Comics, Graphic Novels and Manga

[Max the Mostly Mediocre]

Just to know, do you remember the title of these stories?

Sky Doll (ended up deleting it after twelve pages; the sense of humor didn't work for me), Ythaq: The Forsaken World, and Universal War One (most misleading title ever).

[Errant Bard]

Sky Doll (ended up deleting it after twelve pages; the sense of humor didn't work for me), Ythaq: The Forsaken World, and Universal War One (most misleading title ever).

I see, thanks.

Sky Doll apparently pulls people because of its art, I'm slightly puzzled about what you mean about sense of humour since as far as I remember it's not written to be humorous, or only incidentally, but then again I've read the three volumes and don't remember the start exactly. I never liked it enough to buy, this being said, and would agree with the opinion that it is a mediocre BD.

Ythaq is representative of the cookie-cutter look of Soleil's stories, both in art and writing, I think. Feels like a poor knock-off of Aquablue and doesn't even have the charm of a Lanfeust de Troy (which isn't really the best itself, even though it's a big hit)

Universal War One, once again, I agree with you is not that good. I thought it had some potential, but overall it seemed to try too hard to be gritty and dark and all. For a comic book reader, it also probably feels a bit, I don't know, hollow, empty? Can't really put my finger on it but it lacked something. For good space-opera, L'Incal or La Caste des Meta-Barons are better choices, or off the top of my head, Valerian or Sillage for a really commercial one that could be sold over there, or Le Vagabond des Limbes for a fucking fun retro romp (if it feels dated, it's on purpose, though).

All this is a bit derivative and unoriginal (compared to mainstream comic/manga fare), though, for something different, you could look in the direction of things like De Cape et de Crocs, or Larcenet's Le Combat Ordinaire or Satrapi's Persepolis... Though I guess those three rely heavily on cultural knowledge, or Les passagers du vent for nice grit, or La Nef des Fous or Philémon for something a bit more oniric. Speaking of that, whatever you do, read some Enki Bilal, you may not like it but try, I love his way to make poesy and fantastic from social commentary. And Gotlib, and Hugo Pratt.

ETA: Having said that, you shouldn't expect masterpieces, especially from Soleil. The ratio crap to masterpiece in BD would be the same as for any medium, so for any Gene Wolfe you have one hundred Eddings, and the Eddings will be what's translated first.

Heh, look at this small scale poll: http://www.20minutes-listes.fr/listes-les-...dessin%E9es-197 -not a single Soleil book, and it is because they suck- people won't even think about them.

ETA2: Sobering up, I realize most of what I mention must not be translated. Damn :(

[Max the Mostly Mediocre]

First few pages of Sky Doll are up here, and...well, if the creators aren't trying to be funny, then I have no idea what they're going for.

And yeah, most of what you mention isn't translated. But I think Meta Barons has been; I know I've seen discussion of it on an English-language comic blog. I'll look into that one. Persepolis certainly has been as well, and is something I've been meaning to get to for a while now.

[Errant Bard]

First few pages of Sky Doll are up here, and...well, if the creators aren't trying to be funny, then I have no idea what they're going for.

That's kinda the point. Sky Doll, from there, dwells on religion, freedom and meaning of "self"... All with flashy colours and in an over-the-top futuristic Blade-runner like society. There is certainly some humour, but that's not the point, in fact it's kinda opposite to the point: what is significant for the rest of the story is that the girl is a slave and is "pure" and naive. Part of the success of this BD, I think, comes from the contrast between the really dark and non-humorous story (at all) and the clownish drawings and colours. Or Maybe I just cannot see the humour and it's why I could never truly warm up to it.

[Max the Mostly Mediocre]

Ah. Okay. My assessment of the comic was that it wasn't funny and that, failing that, it had nothing else to recommend it (when I encounter fiction with that kind of wtfery, I'm conditioned to expect it to be amusing). On the one hand, a dozen pages or so is probably a little early to say 'no dramatic potential, fuck it'. On the other hand, a dozen pages in comic land is actually somewhat substantial.

[Errant Bard]

True enough, there is a substantial difference in rhythm in general between BD and comics. On the other hand, what always struck me in the first comics I read was that anything that was happening was not truly important or holding much meaning, even if it felt substantial, kinda like a blockbuster with big explosions versus an Eurocommie film à la Almodovar. Probably just a difference in style to get used to, I suppose it's inherent to the format they are published in: when you publish really short stories in small books, and have to hook your reader, you don't have time to dick around and develop as if you had 50-ish A4 pages. Comics rhythm is probably more similar to mangas, even if past that they don't focus on the same things (continuity and story for mangas, and characters for comics. For good cause since the comics world is so irrelevant as to be constantly resetable and retconnable)

[Galactus]

Agree that the rhytm is very different. Something like Compagnons de Crepuschule (which I probably misspelled like nobody's business) has a totally different structure and "way of working" than an american comic-book.

[Calibandar]

I've picked up All-Star Superman by Grant Morrisin & Frank Quitely. Superb, best Superman comic I recall in recent years. Does anyone know of other good recent Batman or Superman titles?

[Max the Mostly Mediocre]

Well, Morrison has been writing Batman for a while now, and though there's some disagreement about how awesome his Batman run was (didn't really work for me, but whatever), pretty much everyone seems to like Batman and Robin.

[Calibandar]

I've seen that one, but I am waiting for the collection which is due in April. Gotham Sirens also looks nice, comes out simultaneously.

I've also picked up Thor vol. 2 by Straczynski, The Goon series by Powell, and for a change of pace, Shortcomings by Tomine and Blankets by Thompson.

Oh and Eric Shanower has a very nice looking "Americana" adaptation of the Wizard of Oz out now which is quite popular, I picked that up as a collection as well.

I note Fall of Gilead comes out in March.

[Calibandar]

I'd like to recommend Blacksad, which is now out in a lovely hardcover omnibus edition. Stunning art and a fun stioryline about an anthromorphic detective. Check it out here:

http://www.amazon.com/Blacksad-Juan-Diaz-Canales/dp/159582393X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1276959062&sr=1-1

[Isabel]

For Manga if you like humor I would suggest One Piece ;)

Yes, the art is a little bit childish, but it's a fantastic story and very well planned and very funny!

[kuroishi]

I'd like to recommend Blacksad, which is now out in a lovely hardcover omnibus edition. Stunning art and a fun stioryline about an anthromorphic detective. Check it out here:

http://www.amazon.co...76959062&sr=1-1

I approve !

[Garlan the Gallant]

I am not sure if anyone is into literary graphic novels, but here is what I suggest:

Box Office Poison by Alex Robinson

Tricked by Alex Robinson

Too Cool to be Forgotten by Alex Robinson

Essex County by Jeff Lemire

From Hell by Alan Moore

V For Vendetta by Alan Moore

Alec: The Years Have Pants by Eddie Campbell

A Drifting Life by Yoshihiro Tatsumi

Asterious Polyp *cannot recommend this enough* by David Mazzucchelli

Bottomless Belly Button by Dash Shaw

Blankets by Craig Thompson

Jimmy Corrigan: The Smartest Kid on Earth by Chris Ware

Ghost World by Daniel Clowes

George Sprott by Seth

Almost Silent by Jason

Zot! by Scott McCloud

Market Day by James Sturm

Fun Home by Alison Bechdel

Shortcomings by Adrian Tomine

Driven by Lemons by Joshua Cotter

Kafka by R Crumb

[Calibandar]

From that list I own :

Complete Essex County ( a favorite)

Blankets ( also very good)

From Hell ( not read yet)

Shortcomings ( well written but too short)

I've considered Asterios Polyp before, could you elaborate on why you think that is such a good one?

Market Day by Sturm, Kafka by Crumb, Almost Silent by Jason are 3 more where I would love to get some thoughts on if you wouldn't mind?

[Darkness]

Manga: Gantz, Naruto, Bleach, One Piece, Fairy Tail, The World God Only Knows

Comic: Astro City, Hellboy, Locke & Key, Irredeemable, Incorruptible, Invincible, Wasteland

These are some of the best Comic and Manga.

[Garlan the Gallant]

From that list I own :

Complete Essex County ( a favorite)

Blankets ( also very good)

From Hell ( not read yet)

Shortcomings ( well written but too short)

I've considered Asterios Polyp before, could you elaborate on why you think that is such a good one?

Market Day by Sturm, Kafka by Crumb, Almost Silent by Jason are 3 more where I would love to get some thoughts on if you wouldn't mind?

Well if your into literary comics let me elaborate on them for you.

Asterious Polyp is by far the best comic book/graphic novel to have come out in 2009. David's art is amazing and his skill in telling a story via sequential art is bar none the best. Its hard to go into a review of the book without pointing to a scene in the book and saying *that* you see *that*, thats an amazing piece of story. The book tells a story of a man on the brink of change. The man is Asterious Polyp and he has seen his life deteriorate into something that he no longer enjoys. Something happens and it finally sets him down the road of change - of changing into a better person. The story is touching and though it may sound cliche by how I described it, I have over simplified it to not spoil anything. Its a touching story with amazing and unique art (the layouts and use of the same few colors are amazing).

Market Day is Sturm's best work. I think Sturm is at his best when he tells stories regarding small Jewish tales. This is one of those. It tells a story about a Jewish man who lives in a schtetl. The man is soon to be a father and has just lost his last client for his business. Its basically a story of struggle to provide for his family when he can no longer do so. Its a touching and gripping story. Unlike Polyp it is bitter sweet but still very good.

R Crumb is pretty unique, though I've always thought he was a better artist then a storyteller. Kafka, in my opinion, is his best work. It tells the story of Kafka's life and about how his experiences directly effected his writing. The art is very Crumb-like and is a very very literary comix.

Almost Silent is, like most of Jason's books, almost silent. Jason is known for his sparse dialogue; however, almost silent, unlike the rest of Jason's books, is a much more lengthy graphic novel. The problem I have with most of Jason's books is they are much more graphic novella's then graphic novels. I seem to never get attached to his characters and stories because I know that in a few pages the book will end. Almost Silent doesnt have that problem and it shows that Jason is a really great talent.

I see that you did not ask to hear more about Alex Robinson's works. This is surprising as I, and many others, think of him as the Alan Moore of underground comics. Box Office Poison is like the Watchmen of comix - its the most widely sold and the most respected. He, like Mazzacchelli and Lemire, does the whole book. Box Office Poison follows a small group of friends struggling with life, relationships, their jobs, and themselves. It is a gripping tale that truly effected me when I read the book....I might have shed a man tear or two. Tricked is another graphic novel by Robinson that tells about a group of people that seemingly have nothing to do with each other: a music star (kind of like John Lennon), a secretary, a sociopath who is a hardcore music fan, a sports con artist, two restaurant owners, and a teenage girl looking for her father. However, as the book reaches its climax all the characters come together for a smashing finale that leads you to see that the story was told perfectly. Too Cool to be Forgotten is about a man who has tried everything to try and quit smoking. He is desperate and has found his way to his last resort. His encounter with this last resort leads him to find his way back to high school reliving the days that he always wished he could change. All three are great, great books. I could not recommend them enough.

Bottomless Belly Button is also a wonderful graphic novel. It tells a story about a family whose parents are getting divorced after 40 years of marriage. The only thing that I have noticed about this book is that it might hit too close to home if your parents, or you yourself, are divorced. It shows how everyone is affected differently by this ordeal. Its uh...not such a happy book, still though it is an extraordinary book. I highly recommend it.

One last thing: most comic book stores will not be selling these books because they make their bread and butter off of supes and tights. You will probably have to track them down on Amazon or some similar website. Seriously though Calibandar, check these out.

[Calibandar]

Thanks, I'll be checking these out on Amazon anyway. I find these sort of comics are a nice interchange from the other comics I read ( I don't read much superheroes stuff anyway, with the exception of the All-Star Superman series by Morrison, JMS Thor series and the Astonishing X-men series).

[Stego]

I've considered Asterios Polyp before, could you elaborate on why you think that is such a good one?

It made me hurt like after a bad breakup.

[Garlan the Gallant]

Thanks, I'll be checking these out on Amazon anyway. I find these sort of comics are a nice interchange from the other comics I read ( I don't read much superheroes stuff anyway, with the exception of the All-Star Superman series by Morrison, JMS Thor series and the Astonishing X-men series).

There is some good superhero stuff out there, but its few and far between (and most likely you have read the following):

Powers by Brian Michael Bendis

Ex Machina by Brian K Vaughan

The Escapists by Brian K Vaughan

Sleeper by Ed Brubaker

Gotham Central by Ed Brubaker and Greg Rucka

Freakangels by Warren Ellis

45 by Andi Ewington

Promethea by Alan Moore

Top 10 by Alan Moore

Saga of the Swamp Thing by Alan Moore

Rising Stars by JMS

Supreme Power by JMS

The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen by Alan Moore

Watchmen by Alan Moore

Punisher MAX by Garth Ennis

Irredeemable Ant-Man by Robert Kirkman

Planetary by Warren Ellis (my favorite)

Seven Soldiers of Victory by Grant Morrison

NEXTWAVE by Warren Ellis

DV8: Gods and Monsters by Brian Wood

Demo by Brian Wood

No Hero by Warren Ellis

Black Summer by Warren Ellis

Miracleman by Alan Moore and Neil Gaiman

A God Somewhere by John Arcudi

The Winter Men by Brett Lewis

Omega the Unknown by Jonathen Lethem (can not recommend this enough)

I Shall Destroy All Civilized Planets by Fletcher Hanks

You Shall Die By Your Own Evil Creation by Fletcher Hanks

Transhuman by Jonathan Hickman

I saw that you like Blacksad (I picked up the hardcover also), so for you crime/noir tastes, heres the following:

City of Glass adapted by Paul Karasik and art by David Mazzucchelli

Parker: The Hunter adapted by Darwyn Cooke

Torpedo by Enrique Sanchez Abuli (should really hit that Blacksad niche)

The Killer by Matz

Exit Wounds by Rutu Modan

Grandville by Bryan Talbot (same as Torpedo)

Fell by Warren Ellis

Kickback by David Lloyd

Scene of the Crime: A Little Piece of Goodnight by Ed Brubaker

Incognegro by Mat Johnson

The Nightly News by Jonathan Hickman

Filthy Rich by Brian Azzarello

Stray Bullets by David Lapham

Moving Pictures by Kathryn Immonen

Queen and Country by Greg Rucka

Whiteout by Greg Rucka

Stumptown by Greg Rucka

Gotham Central, Powers, and Sleeper can double

Also, I can't believe to mention Crecy by Warren Ellis on my literary list. Woops.

Also, if you liked JMS's Thor, be sure to check out his upcoming runs on Superman and Wonder Woman. DC promises not to mess with his runs like Marvel did with Thor. Its a shame about The Twelve though. Superman is about him walking across the united states without using his powers (might be a little too reminiscent of midnight nation). I think that in Wonder Woman he's destroying Themyscira and making Wonder Woman one of the last surviving Amazons. Also, it should be noted that Wonder Woman and Superman will not be appearing outside of JMS's books while he is writing them.