Jon will be Cold Practicality. Daenerys will be Fiery Idealism

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

I think it’s clear they are on a crash course with one another. They WILL interact in some form with each other. There are far too many parallels between the 2 for it not to happen.

Jon will be resurrected somehow in the next 2 books. But his death will likely scar him emotionally and spiritually. He’ll come back harder, less forgiving, and more ruthless. He’ll return a Stark of old, not of Ned’s teachings. 
 

Daenerys on the other hand will embrace her heritage. I don’t see how her story can end well in Essos in time for her to get to Westeros without abandoning Slaver’s Bay. UNLESS, she wreaks Fire & Blood on the Slavers. She’ll do as Quaithe suggests and wreak Fire & blood on them. Crippling the Spaver class as a whole. I also reckon she’ll deal with the Dothraki in one way or another, so the main procurers of slaves will be taken care of. She’ll head to Westeros and to her destiny. 
 

I don’t think she is destined for the throne, I think she’ll quickly find out about the Others and head to the fight. Where she’ll play a major if not central role in their defeat. But the song of Ice is of the Others, and Fire is Daenerys and her dragons. Both will be threats to Westeros and the world. In different ways.

The Others are outsiders, and existential threat. They are death. Their motives are unknown and will possibly never be knowable. Daenerys will be an internal threat. She is life, and with her passion, love, and idealism she’ll burn out of control. Fire consumes, but Ice preserves. 
 

I think after the Others are defeated Daenerys’ idealism will fall on Westeros. I think it’ll be resisted by just about everyone, she’ll burn it all to set things right as she sees it. Whereas Ice cold practicality will come to preserve the realm.

[Hippocras]

Trying to predict the whole next 2 books in 1 post is pretty ambitious! Still, I like your title. Makes some sense.

I do agree Dany is all hot idealism, and rage when confronted with different objectives. I also tend to agree she is going to do some burning and pillaging on her way West. I am not convinced she will limit herself to Slavers' Bay either. I think in the end the finale she had in the show will not be all that different from what will come in the books, it is simply that it will feel more earned. Watching the ugly side of her idealism as she makes her way through Essos is a big part of HOW it will feel more earned - though of course, up until the end we will still feel like we understand her reasons because she will be burning awful people.

Coldly pragmatic Jon? Maybe. Not as sure about that part of your arc prediction. Jon, in the end is not JUST ice and cold after all. He is both. Maybe the cold pragmatist is not actually him.

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

2 hours ago, Hippocras said:

Trying to predict the whole next 2 books in 1 post is pretty ambitious! Still, I like your title. Makes some sense.

I do agree Dany is all hot idealism, and rage when confronted with different objectives. I also tend to agree she is going to do some burning and pillaging on her way West. I am not convinced she will limit herself to Slavers' Bay either. I think in the end the finale she had in the show will not be all that different from what will come in the books, it is simply that it will feel more earned. Watching the ugly side of her idealism as she makes her way through Essos is a big part of HOW it will feel more earned - though of course, up until the end we will still feel like we understand her reasons because she will be burning awful people.

Coldly pragmatic Jon? Maybe. Not as sure about that part of your arc prediction. Jon, in the end is not JUST ice and cold after all. He is both. Maybe the cold pragmatist is not actually him.

Jon I where I feel I’m reaching the most.

We really don’t know how he’ll react to dying and resurrecting. All we have to go on is Beric and Lady Stoneheart. And Jon’s demise was just as traumatic as their’s. Well, maybe not Lady Stoneheart’s, but the point is he will be traumatized by it. The only question is how will he respond to said trauma?

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

2 hours ago, Hippocras said:

Trying to predict the whole next 2 books in 1 post is pretty ambitious! Still, I like your title. Makes some sense.

I do agree Dany is all hot idealism, and rage when confronted with different objectives. I also tend to agree she is going to do some burning and pillaging on her way West. I am not convinced she will limit herself to Slavers' Bay either. I think in the end the finale she had in the show will not be all that different from what will come in the books, it is simply that it will feel more earned. Watching the ugly side of her idealism as she makes her way through Essos is a big part of HOW it will feel more earned - though of course, up until the end we will still feel like we understand her reasons because she will be burning awful people.

Coldly pragmatic Jon? Maybe. Not as sure about that part of your arc prediction. Jon, in the end is not JUST ice and cold after all. He is both. Maybe the cold pragmatist is not actually him.

On Daenerys and the “Meereenes Knot”. I think it’s an apt name for Daenerys’ plot. Comparing it to the Gordian Knot legend, she is clearly the Alexander the Great figure in the story. She has tried and tried to undue the knot through politics and negotiation. Whereas Quaithe has told her she needs to return to her roots. “Fire & Blood”, be like Alexander, and cut through the Knot, and it’ll be undone.

[Hippocras]

1 hour ago, Lady Stonehearts Simp said:

Jon I where I feel I’m reaching the most.

We really don’t know how he’ll react to dying and resurrecting. All we have to go on is Beric and Lady Stoneheart. And Jon’s demise was just as traumatic as their’s. Well, maybe not Lady Stoneheart’s, but the point is he will be traumatized by it. The only question is how will he respond to said trauma?

We know he will be changed somewhat, yes. However the key difference between him and both Beric and Lady Stoneheart is that he seems likely to warg into Ghost (or VERY long shot: Rhaegal) while his body goes dead for a bit. Which means he won't be as fully "dead" as they were before fire brought them back, but also means he will be taking on some more wolfish (or dragonish) characteristics. Having the "wolf blood" is another way of saying impulsive and impetuous in Ned speak, so that seems unlikely to make him coldly pragmatic. 

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

10 minutes ago, Hippocras said:

We know he will be changed somewhat, yes. However the key difference between him and both Beric and Lady Stoneheart is that he seems likely to warg into Ghost (or VERY long shot: Rhaegal) while his body goes dead for a bit. Which means he won't be as fully "dead" as they were before fire brought them back, but also means he will be taking on some more wolfish (or dragonish) characteristics. Having the "wolf blood" is another way of saying impulsive and impetuous in Ned speak, so that seems unlikely to make him coldly pragmatic. 

The process of how he died will traumatize him IMO. He was betrayed by his brothers. 

[Corvo the Crow]

On 6/5/2023 at 4:18 AM, Lady Stonehearts Simp said:

I think it’s clear they are on a crash course with one another. They WILL interact in some form with each other. There are far too many parallels between the 2 for it not to happen.

Jon will be resurrected somehow in the next 2 books. But his death will likely scar him emotionally and spiritually. He’ll come back harder, less forgiving, and more ruthless. He’ll return a Stark of old, not of Ned’s teachings. 
 

Daenerys on the other hand will embrace her heritage. I don’t see how her story can end well in Essos in time for her to get to Westeros without abandoning Slaver’s Bay. UNLESS, she wreaks Fire & Blood on the Slavers. She’ll do as Quaithe suggests and wreak Fire & blood on them. Crippling the Spaver class as a whole. I also reckon she’ll deal with the Dothraki in one way or another, so the main procurers of slaves will be taken care of. She’ll head to Westeros and to her destiny. 
 

I don’t think she is destined for the throne, I think she’ll quickly find out about the Others and head to the fight. Where she’ll play a major if not central role in their defeat. But the song of Ice is of the Others, and Fire is Daenerys and her dragons. Both will be threats to Westeros and the world. In different ways.

The Others are outsiders, and existential threat. They are death. Their motives are unknown and will possibly never be knowable. Daenerys will be an internal threat. She is life, and with her passion, love, and idealism she’ll burn out of control. Fire consumes, but Ice preserves. 
 

I think after the Others are defeated Daenerys’ idealism will fall on Westeros. I think it’ll be resisted by just about everyone, she’ll burn it all to set things right as she sees it. Whereas Ice cold practicality will come to preserve the realm.

Between those two, Jon who risks lives for the Hardhome wildlings who are practically already dead is far more idealistic than Dany who betrays even her own rules.

I'd have given the long list but I'm both tired of giving it numerous times already and can't recall it all and won't bother looking into my old post, her allowing slavery is evidence enough so I'll leave it at that. 

So adding their personalities, Jon is a cold idealist and Dany is a fiery practical.

[Quoth the raven,]

Daenerys is the more pragmatic.  She tried to compromise with the slave masters to buy peace in Meereen even when she disliked them.  That's pragmatism and it is what a very smart, caring ruler does for her subjects.  Give peace a try and if the Harpy fails to carry their end then it will be time to rain fire on their Ghiscari asses.  Daenerys made a good command call when she chose to risk Belwas instead of Ser Barristan against Oznak.  She knew which man had more value to her objectives. 

Jon was too emotional and let his feelings for Arya carry him into the most terrible decisions a lord commander can do.  There is no pragmatism, no smarts, in Jon Snow.  He was a good friend to the young recruits but beyond that he had little in the way of leadership qualities.  Jon is a lone operator who doesn't fit in.  He, like Ghost, are outcasts.  Ghost was found away from the other wolves.