to be sacrificed, and the merged JonGhost soul will be forced back into resurrected Jon's body. 

The whole point of this, I belive, is to create people who can fight the Others. Think about Coldhands - he doesn't need to eat, he's impervious to cold, he probably doesn't sleep either, he can still (IMO) access his skinchanging powers and perhaps even weirnet (or at least he can communicate with a greenseer remotely)... he's the perfect dude to strike out into the cold dead lands and confront the Others. And I belive that's what the deal was with the Last Hero's twelve "dead" companions - they were all Coldhands wights. Perfectly equipped to fight the Others. And it's likely they had to sacrifice themselves in order to achieve all of this. It's just the kind of horrible, macabre self-sacrifice that Martin seems to like. :devil:

I do have evidence and textual interpretations to support all of this, btw, it's not pure spitballing.

[Melifeather]

Well, the fact that we were told that it takes a little while for the skinchanger to merge with the animal familiar makes me think that if someone were to find a way to force the spirit - both animal and human, as they would be merging - out of the animal, and if one were to have a resurrected corpse handy, preferably that of the dead skinchanger, I imagine you might be able to move the merged soul back over to the human. We might have been given a clue about how force a soul out of an animal when Mel burned the eagle the Varamyr was skinchanging out of the sky. I predict that Ghost's wolf body will have to be sacrificed, and the merged JonGhost soul will be forced back into resurrected Jon's body. 

The whole point of this, I belive, is to create people who can fight the Others. Think about Coldhands - he doesn't need to eat, he's impervious to cold, he probably doesn't sleep either, he can still (IMO) access his skinchanging powers and perhaps even weirnet (or at least he can communicate with a greenseer remotely)... he's the perfect dude to strike out into the cold dead lands and confront the Others. And I belive that's what the deal was with the Last Hero's twelve "dead" companions - they were all Coldhands wights. Perfectly equipped to fight the Others. And it's likely they had to sacrifice themselves in order to achieve all of this. 

I do have evidence and textual interpretations to support all of this, btw, it's not pure spitballing. :)

We've already seen what fire magic can do with regards to resurrecting. First we had Beric Dondarrion, then Catelyn. I guess I was just expecting Melisandre to resurrect Jon in the same manner.

 

[Lady Dyanna]

Here's something to help out. I looked up some things regarding the similarities between the Jedi and the Watch. Here's the Watch's Creed along with corresponding pieces from the Jedi tenets:

Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.

I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children.

A Jedi must not, however, explore the realm of marriage. To love another is dangerous yet acceptable if treated with care, but attaching oneself to another life in the bonds of matrimony cannot be allowed.

I shall wear no crowns and win no glory.

Ruling power and financial wealth are not permitted for a Jedi...A Jedi does not fight for adventure or glory. A Jedi fights for the survival of civilization and the survival of the people within it.

I shall live and die at my post.

All Jedi are to respect the decisions of the Jedi High Council... Centralized leadership is important, and this council... was chosen... to make these decisions for the Order. Jedi may disagree with the High Council but they must never openly oppose it.

I am the sword in the darkness. I am the watcher on the walls. I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realms of men.

Jedi are the guardians of peace, justice, and order in the galaxy... When the galaxy is split, a Jedi will side with the Republic, even if there are disagreements with the Republic’s leadership, as we defend the people of the Republic. To rebel against this tenet is to create disorder and chaos...A Jedi is to protect the weak and defenseless.

I pledge my life and honor to the Night's Watch, for this night and all the nights to come.

A Jedi must put the need of the community over the needs of individuals...Your importance lies in your devotion...

A lot of intriguing similarities. Something else that is kind of amazing is that the birth of the modern Jedi Order began with a conflict about political corruption within the original order. A Jedi founded a monastery amongst an alien race, intermingling with them and training them in the Force. It was in conflict with that monastery when the order was split. Sounds an awful lot like a parallel to the Night's King. The icing on the cake, though? The person who founded that monastery to cause the split was Matthew Skywalker...a possible descendant of Anakin in the same way that the Night's King is a possible ancestor of Jon Snow. 

Thanks for sharing! This is great stuff. I hope you don't mind that I saved this and your previous post to refer back to. I'm actually thinking that you're a lot further down the research path than I am. I'm familiar with the movies but not as much with all of the peripheral works. I've been trying to focus on any possible impact or carry over into Jon's parentage.