septa lemore is ashara dayne.

[Ran]

Lemore is educated, she's learned in the matters of the faith of the Seven, probably has read and studied The Seven Pointed Star, and knows about the symbolism behind the Seven.

You'd think Jon Connington would know as much, or even learned Haldon, if you want to look at it that way. No, Lemore is a specialist and knows more than Griff or Haldon, and so is better suited to teaching that topic than either of them.

It's possible Ashara Dayne was particularly well-learned in the Faith, but... I doubt it.

[RevengeOfTheStarks]

It's possible she really is a specialist, but I think it's equally possible that the division of labor in educating Aegon is mostly for efficiency. Connington is the leader of the entire operation and has bigger issues demanding his time. The half-maester is only half a master after all, perhaps his own education is lacking in some areas and Lemore can fill the holes.

If you look at it from the angle of Lemore actually being Ashara, the number of people in their party makes a little more sense. Aegon would be surrounded by Targ loyalists, all of whom may fulfill some political role once back in Westeros, like calling up their families and former alliances, and forging new ones. In this case, even if Lemore's didactic value is redundant, it gives her the appearance of having a certain role while everyone's still incognito.

[Jem]

It's possible she really is a specialist, but I think it's equally possible that the division of labor in educating Aegon is mostly for efficiency. Connington is the leader of the entire operation and has bigger issues demanding his time. The half-maester is only half a master after all, perhaps his own education is lacking in some areas and Lemore can fill the holes.

If you look at it from the angle of Lemore actually being Ashara, the number of people in their party makes a little more sense. Aegon would be surrounded by Targ loyalists, all of whom may fulfill some political role once back in Westeros, like calling up their families and former alliances, and forging new ones. In this case, even if Lemore's didactic value is redundant, it gives her the appearance of having a certain role while everyone's still incognito.

I agree. I think Ashara is there primarily as a Targ loyalist. She needs an under-cover role for being there; she can't be a warrior like Jon or a maester or even a half-maester, so she needs to be something. It isn't very dignified for a teenaged boy to be carting around a nanny or a nurse, so a Septa who is acting as a religious advisor is a better role for a woman in Aegon's party.

It's likely that Ashara was taught by a Septa herself when she was young, so all she would have to do is recall the lessons that her Septa taught her and pass them on to Aegon. She likely isn't an expert on The Seven's theology, but she would know enough. Certainly she knows more than Aegon, so that is enough to make her a teacher. I went to a Catholic school, and while I am nowhere near an expert on Catholic theology, I would probably know enough to pass on the basics of a Catholic education to someone who knew very little about it. Maybe I could even pass myself off as a nun if I needed to, especially if I was in a country where there were no, or very few, other Catholics who could call me out on it.

At the end of ADWD, when Aegon's party was in Westeros, Lemore seemed to be referred to as 'Lady' rather than 'Septa'. That would be a good idea if she isn't really a Septa because now that she is in Westeros she just might encounter a real Septa and blow her cover. Ashara really is a Westerosi lady, so if Lemore is Ashara she will know how to behave as a Westerosi lady should so she won't have to worry about making any wrong moves and blowing the 'Lady' cover.

[Revan Baratheon]

I always fantasize ashara as a real hot,saucey lackey..ill be pretty fucking dissapointed if this turns out to be true...it will totally ruin her image in my mind..(will make 20+ older)

So noooo! Let her be dead!!!!!

[7V3N]

bah! Everything is already discoverd lol!

Not true at all. I think I might actually be the first to propose the theory that the Dragon Horn is Lightbringer. Although it has little to no support, I believe it is possibility.

Keep thinking! Most theories start by someone making a huge stretch, then people start to add evidence. R+L=J is probably supported by 90% of fans, but I don't think the first guy who thought of it said, "Well obviously!"

[Bear Grylls of Skagos]

What if Septa Lemore is Lyanna and Ned buried some KGs bones in the Crypts . :D

[7V3N]

What if Septa Lemore is Lyanna and Ned buried some KGs bones in the Crypts . :D

Promise me Ned . . . that you won't bring me back to Westeros to the fat drunk Robert Baratheon.

[Peach Fuzz]

but why? i no Ser Arthur was a kinsgaurd but why would she help raise aegon living in exile no keep or title or lands? or maybe the why of it is still to come

[Eejit]

- will her identity be revealed to the reader only or will others in Westeros find out as well? Who else can identify her - Ser Barristan, Jaime, Cersei, Doran?

Many of the older generation of Westerosi nobility would have a good chance of identifying her, especially those present at Harrenhal or the Dornish.

[Serie]

but why? i no Ser Arthur was a kinsgaurd but why would she help raise aegon living in exile no keep or title or lands? or maybe the why of it is still to come

this. except if she wanted to piss off Ned for killing her brother and leaving her. that low. The more we discuss about it the less I think Ashara is Sepra Lemore.

[corbon]

but why? i no Ser Arthur was a kinsgaurd but why would she help raise aegon living in exile no keep or title or lands? or maybe the why of it is still to come

That's a serious question, really?

Ashara was his mother's handmaid.

For love. For friendship. For loyalty, for duty, for honour, for any number of reasons.

And she doesn't have keep, title or lands anyway. Those go to her and Arthur's older brother, Edric's father.

[Kell]

Honestly, all the arguments are great. And I could totally buy it.

Still I don't.

Because one more "resurrection" would be one too many. Damn, this is not A Song of Dead and Alive... At one point, we must stop thinking that no one is really dead in this book...

You know what, when I read Jon's death, I was almost not moved. Because I KNEW that he was (almost certainly) coming back. And when you start to feel that way... it's because the books are beginning to look too much like a D&D adventure game. "Who cares if X dies... we can raise him later anyway".

Maybe GRRM is aware of this feeling... and going to surprise us (please GRRM do not surprise us with Jon, I'm fine with him coming back from the dead as AA reborn).

[Faint]

I'm with Ran on this one. I'd like Lemore to be Ashara Dayne but there is simply no compelling evidence for that conjecture beyond her age being in the right range. Say what you want about Tyrion's capacity for observation but a failure to note "haunting violet eyes" is beyond believability.

As I've remarked before, you might as well theorize that Lemore is Lyanna Stark. There is the same amount of evidence -- and you wouldn't even have the problem with the color of her eyes.

[Kell]

What if... She is. Lyanna Stark ? And Aegon... actually not Aegon but Jon Snow twin brother ? :-)

Now that's a nice third one to ride the dragon ! Dany and her Twin Nephews ! Against Tyrion and his Twin Brothers. Let's start the mud battles.

[corbon]

I'm with Ran on this one. I'd like Lemore to be Ashara Dayne but there is simply no compelling evidence for that conjecture beyond her age being in the right range. Say what you want about Tyrion's capacity for observation but a failure to note "haunting violet eyes" is beyond believability. As I've remarked before, you might as well theorize that Lemore is Lyanna Stark. There is the same amount of evidence -- and you wouldn't even have the problem with the color of her eyes.

The circumstantial evidence is greater than just about any other thought or theory out there apart from R+L=J.

There is nowhere near the same evidence (basically, virtually none) ofr Lemore=Lyanna, let alone the evidence that Lyanna literally died in Ned's arms.

With the exception of eye colour (which would be a bright neon flashing sign shouting out Ashara Dayne to everyone, and therefore does provide a reason why GRRM might hide Tyrion noticing it - note that Tyrion might have noticed but not done so 'on screen', deliberately by GRRM, rather than just failing to notice) every single point of interest we know about Lemore can be traced/matched back in some way to Ashara. Hair colour, age, attractiveness/vivaciousness, stretch marks, swimming, secrets, Lady, connection to Connington and especially Aegon (each independently) and even religious vocation (which Ran has not yet acknowledged) all match Lemore with Ashara. Cumulatively it is a lot of circumstantial evidence.

Its difficult to think of a single thing we know about Ashara or Lemore that doesn't potentially connect the two together.

[Faint]

The circumstantial evidence is greater than just about any other thought or theory out there apart from R+L=J.

There is nowhere near the same evidence . . .

For a character that has barely been mentioned you sure seem to have a lot of preconceived notions about how Ashara Dayne looked and acted.

[7V3N]

Although this theory is very plausible, we have been given too little information about Ashara. We get Lyanna's story secondhand from Ned. Ashara's, we get info from rumors and distant sources.

Having said that, I would love for it to turn out to be Ashara. We know that GRRM has referenced her too often for her to not play a bigger role in the future of the series.

Has anyone thought that Lemore is Ashara Dayne AND Tyene's mother? We know that the Dorne is behind the Targs, and Oberyn traveled the world. Perhaps "her mother was a septa" refers to how she is currently a "septa" and that having the child was in a way an alliance. A marriage could not be done because of the need for secrecy, and to allow Oberyn to have other "child alliances." Perhaps Oberyn fathered children with women of different houses as secret alliances for the return of the dragon kings. This could mean that Dorne's plotting goes much deeper than we are shown, and that they already have a "spy" in with Aegon/YG. I don't think GRRM would give us the POV of Dornish nobels if it was just a bunch of shitty scheming. It could also mean that perhaps Quentyn's story had more to it. Quentyn's planned marriage to Dany could have been so that she already had a husband of Westeros (while also sealing the alliance) so she could not marry Aegon (there is no doubt in my mind that if she went to Westeros, she would scrap her marriage with Hizdahr to marry Aegon). It would be much harder to break a marriage with a noble of your kingdom than some foreign Ghiscari noble who means nothing to Westeros. This would free up Aegon for Arianne, and further strengthen the alliance and also put Dorne ahead of the rest of the kingdoms when the Targaryens were restored to the throne. :thumbsup:

And for those who will question the strength of a "child alliance"--kinslayers are cursed in the eyes of gods and men. To betray such an alliance, you would need to betray your child (who is sided with Dorne, since they only know their father Oberyn) and you may inadvertently kill your child. Also, we know from Cat and Cersei how much these crazy noble women are when it comes to keeping their children safe.

[Drinking Cersei's Tears]

Has anyone thought that Lemore is just some septa named Lemore?

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Has anyone thought that Lemore is just some septa named Lemore?

I hope this is the case. Sometimes a spade is a spade and we have enough people running around pretending to be someone else.

[Serie]

Has anyone thought that Lemore is just some septa named Lemore?

hahaha, I did actually, two days ago!!! cause I don't believe ashara is septa lemore so I was trying to find other candidates. In the end I was so confused and it just clicked. What if our beloved writer is that twisted (in a good way) so that he put a septa pose as a mysterious someone????