Villemo Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 There is that scene in GOT where he says to Tyrion that he never took him for a hunter and Tyrion says he is the greatest in the land and his spear never misses. Sandor says it's not hunting if you pay for it. I always wondered if that scene had more of a backstory to it than Sandor just being disgusted by Tyrion's privilegedness. AFAIR these scene was only in TV series. In books Tyrion - in my opinion - respects Sandor, but Sandor hmmm... dislike (or maybe 'hate') Tyrion. Why? I don't know, in my eyes they are similar: both ironic, both ignore what other think about them, both have a difficult childhood, both are hmmm... not so handome. IMO they can be a good friends, they understand each other :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 I'm torn, because part of me would like to see her develop it but on the other hand I think the strength of Sansa's character is the realism of her. Warging is not realistic, and if Sansa were to begin to strengthen and develop the ability I can't help but think that it would massively change the tone of her chapters. Never thought I'd see Sansa and the words realism side by side, Alexia :lol: But I guess you mean she's the one portrayed most realistically? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OwnsARiver Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Does not compute. How much of the attraction to Sandor Clegane is from the impulse to 'fix' him? That's got to be part of it for some of you, right? My patron saint sexual fixation is with Theon. I've never wanted to change him. The Hound never did it for me. Oh, i like him a lot. But I like him more as a daddy figure. I like him best paired with Arya, not Sansa. I mean, I love sexual tension as much as the next girl. But. Doesnt he spank her? Also, he's one of the types of characters that when I imagine him, I imagine he smells like sweat and horse.And I dont even want to think about his thickly veined penis. You know it is. And probably severely crooked. :lmao: Ha ha ha ha!! You will bring Theon and I will bring Sandor (if the Sisterhood Schedule allows me...) to a double date! Then you will happily take his gloves off and pat his hair, and I will teach Sandor to bath :wideeyed: No seriously, I think you either like the guy or not at all.... Seeing the heated discussions on SanSan threads for instans.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Hi!I have laught my head off trough all your magnificent Sandor threads, a bit late to participate alas... But now I`m finally going to join in, in my first post, on my first thread, in my first forum EVER, because of this BRILLIANT theme! Please let me join the Sandor Sisterhood, I will do the full list of Ice Crow + add only sexual fantasies of Sandor for a month... :blushing: I know lots of stuff have been discussed before, but thanks to the sisters(and lonely guys) who still give their opinions on still living arguments. Like the fuck her bloody/rip her hart out being him trying to make Arya give him the gift of mercy. But is it just me, or do you need to have a few years i your passport before you really get Sandor? I seems to me that the younger ones around me in RL, only sees the shallow side he presents to the world (but is breaking quite brutally apart before Q.I in my opinion...)? Oh...and please forgive me mistakes in spelling/grammar etc....not native english... Hello OwnsaRiver! :) Facey and Villemo have already welcomed you, but let me do the same now too! Entry into the Sisterhood is very easy, you only have to have an unabashed, intense love for everything to do with Sandor Clegane (and by extension Sansa Stark since she's the Hound's true love) ;) OOh, and since you seem to be familiar with us already, you'll know that this is our official emoticon, cause we're kinda outlaws on the forum: :smoking: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FacelessGirl Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Hey brash, I was wondering when you'd join the welcoming committee for our newest Sister. ;) I love how there is really smoke coming from the cigarette, lol: :smoking: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyDogIsNamedDanerys Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 I'm a woman who doesn't like Sandor. But he is totally a particular "type" that I know appeals to a lot of people, I think particularly women. Basically, he's the asshole on the outside who's really sensitive marshmallow inside (speaking of, does anyone weep more than Sandor Clegane in the books, male or female?), and who needs you (Avatar'd by Sansa) to mend his poor, broken soul. Further, he pretends to be the baddest of the bad asses but actually has a protective/kindly nature. Anyway he's not my type at all but he was clearly written by GRRM to match this type and I think quite successfully... maybe a little too successfully because he really seems to follow the trope quite closely, unlike other characters who invert or challenge the fantasy type they embody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QueenNymeria Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Also, he's one of the types of characters that when I imagine him, I imagine he smells like sweat and horse.And I dont even want to think about his thickly veined penis. You know it is. And probably severely crooked. Sandor Clegane anagrams into Carnal God Seen. It is known :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OwnsARiver Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Hello OwnsaRiver! Facey and Villemo have already welcomed you, but let me do the same now too! Entry into the Sisterhood is very easy, you only have to have an unabashed, intense love for everything to do with Sandor Clegane (and by extension Sansa Stark since she's the Hound's true love) OOh, and since you seem to be familiar with us already, you'll know that this is our official emoticon, cause we're kinda outlaws on the forum: Thank you!! I fullfill the requirements then!! :smoking: I hope for all I`m worth that we will see Sansa develop into a woman with stamina, political and personal skill and wisdom -and lots of guts. So Sandor may show up somewhere (loving his LB, raging at all others) and they can be a dream team -at least for a while :D ...looking miserable at my ADWD book..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OwnsARiver Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Sandor Clegane anagrams into Carnal God Seen. It is known It is known! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Thank you!! I fullfill the requirements then!! :smoking: I hope for all I`m worth that we will see Sansa develop into a woman with stamina, political and personal skill and wisdom -and lots of guts. So Sandor may show up somewhere (loving his LB, raging at all others) and they can be a dream team -at least for a while :D ...looking miserable at my ADWD book..... Let's not forget she's gonna need some sexual stamina to keep up with him too! Thank god the Vale stocked up on their food stores. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Many and More Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Much more pleasant bloat that actually furthers main character development (and probably the plot) then some we've seen recently, alas. ;) You're not wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 One of the principle reasons I joined this forum was to see if the public's opinions reflected my own. Having read 4 books at that time, I wanted an introspective into several of my favorite characters, the lion's share (or mastiff's share, in this case) being my interest in the Hound. I expected to be a great outlier because I figured that the reasons I like the Hound (brutal honesty, incredible strength, supreme confidence without arrogance, lack of political ambition) would not have a broad appeal. What shocked me was not only that Sandor is popular (he is probably the most discussed character in the books, judging by threads like Sandor 362) but that his appeal reaches women in a large volume. I will make a fair generalization here: the women who read this forum are not the cheerleader popular girls of our high school years. I would guess the demographics of women here are a mix of professionals, emo and avante garde urbanites. What makes that interesting to me is that I can understand the shy, introvertive and introspective girl liking a man who has emotional scars; it is my belief that women who feel neglected or overlooked yearn for a man who they can heal or resuscitate. What amazed me, however, was that Sandor, while being "damaged", for lack of a better term, was also a irreverent tough guy. He appeals to my intellectual side because he is extremely perceptive, especially about the harsh realities of life and the hypocrisies of those around him. However, he also appeals to me because he likes to smash through strife, and lets his sword do his negotiating. He may not care much about life, but he will be damned before anyone takes it from him without a fight. My conclusion, and the topic I want to root up is why it is that Sandor, being all that he is, has appeal amongst men like myself and the women of this forum simultaneously. Your thread is like Xmas come early for me :) Ok, so you're exactly right. Sandor is very very popular with women, and we are intelligent, intellectual, career minded girls, definitely not the cheerleader type, (although there's nothing wrong with those) ;) As you noted above, Sandor is really just an all around great character, and for me he's the boyfriend I would never dare to have, but always secretly wanted. He's a realist, he doesn't want sympathy (but can't help but inspire it) he has no aspirations to be other than what he is and he's extremely perceptive of the ambitions and motives of others. Getting to the heart of why I love Sandor, it's because he's been so subtlely drawn by GRRM. You don't start out liking him, but in bits and pieces we learn his story, we see the interaction with Sansa etc, and suddenly it hits you that this man is really freaking cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OwnsARiver Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Let's not forget she's gonna need some sexual stamina to keep up with him too! Thank god the Vale stocked up on their food stores. Ha ha!! Yes, I imagine she will start out shyly, he will let her explore his body and her own sexuality (dumbfounded in a happy bliss, poor guy/lucky guy) -and then they will rise to greatness!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1234567 Posted September 26, 2011 Author Share Posted September 26, 2011 AFAIR these scene was only in TV series. In books Tyrion - in my opinion - respects Sandor, but Sandor hmmm... dislike (or maybe 'hate') Tyrion. Why? I don't know, in my eyes they are similar: both ironic, both ignore what other think about them, both have a difficult childhood, both are hmmm... not so handome. IMO they can be a good friends, they understand each other :) Ouch! I missed that that was only in the TV series. Not good, I'm mixing the two up! There must be something more to Sandor hating Tyrion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 I'm a woman who doesn't like Sandor. But he is totally a particular "type" that I know appeals to a lot of people, I think particularly women. Basically, he's the asshole on the outside who's really sensitive marshmallow inside (speaking of, does anyone weep more than Sandor Clegane in the books, male or female?), and who needs you (Avatar'd by Sansa) to mend his poor, broken soul. Further, he pretends to be the baddest of the bad asses but actually has a protective/kindly nature. Anyway he's not my type at all but he was clearly written by GRRM to match this type and I think quite successfully... maybe a little too successfully because he really seems to follow the trope quite closely, unlike other characters who invert or challenge the fantasy type they embody. Gross simplication Danerys. Yes, he does show a sensitive side, but I would argue that this isn't an example of the 'bad' man with a heart of gold. The brilliance of Sandor is that he doesn't really have a heart of gold, neither does he have the marshmellow insides. Look inside him and I think you'd find the same stone-cold demeanor that he projects to the outside world. However, what differentiates Sandor from men like Gregor or Tywin etc, is that his awareness of the bullshit of the world in general, both from the upper and lower levels of society means that he is less likely to prey on the weak or the vulnerable. And, the trauma that he suffered by Gregor's hands, his work for Joffrey and the Lannisters etc, taught him that kindness is not one of the common qualities that you find in Westeros. However, his relationship with Sansa has also had the effect of lessening some of that anger and hate, because she is genuinely of a different stock than what he is accustomed to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1234567 Posted September 26, 2011 Author Share Posted September 26, 2011 Your thread is like Xmas come early for me :) Ok, so you're exactly right. Sandor is very very popular with women, and we are intelligent, intellectual, career minded girls, definitely not the cheerleader type, (although there's nothing wrong with those) ;) As you noted above, Sandor is really just an all around great character, and for me he's the boyfriend I would never dare to have, but always secretly wanted. He's a realist, he doesn't want sympathy (but can't help but inspire it) he has no aspirations to be other than what he is and he's extremely perceptive of the ambitions and motives of others. Getting to the heart of why I love Sandor, it's because he's been so subtlely drawn by GRRM. You don't start out liking him, but in bits and pieces we learn his story, we see the interaction with Sansa etc, and suddenly it hits you that this man is really freaking cool. Well said! Sandor is exceptionally well drawn and I think part of that is that he is mentioned in various different POVs. Different facets of his character are brought out through Eddard, Davos, Tyrion and most importantly Sansa and Arya. In terms of his appeal, Brandycash summed it up nicely. Although if I do have to add anything it is that he has a touch of the Byronic Hero quality to him....which if you have been brought up on Jane Eyre, Wuthering Heights, Our Mutual Friend, Jamaica Inn etc is very much the sort of character who is portrayed as the desirable object. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 And you know what i was just thinking Rapsie, GRRM actually never "redeems" Sandor's character in the strict sense. We just learn more and more about him, and the reader likes him for him. Compare to this to Jaime, whom we learn had to rescue KL from mad Aerys and was always faithful to Cersei etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OwnsARiver Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Well said! Sandor is exceptionally well drawn and I think part of that is that he is mentioned in various different POVs. Different facets of his character are brought out through Eddard, Davos, Tyrion and most importantly Sansa and Arya. In terms of his appeal, Brandycash summed it up nicely. Although if I do have to add anything it is that he has a touch of the Byronic Hero quality to him....which if you have been brought up on Jane Eyre, Wuthering Heights, Our Mutual Friend, Jamaica Inn etc is very much the sort of character who is portrayed as the desirable object. I could not agree more with Bracshcandy and Rapsie. I think for me, it was the experience of slowly gaining respect and liking for the man, that amazed me when I started reading. How you starts out with a pice of shit, and then begins to puzzle together a person out of so many POVs. The fact that many of them refers to him with at least grudging respect too. And then you add all the physical qualities (including his scars -I like scars!), fighting skills, attitude and how vulnerable he turns out to be for his one crack in the wall (Sansa). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Did the mods just merge the "Broader appeal of Sandor" thread into this thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FacelessGirl Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Oh wow they did. Guess it makes sense though, we're still talking about the same person. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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