The Official Appreciation Thread for The Queen in the North, Sansa Stark

[ZacharyB]

Sansa seems to be a character that is a little bit polarizing. You either like her or you go around in your posts blabbering about how she's stupid and should have murdered Lysa for trying to murder her or something. Share your thoughts on Sansa, your feelings about her, evaluate her past actions, and discuss what you think of her future.

I really just wanted to be cool and join the appreciation thread fad.

Just kidding.

EDIT: And I might post my all caps run on sentence about what I really don't think of Sansa, as I have been doing in most of the other appreciation threads for their respective appreciated people. Maybe.

[Candor]

I like Sansa, she's pretty much my favorite female character. I will say though that I don't expect she'll be Queen In The North. I think that title will go back to be Lord/Lady of Winterfell and I expect Bran or Rickon to hold it, though she might regent for them.

Appreciation?

I sympathize with her hardships, as I know hwo it is to be used as a pawn in other people machinations... nothing as dire as her happenings but in todays world, not fun, to have my own Joffrey and feel helpless, and I admire her character arc in growing up as I find her to be letting her better traits flourish and becoming more self-aware.

[Zar Lannister]

OMG SANSA WHY DID YOU CHOSE JOFFREY OVER YOUR FAMILY THAT COST YOUR DAD HIS LIFE OMG ITS ALL YOUR FAULT EVEN THE OTHERS WAKING UP AND THE DRAGONS HATCHING TOO OMG OMG OMG :bang:

Sorry Zachary, it's payback time ;)

Sansa seems to be carry the banner of one of the recurring themes of the Saga: Life is not a Song. (Or at least, not a happy one).

To me, the one intriguing thing about Sansa is her ability to convince herself of things as she chooses to remember them. One of the first times she did it was when Joffrey forced her to look at the Spikes. Then there's also her interaction with the Hound, which she remembers more fondly than it really was. Self-Convenience?

Anyway, sweet Sansa Lannister has grown on me after her scheming lessons. I think she'll tie "The North Remembers" to "A Lannister Always Pays his Debts" and pull a fast one on LF once it is all discovered.

[The King in the South]

Queen in the North?

Try Queen of the Seven Kingdoms bro. It's gonna happen.

[ZacharyB]

I like Sansa, she's pretty much my favorite female character. I will say though that I don't expect she'll be Queen In The North. I think that title will go back to be Lord/Lady of Winterfell and I expect Bran or Rickon to hold it, though she might regent for them.

Appreciation?

I sympathize with her hardships, as I know hwo it is to be used as a pawn in other people machinations... nothing as dire as her happenings but in todays world, not fun, to have my own Joffrey and feel helpless, and I admire her character arc in growing up as I find her to be letting her better traits flourish and becoming more self-aware.

I'm really hoping Rickon or Jon don't get Winterfell in the end. Rickon because he's a boy of five and Jon...just too cliche. Bran would be okay (it is his technically) but I think he's going to become a tree. Sansa's the only viable option, with someone (most likely Harry the Heir in my dreams) as the King.

Also, be like Sansa and show that real life Joffrey who's boss. :3

OMG SANSA WHY DID YOU CHOSE JOFFREY OVER YOUR FAMILY THAT COST YOUR DAD HIS LIFE OMG ITS ALL YOUR FAULT EVEN THE OTHERS WAKING UP AND THE DRAGONS HATCHING TOO OMG OMG OMG :bang:

Sorry Zachary, it's payback time ;)

Sansa seems to be carry the banner of one of the recurring themes of the Saga: Life is not a Song. (Or at least, not a happy one).

To me, the one intriguing thing about Sansa is her ability to convince herself of things as she chooses to remember them. One of the first times she did it was when Joffrey forced her to look at the Spikes. Then there's also her interaction with the Hound, which she remembers more fondly than it really was. Self-Convenience?

Anyway, sweet Sansa Lannister has grown on me after her scheming lessons. I think she'll tie "The North Remembers" to "A Lannister Always Pays his Debts" and pull a fast one on LF once it is all discovered.

Oh, you have to go on for longer than that. And it has to eventually turn into incoherent rambling. For example.

SANSA IS A SPOILED BITCH RIGHT GUYS I MEAN REALLY SHE SELLS OUT HER DAD AND FOR WHAT RIGHT JUST TO GET ABUSED IN KINGS LANDING AND THEN GET MARRIED OFF TO TYRION I MEAN THAT GUY REALLY SHOULD NOT HAVE LUSTED OVER HER THAT'S JUST WRONG RIGHT HAHA ANYWAY SHE JUST COASTED ON THROUGH LIFE (NOT THAT THAT DOESN'T DIRECTLY CONTRADICT WHAT I JUST SAID OR ANYTHING) AND DIDN'T DO ANYTHING FOR HERSELF SHE JUST SAT THERE LIKE A PRAT I'M NOT EVEN SURE WHAT A PRAT IS BUT I DON'T SEE WHY PEOPLE LIKE HER SHE'S NO ARYA STARK.

Anyway, Sansa being the only character to ever really lie to herself without realizing in ASOIAF has always intrigued me. Also, kind of irrelevant, but my favorite scene in GoT (both the book and the TV series) is Sansa having to stare at the spikes. "How long do I have to look?" and "Maybe my brother will give me your head" are two of her best lines ever, and they're both on the same page. The last quote is worded differently in the show I think, but it's still bad ass.

Queen in the North?

Try Queen of the Seven Kingdoms bro. It's gonna happen.

If the Seven Kingdoms still stand at the end of the story, I approve of this notion. :)

[Candor]

No worries, I left my Joffrey far behind and he troubles me no more. :]

Hehe @ the rant. When people argue that Sansa had it easy, I just have to shake my head. No one in these stories has had it easy, and the thing is the bad things that have happened to them are not always comparable. The shit that's happened to Arya is different than what Sansa got as her lot. They both had a sucky few years.

If only Sansa could have gotten away with throwing Joff off that nice ledge right there....

[1234567]

I have to say I really like her character and think it is actually one of the most realistic in terms of actual human behaviour. She had no way of knowing what was going on in regards to the politics in KL and didn't know that her father was sending her back to Winterfell for her own good. Ned could have actually said a bit more to her about why they had to leave.

Anyway, I love the way her character has been shaped and how she has had to repress her self in order to survive. The icy and non emotional exterior she seems to have developed, actually seem to make her more like Ned (who also had to face family deaths and horror at a young age).

She has also still maintained her levels of compassion and I do hope she gets a sweet ending.

Anyway, sweet Sansa Lannister has grown on me after her scheming lessons. I think she'll tie "The North Remembers" to "A Lannister Always Pays his Debts" and pull a fast one on LF once it is all discovered.

Although the last thing I want to see is her end up with Tyrion (even if he some how becomes King and she's Queen!), I still have the fear that he'll be the bitter fate she has to endure in order to rebuild Wnterfell. Hopefully she'll give him a nice set of horns though and her kids can be someone elses. The point above about a Lannister always pays his Debts, is a good one though.

[Silmarien]

Sansa seems to be a character that is a little bit polarizing. You either like her or you go around in your posts blabbering about how she's stupid and should have murdered Lysa for trying to murder her or something. Share your thoughts on Sansa, your feelings about her, evaluate her past actions, and discuss what you think of her future.

I really just wanted to be cool and join the appreciation thread fad.

Just kidding.

EDIT: And I might post my all caps run on sentence about what I really don't think of Sansa, as I have been doing in most of the other appreciation threads for their respective appreciated people. Maybe.

I thought Sansa was a typical 11-12 year old girl with her head fill of dreams in AGoT. She was annoying sometimes, but damn, who isn't (esp at that age)? (Ned was annoying sometimes! Beloved characters are allowed to be annoying; elsewise, they would not be human).

It reminded me of myself around that age, tbh. Though Sansa's loss of innocence was far more traumatic and complete than mine. I quite like her character - it's refreshing, and a sign of her strong will, that she has maintained some of her innocence through the horrors she experienced (building the snow castle of Winterfell).

I hope she can break free of LF, and any other man marrying her for her claim and beauty, and not for HER INNATE SELF. Sansa deserves a man who loves her for who she is inside, not for how she looks, and not for her family inheritance. I hope she finds love with this guy (might be Sandor, I hope so...given that he's had some time for personal growth and maturity during their time apart).

[mor2]

Queen in the North?

Try Queen of the Seven Kingdoms bro. It's gonna happen.

not queen in the North, not in the seven Kingdoms nor in the south (thou I am sure you would like that ;) ).

It just seems that GRRM, spent to much time on placing Margaery on the throne, bringing the Tyrell to the game and now that Griffin has landed, Dorne is ready to move (and SAM in old town), it's very likelly we are going to see much more event in the south than the ravaged North and as far as POV's we have a full house.

so IMO, sansa as the queen of the seven kingdoms is just throwing to much players in to the same court, plus sansa crowned/deposed doesnt make such an interesting plot line, I am more inclined to think that LF will join with manderly and hope for something unexpected.

[Alexia]

Yay! Sansa Appreciation.... :cheers:

Sansa is my favorite character in ASOIAF. She has a great, well written, believable growth arc. Her interactions with various male characters are pretty interesting, especially with Sandor because of the turnaround it shows in her reactions to men. Joffrey was one of the most entertaining villains (RIP) and I loved every interaction she had with Cersei.

"Courtesy is a lady's armor."

Tyrion thought she would make a wonderful queen. I think that Sansa is going to be queen and that she will most likely become the queen who regained the North.

@ALLCAPS FAD: You people are spelling too well. You even have your apostrophes in and everything. Master the technique of illiteracy and you are one step closer.

[Erinne]

I love the Sansa, she's awesome. I like how she's managed to retain her kind and compassionate nature despite everything she's been through, and I hope she doesn't lose that even if she learns to play "the game". The series needs some fundamentally good people as much as it needs villains. I really want her to be the one to defeat Littlefinger, preferably after she learns how he betrayed her family - but that would be a bit too perfect so it probably won't happen :(. Also, I don't ship her with anyone.

[weirwood woman]

I didnt like Sansa at first but now I like where her character development has gone. Personally I think she can restore Winterfell (remember the accuracy of her snow castle) She will be saved by either Sandor and/or Brienne, reunited with the rest of the kids, gets to marry Aegon/ young Griff in a genuine love match and of course gets to bring LF down big time. Queen? maybe not. Definitely a Lady.

[Zar Lannister]

People shifting along morally grey lines is a recurrent theme in ASOIAF. I feel Sansa will gravitate into it as well. I'm led to think, however, that in most cases her actions will be morally justified. But, Martin did comment once that Sansa's memory lapse would become important much later. I would like to know if the way she remembers things will lead her to make decisions morally dubious in the eyes of the omnipresent reader.

[1234567]

People shifting along morally grey lines is a recurrent theme in ASOIAF. I feel Sansa will gravitate into it as well. I'm led to think, however, that in most cases her actions will be morally justified. But, Martin did comment once that Sansa's memory lapse would become important much later. I would like to know if the way she remembers things will lead her to make decisions morally dubious in the eyes of the omnipresent reader.

I actually wonder if she misremembered the whole fight between Arya and Joffery. When she says "I don't remember", it was four days after the fight, and given the shit storm and how scared she was, I think she may have genuinely got confused between the Arya's version of events, Joff's version of events and her own knowledge of what happened.

If anyone saw the Derren Brown thing they did on TV where they convinced that guy that he had murdered someone, I think it is very possible to see how someone can be confused by events around them and make them remember things differently.

[Alexia]

I would like to know if the way she remembers things will lead her to make decisions morally dubious in the eyes of the omnipresent reader.

Does she need her memory for that? For example, covering up Lysa's murder and helping to frame Marillion is morally dubious, but she did it any way to save her own life, because Lysa tried to kill her, because Marillion tried to rape her and was complicit in the attempt on her life, et cetera. Her memory didn't factor in.

Let's say that she becomes complicit in the plot to kill Sweetrobin. 1) He'll make a terrible and weak lord; 2) He's dying any way according to a host of characters; 3) The Vale army can give her back Winterfell and the North; 4) She's suffered a lot and wants to be safe, for that she needs a power base of her own, et cetera.

There are a lot of reasons where she might decide, not without regret, that killing Sweetrobin is justifiable. She doesn't need her memory. It is just like the situation with Lysa's murder, IMO.

[Trinuviel]

Nice to finally see a Sansa appreciation thread!

I've always found the venom thrown her way quite baffling as she has been put in horrible, helpless position throughout most of the books (But maybe that's why a lot of readers don't like her - it is not pleasant to read about victims).

I'm currently re-reading the series (have gotten about 200pp into ASoS) and I find her character arc very subtle and quite intriguing. Especially in book 3 where Martin several times reveals that she's gotten a lot more observant, self-reflective and careful (just read the scenes where she's comparing the innocence of the younger Tyrell girls with her own before the loss of her father). I also really like that she's been able to retain a fundamental sense of compassion despite all the trauma she's been trhough (this is one of the things that actually make me like her better than Arya, who seems set on a path where she might lose not only her identity but her basic humanity).

The "life is not a song" - theme is something that I actually think will be quite important in the series as a whole. During the re-read I've been noticing how Martin often uses songs and tales as devices of foreshadowing and parallels to the narrative. Life is certainly not a song, but life inspires songs, and songs and tales keep cultural memory alive (fx the tales of the Others - regarded as fairy tales but, as we have seen, they actually contain a kernel of thruth) -and most importantly songs, tales (and fiction of any kind) contain their own psychological thruth.

Since it's been mentioned so often in connection with Sansa, I feel that the story of Florian and Jonquil could turn out to become quite important. It is also one of the few songs/tales mentioned that Martin has withheld more information on. We don't know exactly what kind of story the ballad of Florian and Jonquil tells - and I think that is quite deliberate on the part of the author.

[Zar Lannister]

Does she need her memory for that? For example, covering up Lysa's murder and helping to frame Marillion is morally dubious, but she did it any way to save her own life, because Lysa tried to kill her, because Marillion tried to rape her and was complicit in the attempt on her life, etcetera. Her memory didn't factor in.

Well, Marillion's framing is one of the most recent cases of Sansa concealing the truth. But you well said it was in her self-preservation mode.

Going back to that scene: Lysa gave her juicy tidbits on the LF scheme to have Jon Arryn murdered. Yet somehow, Sansa's inner reactions to LF didn't change.

[mor2]

People shifting along morally grey lines is a recurrent theme in ASOIAF. I feel Sansa will gravitate into it as well. I'm led to think, however, that in most cases her actions will be morally justified. But, Martin did comment once that Sansa's memory lapse would become important much later. I would like to know if the way she remembers things will lead her to make decisions morally dubious in the eyes of the omnipresent reader.

that a nice way of saying she sees what she wants to see ;)

[mor2]

I didnt like Sansa at first but now I like where her character development has gone. Personally I think she can restore Winterfell (remember the accuracy of her snow castle) She will be saved by either Sandor and/or Brienne, reunited with the rest of the kids, gets to marry Aegon/ young Griff in a genuine love match and of course gets to bring LF down big time. Queen? maybe not. Definitely a Lady.

This is probably the happy ending for her, I just hope that doesnt happen, I'd rather see her in the North Struggling rather than playing second sit for LF or Aegon.

[brashcandy]

Going back to that scene: Lysa gave her juicy tidbits on the LF scheme to have Jon Arryn murdered. Yet somehow, Sansa's inner reactions to LF didn't change.

I think she has processed the information, but truly, Sansa was more afraid for her own life in that scene to pay due attention to what Lysa was ranting about. I think she knows perfectly well that LF is a dangerous man capable of really awful things, and that's why she's careful around him. At the same time, she is fascinated by his machinations, and how he is able to turn situations that appear hopeless to his advantage. Sansa understandably is attracted to this kind of power because it is precisely what she lacked in KL.